Geneology?

[crazy-tiger]

I'm dropping this one in here, but I'll also be dropping it in the Colosseum. (for a more polite debate)

 

Something got me buzzing about the Geneology of Jesus today, and I thought I'd check to see if the one's given in Matthew and Luke agree with each other.

 

Well... Thanks to the fact that one goes back through the generations while the other goes forward, it took me a little bit longer than I expected, but it brought something to light.

 

They don't agree...

 

 

Now, I've mentioned to some people about how Joseph seems to have 2 fathers... the given answer, which is indeed possible, is that it's one person but one of the names was his SECOND name.

 

I'll admit, it's possible... it doesn't make much sense, but it's possible. (would you give someones name like that? nope...)

 

What I found today, and it'll be old news to some, is that not only do they not agree on various names, but on how many generations there were between Abraham and Jesus. (being that only one of them goes any further back...)

 

Following the list, they match up all the way through until they reach David. At that point, they split. Luke has his son being Nathan, while Matthew says it's Solomon.

Again, it could just be different names for the same person, but from that point on there are more "begats" in Luke than there are in Matthew...

 

The next name that matches is Shealtiel... 13 generations later according to Matthew, but 21 later in Luke. The next name matches (Zerubbabel) but then they split again until they reach Joseph... some 10 generations later in Matthew, but 19 later in Luke...

 

Overall, there are 17 more generations in Luke than there are in Matthew, and only 2 names match between David and Joseph.

 

 

 

Anyone out there feel like explaining this?

[crazy-tiger]

This is what I mean...

 

Luke 3

23Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry. He was the son, so it was thought, of Joseph, the son of Heli, 24the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melki, the son of Jannai, the son of Joseph, 25the son of Mattathias, the son of Amos, the son of Nahum, the son of Esli, the son of Naggai, 26the son of Maath, the son of Mattathias, the son of Semein, the son of Josech, the son of Joda, 27the son of Joanan, the son of Rhesa, the son of Zerubbabel, the son of Shealtiel, the son of Neri, 28the son of Melki, the son of Addi, the son of Cosam, the son of Elmadam, the son of Er, 29the son of Joshua, the son of Eliezer, the son of Jorim, the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, 30the son of Simeon, the son of Judah, the son of Joseph, the son of Jonam, the son of Eliakim, 31the son of Melea, the son of Menna, the son of Mattatha, the son of Nathan, the son of David, 32the son of Jesse, the son of Obed, the son of Boaz, the son of Salmon,[d] the son of Nahshon, 33the son of Amminadab, the son of Ram, the son of Hezron, the son of Perez, the son of Judah, 34the son of Jacob, the son of Isaac, the son of Abraham... (ends here due to Matthew going no further back)

 

Matthew 1

2Abraham was the father of Isaac, Isaac the father of Jacob, Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers, 3Judah the father of Perez and Zerah, whose mother was Tamar, Perez the father of Hezron, Hezron the father of Ram, 4Ram the father of Amminadab, Amminadab the father of Nahshon, Nahshon the father of Salmon, 5Salmon the father of Boaz, whose mother was Rahab, Boaz the father of Obed, whose mother was Ruth, Obed the father of Jesse, 6and Jesse the father of King David. David was the father of Solomon, whose mother had been Uriah's wife, Solomon the father of Rehoboam, Rehoboam the father of Abijah, Abijah the father of Asa, 8Asa the father of Jehoshaphat, Jehoshaphat the father of Jehoram, Jehoram the father of Uzziah, 9Uzziah the father of Jotham, Jotham the father of Ahaz, Ahaz the father of Hezekiah, 10Hezekiah the father of Manasseh, Manasseh the father of Amon, Amon the father of Josiah, 11and Josiah the father of Jeconiah[a] and his brothers at the time of the exile to Babylon. 12After the exile to Babylon: Jeconiah was the father of Shealtiel, Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel, 13Zerubbabel the father of Abiud, Abiud the father of Eliakim, Eliakim the father of Azor, 14Azor the father of Zadok, Zadok the father of Akim, Akim the father of Eliud, 15Eliud the father of Eleazar, Eleazar the father of Matthan, Matthan the father of Jacob, 16and Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

(Mis-matches shown in red.)

 

It's one heck of a problem, and I don't think there is any answer... but I want to see what people come up with.

[Checkmate]

Actually, I think it's pointless to go so far as to debate the problem of different geneologies. What difference does it make, when JOSEPH has NOTHING to do with the bloodline of "Jesus"?

