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    9. Ex-Christian Spirituality

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  • Our picks

    • One of the benefits of logic is the ability to test whether a particular proposition is true or not.  It often follows the progession: A=B, B=C, C does not equal D; therefore, the proposition that A=D is not likely to be true.  With this in mind, let's look at a particular proposition and follow the progression to its logical conclusion.  
       
      If logic is the absolute standard for reasoning , then everyone should either agree with the conclusion, or, if disagreeing, be able to point out a flaw in the logic.  Let's begin:
       
       
       
      PROPOSITION: god is both all-loving and all-powerful. 
       
      OBSERVATION: Evil exists
       
      GIVEN:
      A. If god is both able and willing to prevent evil, then evil would not exist.
      B. If god is neither able nor willing to prevent evil, then god is neither all-loving nor all-powerful. 
       
      PROGRESSION:
      1. If god is able to prevent evil, but not willing to, then god is not all-loving. 
      2. If god is willing to prevent evil, but not able to, then god is not all-powerful.
       
      CONCLUSION: The proposition that god is both all-loving and all-powerful is not true.
       
      DISCUSSION: It is possible that god is all-loving but not all-powerful.  It is possible that god is all-powerful but not all-loving.  It is possible that god is neither all-loving nor all-powerful, which raises the question: why worship god?
       
      But it is not possible for god to be both all-loving and all-powerful. 
       
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      • 85 replies
    • My ex christian beliefs are as follows in 10 simple points, each of which has been the focus of one debate / discussion or another around here: 
       
      1 ) I believe that all religions are man made social constructs geared towards politicizing ancient mythology and folklore. 
      2 ) I believe that no one really knows with certainty the answer to the question of origins or destination. 
      3 ) I believe that the bible is demonstrably false from the outset as a guide to the truth of the universe or the human condition. 
      4 ) I believe that anything basing itself on the assumption that the bible is true is automatically false, as the bible is demonstrably false. 
      5 ) I believe that morality is an evolved concept which continues to evolve and has never been static or handed down from on high. 
      6 ) I believe that the morality of the biblical writings is long since outdated and mostly irrelevant to modern society. 
      7 ) I believe that modern scholarship has revealed the truth about the biblical writings and the evolving theistic concepts contained therein. 
      8 ) I believe that it's both intellectually honest and well intended to expose what truths can be demonstrated about the bible and christianity, through counter apologetics. 
      9 ) I believe that as painful as it may be at times, it's ultimately for the greater good that christianity and similar religions are losing membership and declining into the future under the weight of their own growing lack of relevance. 
      10 ) I believe that humanity doesn't need the fluff and circus show of religion in order for people to do what's right, be decent, and get along. 
       
       
      What do you believe???? 
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      • 11 replies
    • Is there sufficient evidence to believe complex life could have evolved on its own from non-life without some intelligent creative force?  Is it at all plausible that some intelligent being, perhaps from another universe, could have been the creator of the complex life on our planet (and any other planet in this universe that may have complex life) using evolution as a tool? 
       
      • 67 replies
    • "No bibles, no preaching, no god-bothering!" These were the conditions B put upon his two brothers, who had recently converted to Pentecostal Christianity, if he were to visit them while on holidays. What happened next would change the course of his life and still continues to impact who he is today.
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    • I owe pittsburghjoe, along with every member participating in this discussion 
      for helping free me from my former Christian belief.
       
      I'm forced to admit to myself and anyone reading here that as a Christian I had never truly considered the extent to which all Christian belief rests upon the silly-assed irrational concept of "original sin".
       
      There was no one in the Garden with an iPhone recording video, people.
      There was no one there with a quill and scroll of parchment writing it all down.
      There were no eye-witnesses at all.
       
      It's a MYTH.  A silly, ancient myth.
       
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    • Yeah that sure opened a can of worms as far as Christianity was concerned.     She’s not crazy about it, but she accepts it as a done deal, pretty much.  It bothers her that I won’t pray when some challenge arises.   Or any other time… I must say it’s gone better than I had feared, and better than it has for many couples.  It helps that we are each other’s best friend and that our relationship did not revolve around our faith.  It’s not ideal though and there’s always the potential for it to cause problems.  She is not averse to questioning aspects of Christianity but  she’d have a hard time with the idea of there being no god.  
    • @TABA You're right. And if YHWH was really trying to get in front of things, he would've smited Gutenberg when he had the chance... Might I ask how your wife feels about your non-belief now? I'm the only black sheep in my immediate family. 
    • I can understand their concern.  It’s possible I would still be a Christian today if it weren’t for e-books, so they surely are of the devil.  Back in 2014 or so when I started questioning Christianity in earnest, books by skeptics and atheists were much easier to come by in electronic format.     Also much easier to conceal: a stack of atheist books on my nightstand might have tipped my wife off that all was not well with my faith, at a time when I wasn’t nearly ready to reveal my growing skepticism.  I did later, gradually and when the timing was right.   So it really is a bit careless of YHWH to allow counter-apologetics to circulate so easily, when he was so quick to smite the Tower of Babel.  But I guess he was much younger and more on his game back then…
    • Some philosophies are interesting, but way out there.
    • @TABAwhile I do appreciate the heads up, you should know that digital books were (correctly) labeled blasphemous at the Council of Mycaea in 2013. Paperback, or for the especially pious, hardback, are the only formats that shall be allowed into the kingdom of heaven. 👼  
    • Yeah, me too. But despite this I joined the debating team
    • Poland was 90% catholics. But: “Devastating” decline in religious practice among young Poles, says Catholic primate Vatican punishes Polish bishops over “negligent” response to child sex abuse https://notesfrompoland.com/2022/01/03/devastating-decline-in-religious-practice-among-young-poles-says-catholic-primate/ and the latest: Activists accuse Polish government of murder over death of woman, 37, pregnant with twins who was forced to carry a dead foetus in her womb for a week due to new abortion laws https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10451619/Activists-accuse-Polish-government-murder-death-pregnant-woman-37-refused-abortion.html   Anything to do with abortion comes from the men in frocks of the catholic church.   To use an old joke: Why do priests wear frocks? Because the little boys would run away when they heard priests unzipping their trousers.   Why should people who are not christians be forced to obey laws made by christians?   In Britain, this abomination is made worse by 26 unelected bishops sitting in the House of Lords who don't give a damn about anyone else and who vote according to their superstition against abortions, assisted dying and so on.   Priests are even in hospitals, like evil vultures to terrify sick and dying people with their vile lies about eternal torture in Hell, if they do not obey them.
    • Where did everything come from?   Amazon. Duh.   And now for something completely different... Some would say there aren't any "things" at all! Once you go Zen you can never go back 😁  
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