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Goodbye Jesus

Austin Austin and Evolution


DarkBishop

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8 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

the absence of life is death.

Does life cease to exist simply because there is death?  

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Austin,

 

As I've given the consideration to the existence of God as I have in the days since I transitioned into apostasy, I had no choice but to decide that at best I could not know if there is in fact a God, a sovereign creator of the universe.

 

But I decided that if there were, it may be that he is as the deists believe, a creator who then takes no further notice of we mere mortals.

And I had to find peace in the belief that if I'm wrong and there is a God, he would know what I've experienced and why I now believe as I do.

And allow me to die in peace, to slip from life into non-life without further involvement on his part.

 

The belief in eternal punishment is not a universal belief among all the sects which believe in God. The Jews, believed by Christians to be the chosen of God have no belief in hell or eternal punishment.

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

Austin,

 

As I've given the consideration to the existence of God as I have in the days since I transitioned into apostasy, I had no choice but to decide that at best I could not know if there is in fact a God, a sovereign creator of the universe.

 

But I decided that if there were, it may be that he is as the deists believe, a creator who then takes no further notice of we mere mortals.

And I had to find peace in the belief that if I'm wrong and there is a God, he would know what I've experienced and why I now believe as I do.

And allow me to die in peace, to slip from life into non-life without further involvement on his part.

 

The belief in eternal punishment is not a universal belief among all the sects which believe in God. The Jews, believed by Christians to be the chosen of God have no belief in hell or eternal punishment.

 

 

 

 

God tells you what awaits you, that Existence Exists proves taht there must be a Creator, and He has given you sufficient proof.

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8 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

Do you accept that you will die, and that you will find out if God is real or not?

 

I accept that when I die, if I am wrong and there is a God, he may or may not judge me for my non-belief as you believe he will do.

 

The alternate belief is that if when I die I learn that I'm wrong and am confronted by God, he will understand how I came to believe as I do now, that there is no God.

 

I do not know.

I have not claimed to know if there is, or is not a God.

I simply no longer believe. I can no longer believe. That belief left me, suddenly. I would not have believed that this was possible in believing for the great majority of my years. It just happened. There were circumstances which took that belief away.

 

Afterward, when I accepted that I could no longer believe, it was only then that I could ask of myself some of the questions I've asked of you.

Prior to that time, I hid from those questions.

 

It isn't easy Austin, when that happens. Most here at Ex-Christian had similar experience with the pain and shock of losing that belief.

And that I believe is something you fail to understand about many or perhaps most of the members here.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

God tells you what awaits you, that Existence Exists proves taht there must be a Creator, and He has given you sufficient proof.

Oh, Thor!  He's gone from "logic proves god's existence" to "existence proves god's existence."  After trying to convince us that we can't even prove existence.  This is becoming more shiteously enfuckinated with each post.  Where's my ban hammer?

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5 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

 

I accept that when I die, if I am wrong and there is a God, he may or may not judge me for my non-belief as you believe he will do.

 

The alternate belief is that if when I die I learn that I'm wrong and am confronted by God, he will understand how I came to believe as I do now, that there is no God.

 

I do not know.

I have not claimed to know if there is, or is not a God.

I simply no longer believe. I can no longer believe. That belief left me, suddenly. I would not have believed that this was possible in believing for the great majority of my years. It just happened. There were circumstances which took that belief away.

 

Afterward, when I accepted that I could no longer believe, it was only then that I could ask of myself some of the questions I've asked of you.

Prior to that time, I hid from those questions.

 

It isn't easy Austin, when that happens. Most here at Ex-Christian had similar experience with the pain and shock of losing that belief.

And that I believe is something you fail to understand about many or perhaps most of the members here.

 

 

Could you believe that your mother never existed? It's the same with God.

 

Feelings lie, GOd says the heart is sick... 

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5 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

God tells you what awaits you, that Existence Exists proves taht there must be a Creator, and He has given you sufficient proof.