 

Wasn't it the Holy Spook that knocked up Mary? No human sperm involved. So trying to "accurately" trace "Joseph's" lineage back to David and Abraham is a waste of time.

 

And since women don't count in the Jewish scheme of things...

 

The bible has SO many problems, that it isn't even funny any longer.

[crazy-tiger]

Actually, I think it's pointless to go so far as to debate the problem of different geneologies.  What difference does it make, when JOSEPH has NOTHING to do with the bloodline of "Jesus"?

 

Wasn't it the Holy Spook that knocked up Mary?  No human sperm involved.  So trying to "accurately" trace "Joseph's" lineage back to David and Abraham is a waste of time.

 

And since women don't count in the Jewish scheme of things... 

 

The bible has SO many problems, that it isn't even funny any longer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know... I just want to see what answer they'll come up with.

[Ouroboros]

I chose to post this respons in the Lion's Den version...

 

Maybe one was Joseph's, and the other was the bastard biological father that ran out on Mary after their "one special nite"!

 

Maybe this is the actual proof that Jesus wasn't born from a virgin or from God? Because Jesus real dad was the other geneology.

[crazy-tiger]

I chose to post this respons in the Lion's Den version...

 

Maybe one was Joseph's, and the other was the bastard biological father that ran out on Mary after their "one special nite"!

 

Maybe this is the actual proof that Jesus wasn't born from a virgin or from God? Because Jesus real dad was the other geneology.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good reply...

 

It's possible, and it'd fuck the idea of the Holy Ghost being the daddy.

[DoubleDee]

Here's a link to a Jewish site that looks into the geneology issue. It's long but a good read and shows the many flaws of the NT geneologies.

 

http://www.messiahtruth.com/jesusgen.html

[Amethyst]

Anyone out there feel like explaining this?

 

Whoever wrote the Bible didn't feel like making sure they had everything straight enough not to be contradictory.

[daniel_1012]

I'm dropping this one in here, but I'll also be dropping it in the Colosseum. (for a more polite debate)

 

Something got me buzzing about the Geneology of Jesus today, and I thought I'd check to see if the one's given in Matthew and Luke agree with each other.

 

Well... Thanks to the fact that one goes back through the generations while the other goes forward, it took me a little bit longer than I expected, but it brought something to light.

 

They don't agree...

Now, I've mentioned to some people about how Joseph seems to have 2 fathers... the given answer, which is indeed possible, is that it's one person but one of the names was his SECOND name.

 

I'll admit, it's possible... it doesn't make much sense, but it's possible. (would you give someones name like that? nope...)

 

What I found today, and it'll be old news to some, is that not only do they not agree on various names, but on how many generations there were between Abraham and Jesus. (being that only one of them goes any further back...)

 

Following the list, they match up all the way through until they reach David. At that point, they split. Luke has his son being Nathan, while Matthew says it's Solomon.

Again, it could just be different names for the same person, but from that point on there are more "begats" in Luke than there are in Matthew...

 

The next name that matches is Shealtiel... 13 generations later according to Matthew, but 21 later in Luke. The next name matches (Zerubbabel) but then they split again until they reach Joseph... some 10 generations later in Matthew, but 19 later in Luke...

 

Overall, there are 17 more generations in Luke than there are in Matthew, and only 2 names match between David and Joseph.

Anyone out there feel like explaining this?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Genealogy

 

As I go through this... I have to smirk a little bit, as I am obviously not the first person to do this or bother studying. But, there is some gratification from actually searching out a matter on your own. I am confused on the blood line/legal line of Jesus, as Suzanne mentioned earlier, and is obviously the Christian translation of the occurrence -- it leaves the Bible without contradiction. That is, that Heli is Joseph's father-IN-LAW (Mary's father), and Jacob is Joseph's maternal father.

 

In Luke 3:23 it says... 23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

 

In Matthew 1:16 it says...16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

 

--- Doesn't this leave the gospel of Luke making Joseph's father Heli, and the gospel of Matthew making Joseph's father Jacob?

 

According to this source HERE:

 

In Luke 3:23 Heli (Also written Eli) is mentioned as father of Joseph in the ancestry of Jesus.

 

This presents some difficulties as Matthew 1:16 states that "Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary". The traditional explanation is that Luke actually means that Heli was the father-in-law of Joseph, and thus actually the father of Mary. Since Mary had no brothers Joseph was Heli legal heir and thus legally his son. Thus traditionally Heli has been described as the father of Mary and Jesus' paternal grandfather.

