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There is a creator. You will never convince me otherwise. I'm here because I'm done hoping for goodness. I may crawl back to him since there's no alternative. These are parameters I'll converse in, please keep it there. I'm not here to argue or sway.


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On 9/16/2021 at 7:25 AM, Guest blah said:

So, I know there is a creator.  D.N.A. is more than just words, it is highly complex, 3 dimensional, multi-coded and communicative microscopic matter that uses matter to shape highly designed animate objects.  This must be formed in an instant.  It is in all things living, even the so-called simplest forms.  It is not like a cake that can be made over the course of a few hours, or an engine for an automobile that can be fashioned over a period of time.  Every single bit of the millions upon multiplied millions of instructions and capability to perform said instruction must be altogether at once, or it all falls apart fast.   There are many other things that point to design and GREAT intellect and power, but this is one of the most overlooked facts that living beings are ignorant of or choose to mud-over.

 

So, those of you that want to tell me there is no god, please, don't.  I notice that many claim there is no god out of some rationality, which I respect, but emphatically do not agree with.  I believe that many that think there is no god are smarter than I.  I am not here for that exercise or lesson.

 

I am here because no matter how much I ask or beg him or try to believe the good parts of his word or try to do his will, my life and this world do not seem to match up with being cared for by a god that loves me so much he would pay the price for all my sin -Forgetting the fact that he allowed or caused me to be born in sin.  I don't mean that to say my actions are not my responsibility, I mean that if I am conscious of my sin, understand why they would be a sin, and try not to do them knowing that the price for them can only be paid for and forgiven by said god, why do I not even 'feel' loved by him who loved me so much he died for me, yet won't even say hi.  Yes there are times when you can enjoy the wonder and marvel of it all, but it is fleeting and not enough to trust in for eternity.

 

god in his word, makes comparisons about how much more he loves us than an earthly father does, yet children get hit by cars frequently.  Any earthly human that claims to be a father would make every effort to stop that from happening, forget free will.  A father would break his own bones and maybe some of his child's to knock them out of the way of a car.  My problem is I know that the god that made just d.n.a., nevermind the universe, has the power to do this.  Unless he is diminished in power, then his claim to good fatherhood is null.  Yes there is a verse for everything in the bible, like 'in this world you will have trials and sorrows,' but to me that is just a long list of things that maybe even god himself just said to cover everything.

 

To be clear, I want goodness, and have totally admitted I need salvation, and will go so far as to say that god is the only alternative and I don't want to burn in hell.  It just really seems like maybe god didn't get the whole picture by 'ALL KNOWING observation and being sort of human for 33 years.

 

Oddly enough, I am here for help with this, since I am honestly seeking it.  If you attempt to help, not hurt, remember, you WILL NOT convince me there is no god.

 

Well Blah,

 

You'll never get undeniable evidence there is no God whatsoever.  One reason I keep myself open to the possibility. But you have already seen that the biblical God isn't a mirror image of the biblical description. The Bible says anything you ask in my name it shall be granted. That's a promise right? But I've seen countless unanswered prayers that end up getting pushed off as it must not have been in God's plan or I guess I had doubt when I prayed. Blah blah blah. But thats not what the Bible reflects. What about faith as a mustard seed? Mustard seeds are super small. Giving the perception that even if you doubt just as long as you have a little faith your prayer will get through. 

     Your concept of sin comes from the Bible. Sin in the Bible us based on ancient beliefs. Specific ancient beliefs of a very strict people. I believe that if you follow the golden rule then your good. Premarital sex isn't Sin its nature. Being gay isn't Sin, it's preference. Drinking isn't Sin but can be bad if you become an addict. The Bible never says anything about cocain, opium, marijuana, or meth because they weren't used like they are now. One example how the Bible is based on ancient peoples beliefs and not some all knowing God. If the biblical God was all knowing then those drugs should be in there right? 

 

The bottom line is. I won't tell your or try to convince you there is no God. But I will tell you that beyond a shadow of a doubt if there is a God it isn't the biblical God. The Bible fails in all points. Just because a large portion of the world's population believes in it doesn't mean that it isn't a myth. 2000 years ago most the world was convinced there were multiple Gods in some form or another. You wouldn't argue that those beliefs were fact, right? Then why think that any belief is true? Maybe God is just God and we simple minded humans have just always made up stories that made sense at the time. According to what their EXTREMELY uneducated minds could comprehend. 

 

DB

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On 9/16/2021 at 12:34 PM, midniterider said:

If his claim to good fatherhood is null, is he worthy of praise? If he allows innocents to suffer or die, is he worthy of praise? If he 'loves' us but never communicates, is he worthy of praise? Why or or why not?

 

Exactly!

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It seems blah may have taken offense at our responses and telling him he was unreasonable and has thus kindly fucked off. Oh well. Truth hurts bitches.

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The very premise is unreasonable. How could could any of this exist (DNA and all) if a supernatural god didn't create it?

 

That's the foundational level of the theistic presupposition. To wrongly assume that there's only one way existence could be as such, when, there's not only one way in reality. And of a given option of ways to consider, the supernatural way has the least going for it. To then double down and proclaim that you're shut off to exploring any other way is very unreasonable. If some one never considers or comprehends these points, leaves christianity, and then returns because they think there's no other alternative, then they've shot themselves in the foot. Crawling back to untruths for no good reason because the person in question is that unreasonable from the outset. 

