Gina Carano Fired from Star Wars: The Mandalorian

[Hierophant]

Just now, disillusioned said:

 

I'm sorry, I just don't see this.

 

Maybe things are drastically different where you live vs where I live, but as I said to TABA above, I don't know a single person who has been "cancelled". The only examples I know of are celebrities, and I'm afraid I just don't have much sympathy there. When literally nobody in my life is affected by something, I find it difficult to buy that its something I should be concerned about. That's all.

 

The reason it matter is because one day....it could be you. IMO, better to get ahead of this before it is completely out of control and everyone is getting the axe.

[disillusioned]

Just now, Hierophant said:

 

The reason it matter is because one day....it could be you. IMO, better to get ahead of this before it is completely out of control and everyone is getting the axe.

 

This just sounds like fearmongering to me. Yes, it could be me one day. I could also die of ebola. But since no one in my life has been affected by ebola, I'm not very worried about that either.

[Hierophant]

1 minute ago, disillusioned said:

 

This just sounds like fearmongering to me. Yes, it could be me one day. I could also die of ebola. But since no one in my life has been affected by ebola, I'm not very worried about that either.

 

Cancel culture and shit like this feed into each other - amazingly she wasn't fired. Nothing hurts profits like an employee who will not bend the knee to the woke mob:

 

https://nypost.com/2020/09/04/woman-harassed-by-blm-protesters-in-viral-video-still-supports-movement/

 

 

[TABA]

7 hours ago, disillusioned said:

Am I the only one who just doesn't think that "cancel culture" is really that big of a deal?

 

3 hours ago, disillusioned said:

So a journalist got fired for a stupid reason, and another quit her job. Why should I care?

 

3 hours ago, disillusioned said:

When literally nobody in my life is affected by something, I find it difficult to buy that it's something I should be concerned about.

I’m sure you don’t need to be concerned.  I’m sure neither you nor anybody close to you would ever say anything problematic that would be used against you.  Not now, not in the past when standards were different.  You don’t need to worry that words spoken today could be deemed offensive a few years from now.  You’re undoubtedly always sure to choose your words carefully.  I’m sure you’ll be fine. 

[◊ Krowb ◊]

Having lived through it long before it became known as "cancel culture" - it's a hellish experience.  Just checked and the facebook group dedicated to removing myself and a friend from our positions in student government as well as expelling us from school is finally gone.  That was a weird time and lots of stress.  Looking back on it I handled it well, but man alive the stress will eat you up.  My fraternity brothers would escort me to and from class and friends made sure I was never without a small group while on campus.  I'm thankful for all of them and it fortunately passed after significant dialogue.  Being tarred a racist and being threatened in both this life and the next is no joking matter.

It is far better to withhold judgment until all the facts are in.  In event the facts are as feared, it is often better to ignore and move on with your life rather than engage and stir up trouble for no good reason. The real antagonists dropped the issue once they won the election (as it was a politically motivated stretching of the truth compounded with falsehoods). The public facing antagonists found their group expelled for branding pledges.

 

If I don't like something I don't patronize it, simple as that.

[disillusioned]

31 minutes ago, TABA said:

I’m sure you don’t need to be concerned.  I’m sure neither you nor anybody close to you would ever say anything problematic that would be used against you.  Not now, not in the past when standards were different.  You don’t need to worry that words spoken today could be deemed offensive a few years from now.  You’re undoubtedly always careful to choose your words carefully.  I’m sure you’ll be fine. 

 

Well, I do try to choose my words carefully, but that's mostly beside the point. It's definitely possible that I might say something tomorrow which doesn't age well. This is neither here nor there.