 

A second theory, originally advanced by Julius Africanus, is that while Jacob was the biological father of Joseph Heli was the legal father, having married Joseph's mother after the death of Jacob.

 

Modern scholars are somewhat skeptical of these solution as they are based purely on conjecture with no actual evidence for any of them. Modern scholars thus feel it is just a likely that one of Matthew or Luke are in error. Most scholars find Luke's account more believable and thus Heli is seen as the most likely name of Joseph's father, and thus Jesus' legal paternal grandfather.

 

Jesus - King of the Jews

 

Colossians 2:16-17

 

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

 

Genealogy according to Matthew

 

ABRAHAM

ISAAC

JACOB

JUDAS and his brethren

PHARES and ZARA of Thamar

ESROM begat of Phares

ARAM

AMINADAB

NAASSON

SALMON

BOOZ of Rachab

OBED of Ruth

JESSE

DAVID the king

"SOLOMON of her that had been the wife of Urias"

 

Who is the wife of Urias that Matthew is referring to? That wife of Urias, was Bathsheba -- Solomon is Bathsheba's and David, the king of Israel's son

 

Solomon was the son of David's adulterous relationship with Bathsheba. That is, King David, whom the Bible says that God called, "A man after His (God's) own heart," committed adultery with Bathsheba, who was married to Uriah.

 

David's adultery with Bathseba

 

2 Samuel 11:1-6

 

1 And it came to pass, after the year was expired, at the time when kings go forth to battle, that David sent Joab, and his servants with him, and all Israel; and they destroyed the children of Ammon, and besieged Rabbah. But David tarried still at Jerusalem.

 

2 And it came to pass in an eveningtide, that David arose from off his bed, and walked upon the roof of the king's house: and from the roof he saw a woman washing herself; and the woman was very beautiful to look upon.

 

3 And David sent and enquired after the woman. And one said, Is not this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, the wife of Uriah the Hittite?

 

4 And David sent messengers, and took her; and she came in unto him, and he lay with her; for she was purified from her uncleanness: and she returned unto her house.

 

5 And the woman conceived, and sent and told David, and said, I am with child.

 

This child that was conceived, was Solomon... and so the genealogy continues, and we see Jesus, as have regal kinship to the throne -- Making Him the royal King of the Jews. Keep in mind, this was Joseph's first son, because Mary was with child by the Holy Spirit. Up to this point, Joseph and Mary had never had intercourse -- Joseph and Mary were not married at the time of Jesus' conception, and it can be gathered here that Joseph was an honourable man... he was waiting for marriage, as God desires us. Not to mention (duh) Mary was, the virgin Mary.

 

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Mary, who is the mother of Jesus, and also Joseph's wife. Joseph, who is a descendent of David the king and part to the throne of Israel...

 

Matthew 1:18-20

 

18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

 

19 Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privily.

 

20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost.

 

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

David had other sons, but God chose Solomon to be HIS son...

 

1 Chronicles 28:2-6

 

2 Then David the king stood up upon his feet, and said, Hear me, my brethren, and my people: As for me, I had in mine heart to build an house of rest for the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and for the footstool of our God, and had made ready for the building:

 

3 But God said unto me, Thou shalt not build an house for my name, because thou hast been a man of war, and hast shed blood.

 

4 Howbeit the LORD God of Israel chose me before all the house of my father to be king over Israel for ever: for he hath chosen Judah to be the ruler; and of the house of Judah, the house of my father; and among the sons of my father he liked me to make me king over all Israel:

 

5 And of all my sons, (for the LORD hath given me many sons,) he hath chosen Solomon my son to sit upon the throne of the kingdom of the LORD over Israel.

 

6 And he said unto me, Solomon thy son, he shall build my house and my courts: for I have chosen him to be my son, and I will be his father.

... ... ... ...

 

You see here, that God told David that David will not build Him a house... because He is a man of war.

 

But God said unto me, Thou shalt not build an house for my name, because thou hast been a man of war, and hast shed blood.

 

But, through David... God would build a house, through His son Solomon.

 

And he said unto me, Solomon they son, he shall build my house and my courts: for I have chosen him to be my son, and I will be his father.

 

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

And so we see, eventually we come to Jesus following the genealogy in Matthew. But, as we read in Colossians 2:16-17, these are a shadow of things to come

 

 

 

ROBOAM (Solomon's son, and so on it goes...)

