Peanut Gallery for "What Is Evidence / How Do We Know What Is Real?"

[Astreja]

15 hours ago, aik said:

As well I wish to know more about some of you, what happened to you, why you lost your faith, what destroyed your relationships with Jesus. I hope to be useful in such an important deal.

 

Aik, in my particular situation there is no way for you to be "useful."  I am fairly unusual among the people at Ex-C because I never believed.  I have read the Bible but the stories were always just fictional to me.

 

There is nothing that you or any other mortal on the face of the earth can do to change this, because none of you have evidence that is up to my standards.  Only an actual god could alter my disbelief, and I'm not going to go chasing after something that I don't believe is there.

 

I also have no desire to worship any god that would even think of creating such a place as hell.  I'm not interested in worshipping evil gods.

[Shinzon]

In my case what destroyed faith was realizing that particularly the gospels made more sense as legend then as something that should be viewed as 100 percent factual.

[freshstart]

On 12/14/2022 at 10:22 PM, aik said:

As well I wish to know more about some of you, what happened to you, why you lost your faith, what destroyed your relationships with Jesus. I hope to be useful in such an important deal.

 

Aik, this is like asking, "what destroyed your relationship with Santa Claus?" There cannot be a relationship with something that does not exist.

 

I know this sounds harsh, but there is no way for you to be "useful" here because you cannot point to anything other than the bible (a book of mythological literature) or your own personal feelings/emotions/internal experiences (which are no more trustworthy than anyone else's feelings/emotions/internal experiences) as "proof" that Jesus is "alive" or "real" or whatever you want to call it.

 

I feel sorry for Christians who feel pressured to work in God's behalf. Too bad he can't do that for himself.

[aik]

17 hours ago, Astreja said:

 

Aik, in my particular situation there is no way for you to be "useful."  I am fairly unusual among the people at Ex-C because I never believed.  I have read the Bible but the stories were always just fictional to me.

 

There is nothing that you or any other mortal on the face of the earth can do to change this, because none of you have evidence that is up to my standards.  Only an actual god could alter my disbelief, and I'm not going to go chasing after something that I don't believe is there.

 

I also have no desire to worship any god that would even think of creating such a place as hell.  I'm not interested in worshipping evil gods.

I agree with you in your approach. That is a good point.

[aik]

On 12/15/2022 at 3:15 PM, TABA said:

Hello again, aik!  I thought maybe you had decided to shake the dust of this place from your feet, and I am glad you have not done so.  It is good for us to have a christian here to disagree with!

 

Things are a bit busy right now, but soon I hope to start a topic explaining why I now reject christianity after many years as a believer.  Stay tuned…

ok. Waiting for your start. 

[alreadyGone]

On 12/14/2022 at 10:22 PM, aik said:

...As well I wish to know more about some of you, what happened to you, why you lost your faith, what destroyed your relationships with Jesus. I hope to be useful in such an important deal. TABA once said to me that it is more important the quality of conversation than a quickly made respond. I agree with it.

 

See you soon again. 

 

I lived too long, and saw too much of the real world.

And over those years I saw too much of human beings to ever again believe that they are created by some all-knowing, loving God.

 

It really is that simple.

 

Best wishes aik, and I hope that you are able to have your phone repaired, or replaced.

[Rev R]

On 12/14/2022 at 10:22 PM, aik said:

 I hope to be useful in such an important deal.  

Since we can only assume that the usefulness you speak of is leading the apostate back to Christ, who of this number have you singled out as most likely to reconvert? I'm quite curious to know.

[pantheory]

On 11/29/2022 at 8:24 AM, walterpthefirst said:

"What Is Evidence / How Do We Know What Is Real?"

 

Walter.

 

Believe nothing of what you hear, only half of what you see, Consider the source first, but be skeptical of everything you read. Reality and truths are man-made concepts. Each type of animal perceives its own type of "reality." As humans we perceive only a small fraction of the EM radiation and sound waves out there, Smell, taste, and the tactile senses and related instrumentation give additional information to us concerning what might be out there.. Our senses serve our survival, our instruments serve our further understandings of reality, and our minds put it all together to conceive a meaning to it concerning our interests, theories. and what we call evidence, truth, and our type of reality as human animals. 

 

https://open.maricopa.edu/intropsych/chapter/sensation-and-perception/

[aik]

On 12/16/2022 at 7:59 AM, freshstart said:

what destroyed your relationship with Santa Claus?

In case of Santa Clause our parents bought presents of Christmas for us, but in case of Jesus, He Himself does what He does in our lives. 

[☆ DarkBishop ☆]

40 minutes ago, aik said:

In case of Santa Clause our parents bought presents of Christmas for us, but in case of Jesus, He Himself does what He does in our lives. 

Have you ever noticed the similarities between Santa clause and God?

 

Both have a naughty and a nice list. Those that have done evil. And those that have done good. (The book of life)

 

Both know whether or not you have been naughty or nice. Sinned or not. 

 

Both have a reward for the good. Presents/Heaven

 

Both have a reward for the bad. Coal/hell

 

Both perform miracles. 

 

Santa is just the kid version of God.

 

DB

[aik]

5 minutes ago, DarkBishop said:

Have you ever noticed the similarities between Santa clause and God?

 

Both have a naughty and a nice list. Those that have done evil. And those that have done good. (The book of life)

 

Both know whether or not you have been naughty or nice. Sinned or not. 

 

Both have a reward for the good. Presents/Heaven

 

Both have a reward for the bad. Coal/hell

 

Both perform miracles. 

 

Santa is just the kid version of God.

 

DB

I think that people put some of their imagination about God in Santa and presented santa this way. 