 

I respect that you believe this.

It simply isn't true.

 

You aren't me... you have not been where I've been.

You are very young yet.

Some of the things I've seen and experienced, I hope you never do.

 

All the things I've seen and experienced over a lifetime are a part of why I no longer believe.

I did not accept that passage from belief to non-belief easily.

I didn't want to. But neither did I want to live holding on to false belief.

 

In sorting through my awareness and experiences, and the lessons I learned about the reality of human life, I did the best I could.

And here I am.

 

 

 

 

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Just now, AustinAustin said:

Could you believe that your mother never existed? It's the same with God.

 

Feelings lie, GOd says the heart is sick... 

 

This response is constructed of your own feelings.

You understand that, right?

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1 minute ago, alreadyGone said:

 

This response is constructed of your own feelings.

You understand that, right?

No, absolutley not... It's impossible for you to exist if your mother never existed. It's the same with God.

 

Feelings lie. We know this and have all experienced it before... God's Word says our hearts are sick, and we also know this to be true.

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21 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

Evidence??? You can't even prove you exist...

 

If there's nothing after, why would you be afraid?...

 

Well if you had cared to read the whole reply you would know why. Because I said why. 

 

And really? I can't prove I exist? Atleast I can see, touch, and feel myself. I can see touch and feel evidence contrary to the existence of God. 

 

Guess what I can't see, touch, or feel. God. I cannot see touch or feel your imaginary sky being. I choose to believe in my on existence. The logical conclusion for me is that those things I can see, touch, and feel with my own senses are real. 

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4 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

 

I respect that you believe this.

It simply isn't true.

 

You aren't me... you have not been where I've been.

You are very young yet.

Some of the things I've seen and experienced, I hope you never do.

 

All the things I've seen and experienced over a lifetime are a part of why I no longer believe.

I did not accept that passage from belief to non-belief easily.

I didn't want to. But neither did I want to live holding on to false belief.

 

In sorting through my awareness and experiences, and the lessons I learned about the reality of human life, I did the best I could.

And here I am.

 

 

 

 

The same devil that engineered those trials to pull yo ufrom God now laughs because he was successful - and you now 

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pull yourself from Him.

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1 minute ago, DarkBishop said:

 

Well if you had cared to read the whole reply you would know why. Because I said why. 

 

And really? I can't prove I exist? Atleast I can see, touch, and feel myself. I can see touch and feel evidence contrary to the existence of God. 

 

Guess what I can't see, touch, or feel. God. I cannot see touch or feel your imaginary sky being. I choose to believe in my on existence. The logical conclusion for me is that those things I can see, touch, and feel with my own senses are real. 

Friend, dont misunderstand... you can't prove you exist. Keep that in mind regarding evidence which disqualifies GOd, or lack thereof.

 

Child would argue that as evidence for santa claus, is he real?

 

God must exist or we could not. Even if you don't feel, trust in God anyway.

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And I truly do not intend to demean or attack you in saying this:

 

"Feelings lie, God says the heart is sick... "

 

This is typical of how Christian believers (and many non-believers) corrupt language to distort the truth in order to convince others of the veracity of their feelings and emotionally-driven belief:

 

The heart is an organ which pumps blood.

As far as we know or understand, that is all it does.

It has nothing to do with directing our thoughts, emotions, or morality.

 

And yet, expressions such as "you know in your heart" and such expressions as that are just a type of emotional propaganda, no more.

 

I'm not accusing you of intentional misdirection or obfuscation.

I know that this sort of use of the English language is commonplace and acquired by habit. But it isn't an accurate or truthful thing to say.

My heart doesn't know anything, except that it receives nerve impulses compelling it to pump my blood.

 

.

 

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2 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

And I truly do not intend to demean or attack you in saying this:

 

"Feelings lie, God says the heart is sick... "

 

This is typical of how Christian believers (and many non-believers) corrupt language to distort the truth in order to convince others of the veracity of their feelings and emotionally-driven belief:

 

The heart is an organ which pumps blood.