 

People have to want it. They have to analyze the issues with an open mind. If they want to get anywhere in the process of trying to seek out truths. It requires engaging the debates. Reading and learning. Challenging claims. And intellectual honestly. 

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3 hours ago, Joshpantera said:

People have to want it. They have to analyze the issues with an open mind. If they want to get anywhere in the process of trying to seek out truths. It requires engaging the debates. Reading and learning. Challenging claims. And intellectual honestly. 

 

Challenging your own fear-based indoctrination is difficult. And I think that could be where he's at. His mind understands that bible god aint that great, but his emotional side wont allow him to have the thought 'god is fiction'. 

 

He was in a rush to get his account cancelled, like maybe God wont know he's been here? 

 

Sure he can crawl back and 'pretend' to love Jesus... Jesus, his emotional jailer. I hope he asks Jesus some hard questions, though. I think everyone here was helpful. Whether he likes it or not, he has some food for thought. And if logic can eat through the beliefs of the 'Almighty' and produce nonbelievers, what's that say about the weakness of Jesus and faith?

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I'm not sure why Christians find it unacceptable to sincerely call God out on stuff that makes no sense if he were in control and cared about us. Just sincerely ask him why? And when there is no answer they have to make up something about why there is no answer.  

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32 minutes ago, midniterider said:

I'm not sure why Christians find it unacceptable to sincerely call God out on stuff that makes no sense if he were in control and cared about us. Just sincerely ask him why? And when there is no answer they have to make up something about why there is no answer.  

In a world that recognizes facts and logic, their position is untenable. Creating alternate realities is the only way people who are demonstrably wrong can hold on to their misinformation as Truth. The phenomenon is also found in other areas besides religion.

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6 minutes ago, florduh said:

In a world that recognizes facts and logic, their position is untenable. Creating alternate realities is the only way people who are demonstrably wrong can hold on to their misinformation as Truth. The phenomenon is also found in other areas besides religion.

 

Such as the JW's stringing along a false prediction for the end of the world in the early 20th century. And similar. Where the alternative reality becomes a "spiritual" event. Even though it had been claimed as a physical, literal event before hand when the claims were being made. The claim became untenable. But they had to try and hold on to their misinformation as truth in some way. And kick the can down the road further. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, midniterider said:

I'm not sure why Christians find it unacceptable to sincerely call God out on stuff that makes no sense if he were in control and cared about us. Just sincerely ask him why? And when there is no answer they have to make up something about why there is no answer.  

 

You are taught from an early age that God is perfect, and knows all.

And, that faith and trust in God is everything, that unquestioning loyal faith separates believers, you know, Real Christians (tm) from non-believers.

 

Then as part of the same faith you are taught that Noah built a wooden ship and brought on board two of each animal on earth. And that Abraham received verbal recitation from God on the creation of the earth, and the events in the Garden of Eden.

 

And that Abraham then recorded those events using a written language so early and primitive that it was the equivalent of stone-age cave paintings but etched with a sharp stick on clay tablets.

 

But with that he was able to record all that detail, including exactly how the earth was spoken into being, and the parts about Eve and the magic talking snake.

 

 

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4 hours ago, midniterider said:

I'm not sure why Christians find it unacceptable to sincerely call God out on stuff that makes no sense if he were in control and cared about us. Just sincerely ask him why?

 

1 hour ago, alreadyGone said:

 

You are taught from an early age that God is perfect, and knows all.

And, that faith and trust in God is everything, that unquestioning loyal faith separates believers, you know, Real Christians (tm) from non-believers.

There's also that whole thing in the book of Job where god shows up in the midst of a hurricane to berate Job for having the audacity to wonder why his health had failed him, his livelihood had disappeared, and all of his kids had died horrifically excruciating deaths. 

 

Because, you know, you weren't there when god held the ocean waters in the palm of his hand and created the leviathan.  Seriously, god comes off as a petty and insecure middle manager whose wife just left him for a Chippendale and whose car is being repossessed in the parking lot even as we speak, gathered around the water cooler in the break room.  

 

Hey, god, that Hair Club for Men shit ain't working; and that's the same necktie you've worn 3 days in a row now.  

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On 9/18/2021 at 4:01 AM, Guest blah said:

anyone know how to cancel account?  have contacted admin, and can't seem to find the option

You should stay and have some conversations, it seems you came, posted , didn’t like what you read, so ran.

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3 hours ago, Darklady said:

You should stay and have some conversations, it seems you came, posted , didn’t like what you read, so ran.

 

You can tell when they start off like this...

There is a creator. You will never convince me otherwise. I'm here because I'm done hoping for goodness. I may crawl back to him since there's no alternative. These are parameters I'll converse in, please keep it there. I'm not here to argue or sway.

 

 

 
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On 9/16/2021 at 3:18 PM, Astreja said:

.. In particular, I find the god of the Bible to be a totally inept, inconsistent character whose behaviours betray the ignorance and personal agendas of the mortals who wrote the Bible stories.  ...

 

So very worth repeating.

 

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