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Those moved by the "Holy Spirit."


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Once again I was forced to listen to a young women speak about her experience with God and seeing heaven. Since im 3% more stable in my deconstruction process (though I complain a lot) I was left with a more satisfied response towards her story. 

 

I don't however know the title of the video, It was played on an aux cord in a car. But I'll try to be descriptive as possible. 

 

I lost my faith in Christianity fully because it didn't make sense historically/scientifically and the prophecies were all over the place. But the only reason why I would turn back is because of the spiritual side of it. 

 

Like how people hear God, "see him." He shows them visions of the future etc. I always felt like there wasn't a good explanation for it because atheists would reply with "its a brain thing." 

 

So this young british/African women shares her story about God taking her out of her body, her taking his hand and him taking her to heaven. (*cough* *cough* sounds like astral projection) And she goes on and on about how lovely God.

 

Lady? I get it, she didn't have to go on about for 85 minutes and it as starting to irritate me but one part caught my attention. 

 

She said God told her to write all this information down specifically so that nothing gets messed up and people can understand her. 

 

Oh the irony, meanwhile complete historical evidence for the bible is yet to be found. 

 

Meanwhile you have simple contradictions to extreme contradictions.

 

Meanwhile you have the bible copying from other older mythical stories. 

 

Meanwhile you have the bible being translated and stolen to the point where there probably isn't any real christianity left. 

 

Now she also said that there were two doors connecting heaven and hell which I thought was odd because once again the description of heaven sounds altered. (I also didn't watch the full video so I didn't listen to everything she said.) 

 

Though, I'm pretty sure if you listen to "I saw heaven" videos theres going to be some inconsistenty. 

 

Speaking of I saw heaven videos I forgot sheol ever existed in the bible. So, if sheol was the original hell then when people die why don't they see sheol? 

 

Anyways. She also said that worshipping God makes him very happy, he told her himself. Which I also thought was funny because I remember my decaying old pastor telling me that God doesn't need our worship but it helps us to be saved. 

 

Not sure why a "benevolent" Being would want to be worshiped but not only that be happy. I'm not saying god shouldn't be happy that people "love." Him (for not making them suffer) but I still don't think a benevolent God would demand worship or care. 

 

Anyways, any reason as to why the young women might have astral projected or whatever it is. I know some kids have a strong connection to the spiritual realm. 

 

My sister saw my dead grandma when we were young, and unlike her the only spiritual thing I've ever gotten at a young age was having a nightmare about God destroying the world. 

 

Her experiences isn't just limited to christianity though I've heard other spiritual people who've had strange encounters and saw all the galaxies that ever existed or something. 

 

But I'm always skeptical because that's what religious influence does to you. 

 

But according to spirituality when you die you go wherever you think youre gonna go. Hence why some people see heaven, hell, nothing, their ancestors etc. 

 

Also my mom makes me incredibly skeptical when she claims she talks to God its all sounds self motivated when she tells me what she hears. 

 

Point being. A lot of Christians claim they hear the voice of God or feel his holy precense is this caused by something in the brain or is it more of a spiritual matter. Does that mean I'm going to hell? I don't know. I'm not that smart.

 

Does this make christianity credible? Im aware other religions say the same thing but why does it seem like christianity says it the most. 

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Keep in mind also that different flavors of Christianity don't believe that anyone ever hears from God anymore. Baptists, Presbyterians, and most "high" church denominations believe the Bible is either closed (meaning no more miracles, revelations, prophecies, or anything else because the Bible is supposed to be perfect *snert*) or that God has chosen to stop openly communicating. I had a pastor kicked out of a congregation for saying that "God told me that for Easter we should gather all the churches as one in the stadium and then give the offering to charity". 1, they had a hissy fit over him claiming God still talks to anyone and 2, they didn't want to lose the money that comes in when all the unbelievers go to church on Easter. 1 and 2 may be reversed. 