As far as we know or understand, that is all that it does.

It has nothing to do with directing our thoughts, emotions, or morality.

 

And yet, expressions such as "you know in your heart" and such expressions as that are just a type of emotional propaganda, no more.

 

I'm not accusing you of intentional misdirection or obfuscation.

I know that this sort of use of the English language is commonplace and acquired by habit. But it isn't an accurate or truthful thing to say.

My heart doesn't know anything, except that it receives nerve impulses compelling it to pump my blood.

 

.

 

You're going to Hell, far from life now, driven from God by suffering from the devil who has obtained his goal -you and possibly your family and everyone else following your example are also going to Hell

 

-and you want to quibble about English?...

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10 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

Feelings lie. We know this and have all experienced it before

 

Your absolutely right. I once thought I felt God. But it was a lie

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Just now, DarkBishop said:

 

Your absolutely right. I once thought I felt God. But it was a lie

Did you feel, or discern, God?

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7 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

You're going to Hell, far from life now, driven from God by suffering from the devil who has obtained his goal -you and possibly your family and everyone else following your example are also going to Hell

 

-and you want to quibble about English?...

 

Please read what I wrote again with a more open mind...

My point isn't about English.

 

The Bible has much to say about the use of words and language, pertinent to the honest expression and communication of truth, does it not?

 

And my choices in this regard impact myself alone. I have no family.

 

I do not believe that I can be held responsible for what others believe. They can do as they will. And if you believe in free will, then you must accept that also.

 

 

 

 

 

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Please allow me to repeat here the most important part:

 

This is typical of how Christian believers (and many non-believers) corrupt language to distort the truth in order to convince others of the veracity of their feelings and emotionally-driven belief:

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4 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

Please allow me to repeat here the most important part:

 

This is typical of how Christian believers (and many non-believers) corrupt language to distort the truth in order to convince others of the veracity of their feelings and emotionally-driven belief:

I'm sorry, I don't understand.

 

By neutralizing you, satan has made sure you will be ineffective in saving souls also...

 

Joyce Meyer was raped at least once a week by her father and his family for years... She says that while God didn't get her out of that situation, He did take her through it. Joyce says she couldn't be as effective at what she does today had she not endured that situation...

 

So many have been saved because of her. Salvation is dependent upon each person, but we can also play a part in sharing our faith.

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25 minutes ago, DarkBishop said:

Atleast I can see, touch, and feel myself.

We don't need to know about you touching yourself, there, PeeWee.

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26 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Oh, Thor!  He's gone from "logic proves god's existence" to "existence proves god's existence."  After trying to convince us that we can't even prove existence.  This is becoming more shiteously enfuckinated with each post.  Where's my ban hammer?

 

I'll offer my opinion, for what it may be worth.

Realize that my experience here is only the past 13 or so months.

And in that time these discussions in the Den have been with BroRando, and PittsburghJoe. They became belligerent and insulting in a way that Austin really has not.

 

For what that may be worth.

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

We don't need to know about you touching yourself, there PeeWee.

 

Well there's a time and place for everything...

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3 minutes ago, alreadyGone said:

 

I'll offer my opinion, for what it may be worth.

Realize that my experience here is only the past 13 or so months.

And in that time these discussions in the Den have been with BroRando, and PittsburghJoe. They became belligerent and insulting in a way that Austin really has not.

 

For what that may be worth.

 

 

 

 

Nah.  I was being facetious.  I wouldn't ban a guy just for being ignorant.  And, you're right, monotonous and tiresome though he is, he's kept it (relatively) cordial.

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15 minutes ago, AustinAustin said:

Did you feel, or discern, God?

 

Good question.

In pondering my lifetime of prayer and devotions, I had to ask myself that same question.

 

Ask yourself though... if you cannot trust your feelings, then... 

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