ABIA

ASA

JOSAPHAT

JORAM

OZIAS

JOATHAM

ACHAZ

EZEKIAS

MANASSES

AMON

JOSIAS

JECHONIAS and his brethren (about the time they were carried away to Babylon)

SALATHIEL (after they were brought to Babylon)

ZOROBABEL

ABIUD

ELIAKIM

AZOR

SADOC

ACHIM

ELIUD

ELEAZAR

MATTHAN

JACOB

JOSEPH the husband of Mary of whom born...

 

JESUS

[daniel_1012]

(the post above is the majority of a post I made on my personal blog site, about a week earlier).

 

I was also wondering the same thing you were.

[Mythra]

Nice tap-dance.

 

You almost obscured the fact that these two geneologies are utterly irreconcilable. Even with the unsupported conjecture that one of them is on Mary's side of the family.

 

Write them both down side by side, and you'll know I'm telling the truth. Even if you accepted the far-fetched idea that one geneology is that of Joseph and one is that of Mary. The geneologies go all over the place. Like Crazy Tiger says - even the number of generations between common points vary wildly.

 

And, it's a ridiculous argument anyway, since no jewish geneology would ever trace the maternal side.

[daniel_1012]

Nice tap-dance.

 

You almost obscured the fact that these two geneologies are utterly irreconcilable.  Even with the unsupported conjecture that one of them is on Mary's side of the family.

 

Write them both down side by side, and you'll know I'm telling the truth.  Even if you accepted the far-fetched idea that one geneology is that of Joseph and one is that of Mary.  The geneologies go all over the place.  Like Crazy Tiger says - even the number of generations between common points vary wildly.

 

And, it's a ridiculous argument anyway, since no jewish geneology would ever trace the maternal side.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Just because you didn't like the answer... That is it. One is Mary's father (Joseph's father-in-law), the other is Joseph's father by birth.

[Mythra]

Just because you didn't like the answer... That is it.  One is Mary's father (Joseph's father-in-law), the other is Joseph's father by birth.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

OK - then I assume that you assert that these geneologies are accurate. In that case, your own bible proves that Jesus cannot be the Messiah.

 

In Matthew 1:11 we have Jesus descending from Coniah (or Jeconiah). Matthew failed to do his homework when making up this geneology.

 

Jeremiah 22:30 says this about Coniah (or Jeconiah)

 

"Thus says the LORD, write this man down childless, a man who will not prosper in his days; for no man of his descendants will prosper, sitting on the throne of David, or ruling again in Judah."

 

got ya.

[Mythra]

Another problem: Luke inserts names into his geneology that are unique to the priestly tribe of Levi, not Judah. They are: Heli, Matthat, Levi, Mattathias, Maath, and Mattatha.

[Mythra]

More mistakes in the geneologies:

 

Matthew 1:8 "Joram the father of Uzzi'ah.

 

Matthew skipped three generations. Matthew needed to skip these so that he could show that every 14 generations, something spectacular happened.

 

The names skipped are Ahaziah, Joash, and Amaziah.

 

 

Luke 3:35-36 - ..the son of Shelah, the son of Cainan, the son of Arphaxad.

 

Wrong. According to Genesis 10:24, Arphaxad was Shelah's father

 

Rhesa is another name that Luke makes up in the geneology.

 

 

These geneologies are nothing more than the author's inventions.

[Mythra]

Daniel : let us know when you get done dancing around all of this stuff. We've got more.

[Mythra]

Oh, OK. One more little brain-teaser for our apologetic friend.

 

You say that Luke's geneology was that of Mary. Cannot be true. Aaron isn't mentioned in the geneology listed by Luke.

 

Why Aaron? Why should he be?

 

Because Elizabeth (John the Baptist's mother) was listed as a descendent of Aaron. And Elizabeth was Mary's cousin. Therefore, Mary was also a descendent of Aaron.

[Checkmate]

Ease up, Mythra! You're gonna fry danny-boy's already frazzled circuits.

[Vixentrox]

The Holy Spirit fathering Jesus pretty important but you don't see him listed in either geneology. You would think that would have been important enough to include...

[crazy-tiger]

Just because you didn't like the answer... That is it.  One is Mary's father (Joseph's father-in-law), the other is Joseph's father by birth.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mate... strange though it may seem, that argument has been tried. It doesn't work.

 

Why? Because it goes on bloodline. The Messiah MUST be of David's blood...