 

Our minds are rather incredibly good at generating virtual reality in our dreams so that we can seem to live other lives, interact with people who have died, interact with other kinds of beings, see atomic explosions or impossibly colorful skies, on and on and on. When we program ourselves with Christianity, we tend to see dreams that echo those things that seem important. I had repeating dreams of a mountain that held the presence of god. It was such a feeling of intense wonder and love, but it was a dream, never happens in reality. I had dreams of angels descending or glowing and swooping in to take me in the rapture, but only in dreams, not in reality. I've had lots of dreams that were horrible and not directly related to Christianity, just from watching too many scary movies as a kid. Other dreams were just about nothing in particular, but I still have had thousands of them that I can remember. All of them are just our minds processing information, and our conscious mind happens to recall some of them. Christians look for any tidbit or breadcrumbs that seem to reinforce their unfortunate beliefs in fables. I was an "on-fire" believer for 30 years and finding out it was not true was such a slap in the face, and I've had many dreams now where my mind is processing all those beliefs now that I know they aren't true. Sometimes I'll be talking with someone about the beliefs, other times I face "spirits" and instead of trying to use Jesus, I have to understand what is actually happening. It is all my mind trying to figure out how to really respond to things instead of believing in religion. 

 

If you are able, stop taking in the hogwash of religion. When they say Jesus, think about if they were talking about Spiderman and all he's done for us to protect us from crime. It really is that silly and sad that grown people are so gullible. I was, and may still have beliefs that should be questioned. I hope I see through them before I'm done. 

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23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

But the only reason why I would turn back is because of the spiritual side of it.

You can have a spiritual life without religion. I'd even go so far as to say that religion inhibits a true spiritual life. Religion is all about following rules, conformity, punishment, and depending on something external to yourself to save you/guide you. There is nothing spiritual about that.

23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

her story about God taking her out of her body, her taking his hand and him taking her to heaven. (*cough* *cough* sounds like astral projection)

It does. Also keep in mind that there are a lot of people who are comfortable using the word God without equating it to the Christian god of the bible. Rather, to them its synonymous to the Universe or Source or Divine.

23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

Not sure why a "benevolent" Being would want to be worshiped

It doesn't make any sense, does it?

 

23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

any reason as to why the young women might have astral projected or whatever it is.

I've never astral projected, but I've read a lot about it and listened to many people who claim they regularly astral project. Pretty much all "experts" in this space maintain that everyone is capable of astral projection. That being said, It does seem to come more easily to some people than others. From what I can tell, no one's figured out why. Regardless, they maintain that if astral projection is something you really want to do, you can train yourself. It's just like any other learnable skill.

 

23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

Also my mom makes me incredibly skeptical when she claims she talks to God its all sounds self motivated when she tells me what she hears. 

I always have to chime in when I hear stuff like this. Are the things she hears from God trying to control or influence your thoughts/actions or manipulate you or make you feel guilty? Be very discerning.

 

23 hours ago, ReducedtoAtoms said:

Does that mean I'm going to hell?

No.

The answer to this question is ALWAYS no.

 

 

 

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On 3/25/2021 at 5:44 AM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

 

My sister saw my dead grandma when we were young, and unlike her the only spiritual thing I've ever gotten at a young age was having a nightmare about God destroying the world.

 

Does this make christianity credible? Im aware other religions say the same thing but why does it seem like christianity says it the most. 

 How much have you been exposed to other religions?.Go to Benin Africa and you will witness much more stories about vodoo. In Saudi Arabia Islam. And the list can go on. You live in christian cukture country and speak English a christian culture language. It is very possible you are not exposed to other religions as much as Christianity. If you spoke Bengali and lived in north west india maybe you would think shakti is the one you hear the most. 

    Idk what these exp mean but visions drrams trances are very common worldwide.

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On 3/25/2021 at 11:15 PM, TheDeconvertedMan said:

You can have a spiritual life without religion. I'd even go so far as to say that religion inhibits a true spiritual life. Religion is all about following rules, conformity, punishment, and depending on something external to yourself to save you/guide you. There is nothing spiritual about that.

It does. Also keep in mind that there are a lot of people who are comfortable using the word God without equating it to the Christian god of the bible. Rather, to them its synonymous to the Universe or Source or Divine.

It doesn't make any sense, does it?

 

I've never astral projected, but I've read a lot about it and listened to many people who claim they regularly astral project. Pretty much all "experts" in this space maintain that everyone is capable of astral projection. That being said, It does seem to come more easily to some people than others. From what I can tell, no one's figured out why. Regardless, they maintain that if astral projection is something you really want to do, you can train yourself. It's just like any other learnable skill.