 

I just don't see that this is actually a major cultural issue. I see a number of cases of famous people being "cancelled", quite often, though not always, for legitimate reasons. I see a handful of stories about more normal individuals getting fired etcetera for stupid reasons, but in the grand scheme of things, these seem to me to be mostly isolated incidents. Meanwhile, I hear people bitching and moaning about how this is a really serious problem, that society is doomed, and that this could happen to anyone at any time. But the fact of the matter is that no one that I know has been cancelled. I've never even heard a real-life account of someone who knows someone who was cancelled. It just doesn't seem to me to be a real problem for most people. It certainly isn't one here. I think it's basically just a manufactured issue. Again, maybe things are different where you live,  but that's how it is here.

 

So no, I'm not worried about this. Could it happen to me? Sure. But I have enough other actual problems to deal with. You are, obviously, quite free to feel differently.

[Joshpantera]

I don't know if this translates to a lot of other countries like Canada and others. It's a thing coming from an apparent minority here in the US. And it translates to pulling the statues down and all the BS we had going on through last summer. In addition to canceling actors and the rest. 

 

I never heard of statues coming down in Canada, but I think I did hear of some of this trend hitting northern Europe and I think England. But I don't remember the exact facts. It just seemed to me like the usual bandwagon effect of people mimicking abroad whatever looks trendy in the US. Californication and all of that. Our trends tend to reverberate around the globe - Blues, Jazz, Rock, Hollywood and similar.

 

Now it's cancel culture, yippie!!!!!

 

 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

When the started attacking Dr. Seuss, they went too far!

[Myrkhoos]

11 hours ago, disillusioned said:

 

So a journalist got fired for a stupid reason, and another quit her job. Why should I care?

 

People get fired all the time. Sometimes for good reasons, sometimes for bad reasons. If the fired party believes they were wrongfully dismissed, they are free to take it up in court. I just don't see that this is either new, or that big of a deal.

 

I don't know a single person who has actually been affected by "cancel culture". Not one. So again, why should I care?

1. I am sure that you might know noone affected by starvation. Or rape. Or war. Or slavery. Or....Do you only care about things that personally affect you and the small circle of people you know well? Really? So if you lived in the northern US states during pre civil war and dyring Jim Crow and nobody you knew was affected by racial slavery or segregation would you care? Would you care that in WW 1 and 2 nobody you knew was affected by the European wars? Or in the cold war by soviet dictatorship? And the list could go on and on... Should all of us care only of what happens to us and our small 50 ppl circle of aquaintances? Or maybe you don't know amyone with prostate cancer. Or lupus. Or drug addiction. Or schizophrenia. And the rest can burn? Now is that really your stance? Bk I really think it is not , to say the least, fruitful in the long term. 

2. Do you actually know the costs of suing a large organisation? Do you know how many trials against large entities are dropped by the plaintiff or never started because of fear of bankruptcy or harrasment? Do you that was and is the official policy of Scientology?  That scientology legally harrased the IRS into submission and accepting their tax exempt status. Do you know that most lawyers flat out refuse such cases except for massive amounts of pay and the ones that accept low pay are few and far between. Why do you think many low income ppl get the short end of the stick regarding justice? 

       You can read the articles of John Mcworther academic that says many of his colleagues are afraid to speak up in their universities. Smtimes like bret weistein bk of fear of violence. Andy Ngo had to move from Portland for fear of violence unchecked by the mayor or the governer. Rioters in many cities which destroyed properties but were mot affected.

       I believe the right was and is as much to fault for this as the left. It is not a left right issue. I mean Trump was easily one of the people that calls for the elimination of the voices of his enemies. There is only one diversity that truly matters and should be sought and, some times if the need is great, imposed. Diversity of views.

       It might not be so great now, but, like Covid, many ppl could give a rat s ass to a flu virus from China in sept or nov 2020. And here we are. You should stop this when it is fresh not when it gets big. Nip it in the bud.

      There is a problem with the media power owned by large entities be they cable or social media. A thing observed by Angela Merkel and president of Mexico to Glenn Greenwald ( someone I highly recommend on the issue). There is a problem with the enourmous financial and emotional and time toll of trials that makes bringing down large entities very hard for the commoner. See Harvey Weisten and his decades long streak. Jeffrey Epstein. Keith Raniere. Etc. 