Why is that a problem? Well, since Jewish bloodlines are traced through the males only, any bloodline that traces itself through a female is automatically a waste of time.

 

Your argument that one of them is Mary's is proven wrong by the Bible and Jewish law.

 

 

It gets worse for you though... As Mythra pointed out, Matthew has Jeconiah in the lineage. Since the Messiah was to sit on the throne of David, having Jeconiah as an ancestor automatically bars Jesus from being the Messiah.

Of course, that's the lineage that everyone says is Josephs... kinda screws that up, doesn't it?

 

There is a way out, and you've probably already thought of it... What if the lineage in Matthew is just wrong? At least you still have the lineage in Luke to lead to Jesus, don't you?

Well, no... Another little requirement of the Messiah is that not only is he a descendant of David, but that he is a descendent of David through his son Solomon.

 

Pity that Luke has the lineage going through NATHAN, son of David...

 

 

In the end, BOTH lineages prove that, rather than being the Messiah, Jesus could NEVER be the Messiah, since his bloodline is either cursed by God or is the WRONG BLOODLINE!

 

 

 

Must be descended through Solomon...

1 Chronicles 22:9 Behold, a son shall be born to thee, who shall be a man of rest; and I will give him rest from all his enemies round about: for his name shall be Solomon, and I will give peace and quietness unto Israel in his days. [10] He shall build a house for my name; and he shall be My son, and I [will be] his Father; and I will establish the throne of his kingdom over Israel for ever. (KJV)

 

Cannot be a descendent of Jeconiah...

Jeremiah 22:24 [As] I live, saith the LORD, though Coniah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah were the signet upon my right hand, yet would I pluck thee thence; [25] And I will give thee into the hand of them that seek thy life, and into the hand [of them] whose face thou fearest, even into the hand of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, and into the hand of the Chaldeans. [26] And I will cast thee out, and thy mother that bare thee, into another country, where ye were not born; and there shall ye die. [27] But to the land whereunto they desire to return, thither shall they not return. [28] [is] this man Coniah a despised broken idol? [is he] a vessel wherein [is] no pleasure? Wherefore are they cast out, he and his seed, and are cast into a land which they know not? [29] O earth, earth, earth, hear the word of the LORD. [30] Thus saith the LORD, Write ye this man childless, a man [that] shall not prosper in his days: for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling any more in Judah. (KJV)

[pug]

Re: Genealogy of Jesus Christ

 

Matthew 1:1-17 and Luke 3:23-38 give the genealogy of Jesus. Matthew recorded Joseph's lineage, while Luke gave the family tree of Mary.

 

And this link

http://www.lifeofchrist.com/life/genealogy/

 

will answer the following:

 

Interpretation - Obtain a first century perspective on genealogies. Learn why the Israelites kept careful family records.

 

Matthew's account - A Jewish perspective on the ancestors of Joseph.

 

Recorded women - Meet some of the remarkable women in Christ's family tree.

 

Luke's account - A Greek perspective on the ancestors of Mary.

 

About Joseph - The unique treatment of Christ's father in the genealogies.

 

Jehoiakim's curse - Learn about this obscure prophecy which may have influenced the virgin birth of Jesus.

 

 

especially:

 

Objections - A summary of alleged discrepancies in the genealogical records.

 

And finally:

 

Closing remarks - Admission of limitations, and links to other resources.

[crazy-tiger]

Re: Genealogy of Jesus Christ

 

Matthew 1:1-17 and Luke 3:23-38 give the genealogy of Jesus. Matthew recorded Joseph's lineage, while Luke gave the family tree of Mary.

 

And this link

http://www.lifeofchrist.com/life/genealogy/

 

will answer the following:

 

Interpretation - Obtain a first century perspective on genealogies. Learn why the Israelites kept careful family records.

 

Matthew's account - A Jewish perspective on the ancestors of Joseph.

 

Recorded women - Meet some of the remarkable women in Christ's family tree.

 

Luke's account - A Greek perspective on the ancestors of Mary.

 

About Joseph - The unique treatment of Christ's father in the genealogies.

 

Jehoiakim's curse - Learn about this obscure prophecy which may have influenced the virgin birth of Jesus.

especially:

 

Objections - A summary of alleged discrepancies in the genealogical records.

 

And finally:

 

Closing remarks - Admission of limitations, and links to other resources.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Virgin birth... Joseph was not the father, therefore the lineage in Matthew doesn't count.