 

I always have to chime in when I hear stuff like this. Are the things she hears from God trying to control or influence your thoughts/actions or manipulate you or make you feel guilty? Be very discerning.

 

No.

The answer to this question is ALWAYS no.

 

 

 

Late response, I actually had an I guess astral projection like experience not to long ago, all I did was stare at myself. No God coming towards me, no demons entering through my walls. It was extremely peaceful.

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I read an article about neuroscientists stimulating particular areas of the brain to induce “out-of-body experiences” and other hallucinations. Our brains are capable of wacky stuff. I’ll try to find the link to the article.

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15 minutes ago, LostinParis said:

I read an article about neuroscientists stimulating particular areas of the brain to induce “out-of-body experiences” and other hallucinations. Our brains are capable of wacky stuff. I’ll try to find the link to the article.

One of the Horsemen (I can't remember now which) said something about a part of the brain, which, when stimulated, would usually produce religious experiences that were in keeping with the person's cultural environment, even if the person wasn't religious.  So, an American agnostic might still "see" jesus, while a Vietnamese atheist might "see" Quan The Am Bo Tat.

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5 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

One of the Horsemen (I can't remember now which) said something about a part of the brain, which, when stimulated, would usually produce religious experiences that were in keeping with the person's cultural environment, even if the person wasn't religious.  So, an American agnostic might still "see" jesus, while a Vietnamese atheist might "see" Quan The Am Bo Tat.

 

My exposure to Vietnamese culture doesn't extend much beyond phở, bánh mi and sweet, strong coffee, but when I saw the name Quan The Am Bo Tat I knew immediately that it was the Vietnamese name for my all-time favourite Bodhisattva Guanyin. :wub:  I'd be more likely to see her, too.

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On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

I lost my faith in Christianity fully because it didn't make sense historically/scientifically and the prophecies were all over the place. But the only reason why I would turn back is because of the spiritual side of it. 

 

Science, history and theology and Bible translation are all imperfect endeavors of mankind. Personally I have no faith whatsoever in any of that. Especially Christianity. The apostle Paul foretold the apostasy of Christianity at 2 Timothy 4:4. There he used the Greek mythos (myth) later translated into the Latin fabulas (fables). The Bible also warned that we should test the inspired expression (spirit; Greek pneuma from which comes the English pneumatic and pneumonia also translated wind, breath, mental inclination). So spirituality, from spirit meaning an invisible active force which produces visible results, 

should be used cautiously. (1 John 4:1-4)

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

Like how people hear God, "see him." He shows them visions of the future etc. I always felt like there wasn't a good explanation for it because atheists would reply with "its a brain thing." 

 

I agree with the atheists. God doesn't do that for anyone in any time, he did it in a relatively brief period of time for a specific reason. (1 Corinthians 13:8) To inform the people in the writing of the Bible. We have the imperfect translation of that which we use as a tool. 

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

Oh the irony, meanwhile complete historical evidence for the bible is yet to be found. 

 

Complete historical evidence? There is no such thing. Unless you mean the history Napoleon Bonaparte referred to as an agreed upon set of lies. Anyway you don't need that. Jehovah gives each of us the choice of accepting or rejecting him. If you are interested in making an informed choice then you should take history with a sizable portion of salt. 

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

Meanwhile you have simple contradictions to extreme contradictions.

 

I would be willing to discuss these alleged contradictions if you are interested in doing that.

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

Meanwhile you have the bible copying from other older mythical stories. 

 

I don't think that is a very compelling argument.  A similar account from a later source doesn't negate the account nor necessarily imply one copied from another. According to Bible chronology Adam was created in 4026 BCE. 2370-2369 the global flood. Noah's grandson Nimrod builds the tower at Babel in 2239. Peleg lived during the division of people through confusion of their language from 2269-2030. Moses didn't begin writing Genesis until 1513. 

 

How many hundreds of years did the older mythical stories have to spread throughout the globe from 2239 until 1513? 726. Nimrod was the Sumerian king Dumuzi, known in the Bible as Tammuz. His symbol was the mystic tau, the modern day cross. Flood myths and crosses are found all over the globe in different cultures separated geographically. That is how it works. 

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

Meanwhile you have the bible being translated and stolen to the point where there probably isn't any real christianity left. 

 

Correct. 

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

Now she also said that there were two doors connecting heaven and hell which I thought was odd because once again the description of heaven sounds altered. (I also didn't watch the full video so I didn't listen to everything she said.) 