    Like I said, I think anything remetely touching freedom of speech should spawn a strong social immune reaction bordering on overreaction. That wall must never be breached. That damn must be vehemently kept watertight, reinforced and repaired. Because I see as the foundation of a free society and its watchdog. It is well worth the risk. Progress without is is impossible as well as keeping age old tried values.

       

[Myrkhoos]

Plus, the most ironic thing about Christianity and blasphemy is that the utmost example of blasphemy in the Gospels - people mocking Jesus on the cross spawned only this response from the God man - Father , forgive them, for they know not what they are doing. The fact that the Christian Church had heretics burned at the stake and blasphemy punished when you have THAT example from your own founder just goes to show you the possibilities of cognitive dissonance and rationalisations.

          Also, in the Koran it clearly says - let there be no compulsion in religion, and however, they have death for apostasy laws in some Islamic dominant countries. And, even more ironic, imams that point this out and push for the Quran and freedom of religion ARE PERSECUTED - see Hassan al Malik in Saudi Arabia.  Hadith of the Apostate. Priority to Hadith or Qur'an? - Shaykh Hassan Farhan al-Maliki - YouTube  

       So let us not kid ourselves. Our species has demonstrated it tortures in the name of kindness, it kills in the name of love, it wages war in the name of peace, it conquers and oppresses in the name of liberty and lies in the name of Truth. The fact that people who nominally stand for equality would discriminate and eliminate people from the public discourse is just actually a very small fry compared to the big fishes or even wales of human justification of everything in the name of its actual, demonstrable opposite. 

[disillusioned]

Myrkhoos,

 

I don't think we're likely to end up agreeing here, so I'll be brief. However, you put a couple of direct questions to me, which I will answer.

 

Quote

 

1. I am sure that you might know noone affected by starvation. Or rape. Or war. Or slavery. Or....Do you only care about things that personally affect you and the small circle of people you know well?

 

As a matter of fact, I know people who have been affected by all of these things, and I've heard in-person accounts of all the other issues you listed later in your post. These are among what I was referring to when I said I have enough actual problems to worry about. Also, I wasn't talking about my circle of friends. I was talking about everyone that I interact with. Due to my profession, it's not a small group. I see your larger question though, so let me address that: do I only care about issues if they affect me? Well, there's caring and caring. Do I care that I can only buy cheap clothing because children are exploited in the developing world? Yes, but I don't lose a lot of sleep over it. Nor, I'd hazard, do you. It is natural for humans to care about that which affects them.

 

So I'll say it again: I agree that some people have been fired for stupid reasons. But I'm not that worried about it.

 

Quote

 

2. Do you actually know the costs of suing a large organisation? (And follow-up questions)

 

       

 

Yes, I'm aware of this. This is what unbridled capitalism gets you. Large corporations which are essentially above the law. That is an actual societal problem. I'm slightly more worried about this one, but it isn't that high on my list either.

 

Earlier in this thread @TABA posted a clip from Bill Maher inviting everyone to join him for "chill the fuck out month". I haven't agreed with much of what Bill has been on about recently, but I do agree with this. There are too many issues that we are supposed to constantly give a shit about. It's too much. People need to chill the fuck out. We can't care about everything, all the time. This "cancel culture" narrative is one of the things that I just don't particularly care about. That's all.

[Joshpantera]

4 hours ago, Myrkhoos said:

So let us not kid ourselves. Our species has demonstrated it tortures in the name of kindness, it kills in the name of love, it wages war in the name of peace, it conquers and oppresses in the name of liberty and lies in the name of Truth. The fact that people who nominally stand for equality would discriminate and eliminate people from the public discourse is just actually a very small fry compared to the big fishes or even wales of human justification of everything in the name of its actual, demonstrable opposite. 