Not descended through Solomon... therefore the lineage in Luke doesn't count.

 

Neither of them could lead to the Messiah.

 

 

 

Your "explaination" is no explaination at all... just a repeat of something that's already been proven wrong.

 

Care to try again?

[Vixentrox]

Again a complete failure to record god as Jesus father is dodged. That's a pretty important piece of Jesus supposed divinity and the ole holy spook just don't cut the mustard to make it in the line.

[pug]

Is the Messiah supposed to be a descendant of Solomon?

 

No. Nowhere in the Bible is it written that the Messiah was to be a descendant of Solomon. The Hebrew word for "descendant", "offspring" or "seed" is "zeh-rah". King David was the latest Old Testament person from whom the Messiah was to be a prophesied descendant (zeh-rah).

 

I have made a covenant with My chosen, I have sworn to My servant David: "Your seed I will establish forever, and build up your throne to all generations." Psalm 89:4

 

Although it was not prophesied that Solomon would be in the messianic line, the throne of Solomon's kingdom was to be established over Israel forever. God spoke to David the following prophecy:

 

Behold, a son shall be born to you, who shall be a man of rest; and I will give him rest from all his enemies all around. His name shall be Solomon, for I will give peace and quietness to Israel in his days. He shall build a house for My name, and he shall be My son, and I will be his Father; and I will establish the throne of his kingdom over Israel forever. 1 Chronicles 22:9-10

 

For Solomon's throne to be established over Israel forever, the Messiah must inherit Solomon's throne. This happened, as the following paragraphs illustrate.

Jeconiah was the legitimate heir to Solomon's throne at the time of the Babylonian exile. King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon exiled Jeconiah, however, and placed Jeconiah's uncle, Zedekiah, on the throne (2 Kings 24:17). Jeconiah had not given up his birthright, however, as Esau had done with Jacob. Although the curse on Jeconiah (Jeremiah 22:30, quoted above) prevented his offspring from sitting on the throne of David, the birthright to the throne continued to be passed through Jeconiah's descendants. The birthright was eventually passed to Joseph, the husband of Mary. Although Jesus was not Joseph's physical son, Joseph had accepted Jesus as his son, as is indicated in the following passages:

 

Mary referred to Joseph as Jesus' father: "… and His mother said to Him, 'Son, why have You done this to us? Look, Your father and I have sought You anxiously.' " Luke 2:48

 

According to Luke, it was commonly supposed that Jesus was Joseph's son: "Now Jesus Himself began His ministry at about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph…" Luke 3:23

 

According to Matthew, Jesus' fellow countrymen considered him to be Joseph's son: "Is this not the carpenter's son?" Matthew 13:51

 

Because Joseph accepted Jesus as his son, and because Jesus was the firstborn in Joseph's family, Jesus inherited Joseph's birthright. Thus, Jesus inherited Solomon's (and David's) throne from Joseph. Since Jesus is not a descendant of Coniah (see question 6), the curse on Coniah does not apply to Jesus. Thus, Jesus can sit on David's throne and rule in Judah. Jesus inherited David's throne from Solomon's line but is a descendant of David through Nathan's line (see question 1).

 

http://www.geocities.com/athens/parthenon/.../genealogy.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

The Nathan/Solomon conflict: Matthew says that Jesus was descended from Solomon; Luke says that Jesus was descended from David's other son, Nathan.

 

Both Matthew and Luke could be true, if we realize that Matthew traced Christ's descent to Joseph, and interpret Luke's genealogy as tracing it to Mary.

 

http://www.religioustolerance.org/xmas_con.htm

 

or:

 

http://www.bcbsr.com/survey/sgosp1.html

 

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/strauss/ch1-2.html

 

 

Then again you may be right:

 

If you trace Jesus’ line through Luke's genealogy (regardless of whether you attribute it to Joseph or Mary) Jesus cannot be the Messiah because it doesn't include King Solomon; it includes his brother, Nathan, eliminating any legitimate claim to the throne.

 

http://www.messiahtruth.com/jesusgen.html

[mwc]

If you trace Jesus’ line through Luke's genealogy (regardless of whether you attribute it to Joseph or Mary) Jesus cannot be the Messiah because it doesn't include King Solomon; it includes his brother, Nathan, eliminating any legitimate claim to the throne.

 

http://www.messiahtruth.com/jesusgen.html

Then we're agreed. Jesus was not the Messiah.

 

mwc