 

I don't see any reason to conclude that.

 

On 3/24/2021 at 11:44 PM, ReducedtoAtoms said:

 

Though, I'm pretty sure if you listen to "I saw heaven" videos theres going to be some inconsistenty. 

 

Speaking of I saw heaven videos I forgot sheol ever existed in the bible. So, if sheol was the original hell then when people die why don't they see sheol? 

 

See sheol? There isn't consciousness in sheol. In a metaphoric sense they see it in that they are there. 

 

 

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Most humans are capable of meditation.  Whilst in meditation (alteted state) your imagination can run away with you and you can have a sensation of being out of body too.

Don't forget epilepsy, bipolar mania or schizophrenic hallucinations.  I've had extraordinary bipolar manic experiences and meditation related experiences and can tell you amazing stories.

It is all created by the brain.

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On 6/13/2021 at 1:27 PM, SerenelyBlue said:

Most humans are capable of meditation.  Whilst in meditation (alteted state) your imagination can run away with you and you can have a sensation of being out of body too.

Don't forget epilepsy, bipolar mania or schizophrenic hallucinations.  I've had extraordinary bipolar manic experiences and meditation related experiences and can tell you amazing stories.

It is all created by the brain.

 

I'm not sure who you were talking to here but you make an excellent point. NDE, hypnotism, and drugs. I would add that from a spiritual perspective that these altered states can be chemical reactions of the brain but they can also be associated with demonic interference. In other words, the altered states you mentioned can be those sort of practical experiences but they can also take one to or can be induced by demonic influence. 

 

Let's say, for example, that someone sees a ghost. Several people, in fact. They say that the place they allegedly saw the ghost, or spirit, if you will, was near an ancient Indian burial ground and the spirit of the dead Indians are pissed. They may have witnessed apparitions dressed in clothes from a specific time. 

 

The people could just be carried away by their own imaginations. Or they could be mislead by demons. Lets say you do some research and find the only Indians living there didn't bury their dead near water and the place in question was, oh, let's say, 112 Ocean Ave.  Amityville, Long Island. The fact that the story doesn't add up doesn't necessarily mean the people are making it up. It could mean that, but it could also mean they are being deceived. 

 

Like Saul and the witch of En-dor. 

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1 hour ago, SemmelweisReflex said:

The people could just be carried away by their own imaginations. Or they could be mislead by demons.

Well, this makes perfect sense . . . for someone living in the 16th century.  

 

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2 hours ago, freshstart said:

Well, this makes perfect sense . . . for someone living in the 16th century.  

 

 

You really like to think . . . no, need to think . . . that has changed a great deal. They may not have had cell phones but at least they didn't need GPS to get around and their plagues were real, not propaganda. 

 

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If you spend too much time researching the bible you may start to believe that demons are real instead of just your imagination. You may develop a bible addiction or bible obsessive compulsive disorder. 

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4 minutes ago, midniterider said:

If you spend too much time researching the bible you may start to believe that demons are real instead of just your imagination. You may develop a bible addiction or bible obsessive compulsive disorder. 

 

And if I spend too much time researching evolution I will start to believe that ape men are real as well? Oh, dear. Which is worse? 

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45 minutes ago, midniterider said:

The baseless demonic influence idea is worse. 

 

Subjective. Both are useful to some. Misunderstood and misrepresented by many.  

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18 hours ago, SemmelweisReflex said:

You really like to think . . . no, need to think . . . that has changed a great deal. They may not have had cell phones but at least they didn't need GPS to get around and their plagues were real, not propaganda. 

 
I really enjoyed this response. Its empowering to know that, yes indeed, just as I suspected, many of the "doctrinally sound" Christians truly do align with thinking from the dark ages. They also shun science while simultaneously enjoying the benefits of science (unless of course they've never taken a medication, used transportation, or a computer,or purchased goods of any sort, or. . . oh lets just say lived as a modern-day human).

Thank you SR, and I mean this very sincerely, for confirming again and again why becoming an atheist is one of the healthiest things that ever happened for me. Your posts have put a spotlight on the literal medeival thinking that underpins Christianity. It is exactly this line of thinking that opened my eyes to the truth. In a strange way, you are indeed, spreading the truth of Christianity here!

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