 

I think so because we have here also some examples how people tried to realize some of their knowledge about God, but in other personage. For example Lenin. He was like Jesus for Christians. But it does not mean that Jesus was like Lenin, or they were the same cult.

[Shinzon]

1 hour ago, aik said:

In case of Santa Clause our parents bought presents of Christmas for us, but in case of Jesus, He Himself does what He does in our lives. 

Christianity....the ultimate Kobayashi Maru.

[midniterider]

4 hours ago, aik said:

In case of Santa Clause our parents bought presents of Christmas for us, but in case of Jesus, He Himself does what He does in our lives. 

 

Why do you have to speak on his behalf?

[◊ Weezer ◊]

4 hours ago, midniterider said:

 

Why do you have to speak on his behalf?

 

Also, how does Jesus do what he does in our lives?

[aik]

4 hours ago, midniterider said:

 

Why do you have to speak on his behalf?

i am sent to speak on his behalf. the fact that we speak on behalf of jesus does not mean that he himself is silent. so what is the use of my speech to you? anyway you do not hear it. the same way you do not hear god's speech. but to hear god one should open his heart for him. that is the faith. do it.

[aik]

19 minutes ago, Weezer said:

 

Also, how does Jesus do what he does in our lives?

jesus promised that he would distroy the power of sin in our lives if we believe in him. he said that only the son can free us from the bondage of sin. so as i believed in jesus he kept his promise and distroyed the power of sin in my life, he set me free from bondage. before this i never thought that i would be able to not sin and to live a free life, free of sin. but with jesus i got it. this only fact is enough for me, only this one is enough for me to give my life to jesus forever. even if every other things dissapear, even if i have nothing else from god, not food, not close, not house, not rewards in heaven, not miracles happen in my life, only the fact that he kept his promise is enough to live with him. because it is more than all the wealth of the world. 

[midniterider]

18 hours ago, aik said:

i am sent to speak on his behalf. the fact that we speak on behalf of jesus does not mean that he himself is silent. so what is the use of my speech to you? anyway you do not hear it. the same way you do not hear god's speech. but to hear god one should open his heart for him. that is the faith. do it.

 

Wait, I think I hear Jesus speaking....yes...he is saying you are full of nonsense. He said the bible is made up and we dont need to worship him. 

 

Sweet! Jesus has spoken. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Shinzon]

Im a bit tipsy, so forgive potential poor wording.

 

However I have a question for resident christian?

 

Why did you convert?   If you could describe your conversion experience and what lead up to it I would be very interested.

 

Often times in my experience, people either convert very young and it becomes something akin to sunk cost fallacy or they convert in response to life happening?   I think it may give a better idea of mutual understanding.

[midniterider]

17 hours ago, aik said:

jesus promised that he would distroy the power of sin in our lives if we believe in him. he said that only the son can free us from the bondage of sin. so as i believed in jesus he kept his promise and distroyed the power of sin in my life, he set me free from bondage. before this i never thought that i would be able to not sin and to live a free life, free of sin. but with jesus i got it.

 

Sin is fiction. 

 

this only fact is enough for me, only this one is enough for me to give my life to jesus forever. even if every other things dissapear, even if i have nothing else from god, not food, not close, not house, not rewards in heaven, not miracles happen in my life, only the fact that he kept his promise is enough to live with him. because it is more than all the wealth of the world. 

 

This paragraph makes you sound totally delusional and obsessed. 

 

 

[TABA]

On 12/16/2022 at 7:44 AM, aik said:

ok. Waiting for your start. 

Started!  I created a topic just for you and I in the Colosseum section:
https://www.ex-christian.net/topic/86728-for-aik-why-i-am-no-longer-a-christian/#comment-1257179

 

 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

On 12/19/2022 at 12:39 PM, Hierophant said:

 

Truth be told, I think the "basking in grace" for most believers is just a facade they keep up. Most Christians are terrified of Hell and the idea they are going there, and so their "love" is nothing but fear and terror masquerading as love.

 

Something is amiss here.

 

Excelent reply in your whole post above!   As to what I guoted, their "faith" and "love" (basking in love) (great way to put it) can be seen a psychological defense against the fear of abandonment.

[Hierophant]

Don't worry folks, Aik doesn't think any of us were true Christians. He knows us better than we know our own thoughts. We all joined the church for nefarious reasons. None of us had faith like Aik does....we've been found out .

 

 

[☆ DarkBishop ☆]

@aik

 

You need to stop suggesting that we were not true Christians. Last time I checked your Bible says that only God knows the hearts of man. If you had met many of us when we were believers you would not have questioned if we were Christians or not. You would have seen the "evidence" of Christ in our lives as well. 

 

Thanks, 

 

DB

[Rev R]

On 12/19/2022 at 1:07 AM, aik said:

i am sent to speak on his behalf.

how did that go down? did Jesus appear to you in a vision? did your pastor demand you enter the "mission field" to win souls? did someone tell you the forum existed and you said "aw, shit, yeah! I got what it takes to turn these heathens!"? or did a sermon hurt your feelings so much that you just had to go out and prove your spiritual power and direct line to Jesus?

do you think yourself a prophet? a saint? 

edit: I ended up REALLY curious here so I'd like to open the question up to all the Ex-C's. When you were bringing religion to the unwashed masses, what was your claim to speak with the authority of God or Christ? 

[Shinzon]

8 hours ago, DarkBishop said:

@aik

 

You need to stop suggesting that we were not true Christians. Last time I checked your Bible says that only God knows the hearts of man. If you had met many of us when we were believers you would not have questioned if we were Christians or not. You would have seen the "evidence" of Christ in our lives as well. 

 

Thanks, 

 

DB

Don't worry he is just filling out the evangelical conversion strategy bingo card.