 

This is it in a nut shell. 

 

The tendency to people heard often comes in the form of opposites. This usually results from over zealousness for a given cause. A good example would be ex christians turning rabid in the process of trying to be free from christianity and seeking to enslave christians as it plays out. These things can easily happen.

 

But if people draw a line in the sand concerning extremes, well, it all could be easily avoided. Only extreme position taking renders the demonstrable opposites. 

[florduh]

All I know about "cancel culture" is now I have to check Facebook every day to see which businesses I'm supposed to be boycotting. It's tedious. 

 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

3 minutes ago, florduh said:

All I know about "cancel culture" is now I have to check Facebook every day to see which businesses I'm supposed to be boycotting. It's tedious. 

 

Dude, you're supposed to be boycotting Facebook this week because some of their users promote studying history and shit.

[Hierophant]

I forget where I read it, but apparently somebody has the bright idea that history should not be taught as it really happened because it is too triggering. How does someone who gets triggered from history class even survive in this world?

[florduh]

4 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Dude, you're supposed to be boycotting Facebook this week because some of their users promote studying history and shit.

You have posed quite a dilemma for me now. No Facebook then. Would YOU mind telling me what to think and do? Please?

[TheRedneckProfessor]

36 minutes ago, florduh said:

You have posed quite a dilemma for me now. No Facebook then. Would YOU mind telling me what to think and do? Please?

Let me check my Instagram and I'll get back to you.  No Parler tricks, though; I promise.

[florduh]

21 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Let me check my Instagram and I'll get back to you.  No Parler tricks, though; I promise.

Hurry up. Tik-Tok - time's a wasting.

[TheRedneckProfessor]

1 hour ago, florduh said:

Hurry up. Tik-Tok - time's a wasting.

Hey, I'm just the Messenger.  WhatsApp with trying to rush me?  What say WeChat about this, man?

[florduh]

6 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Hey, I'm just the Messenger.  WhatsApp with trying to rush me?  What say WeChat about this, man?

I didn't mean to cause any Discord.

[LogicalFallacy]

This exchange is too good

 

[Joshpantera]

2 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Hey, I'm just the Messenger.  WhatsApp with trying to rush me?  What say WeChat about this, man?

 

Then it went up another notch! 

 

2 hours ago, florduh said:

I didn't mean to cause any Discord.

 

Well that just fell into place! 

[Joshpantera]

9 hours ago, Hierophant said:

I forget where I read it, but apparently somebody has the bright idea that history should not be taught as it really happened because it is too triggering. How does someone who gets triggered from history class even survive in this world?

 

History is one of the few classes that I paid attention to. I couldn't give two shits about most subjects. But I thought history was interesting. I do remember getting pissed off about historical events. Where injustices were carried out. But it never crossed my mind that they should be wiped out and never spoken of again. That's a pretty bizarre take away. 

 

I understand the attitude of screw these people who stole land from natives, enslaved people, launched inquisitions, witch trials, etc., etc. Sure, screw those idiots. But they stand as lessons learned, don't they? They serve a purpose.

 

I was talking to some guys on a construction site the other day about how I've come up in business over the years. The big secret is that I learned far more about what NOT to do from watching former employer's than what TO do. A whole lot of what not to do mixed in with a little bit of what to do. And based my own efforts on avoiding their failures. 

 

Imagine if we didn't have the Salem Witch trials to reflect on, for instance? 

 

Or if we erased the memory of slavery, so that newer generations were free to get the bright idea of taking it up again? 

 

Or the memory of bigotry and extreme racial prejudice?

 

I wonder what would happen if we blank slated history? Would it naturally start to repeat itself? It's an interesting consideration. I do see the potential for that scenario. 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

3 hours ago, florduh said:

I didn't mean to cause any Discord.

I'll pour us both a Tumblr of whiskey as a gesture of peace.