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    3. Testimonies of Former Christians

      Help encourage someone else who is trying to deprogram themselves from religion - tell them how you did it or are doing it.

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    • My ex christian beliefs are as follows in 10 simple points, each of which has been the focus of one debate / discussion or another around here: 
      1 ) I believe that all religions are man made social constructs geared towards politicizing ancient mythology and folklore. 
      2 ) I believe that no one really knows with certainty the answer to the question of origins or destination. 
      3 ) I believe that the bible is demonstrably false from the outset as a guide to the truth of the universe or the human condition. 
      4 ) I believe that anything basing itself on the assumption that the bible is true is automatically false, as the bible is demonstrably false. 
      5 ) I believe that morality is an evolved concept which continues to evolve and has never been static or handed down from on high. 
      6 ) I believe that the morality of the biblical writings is long since outdated and mostly irrelevant to modern society. 
      7 ) I believe that modern scholarship has revealed the truth about the biblical writings and the evolving theistic concepts contained therein. 
      8 ) I believe that it's both intellectually honest and well intended to expose what truths can be demonstrated about the bible and christianity, through counter apologetics. 
      9 ) I believe that as painful as it may be at times, it's ultimately for the greater good that christianity and similar religions are losing membership and declining into the future under the weight of their own growing lack of relevance. 
      10 ) I believe that humanity doesn't need the fluff and circus show of religion in order for people to do what's right, be decent, and get along. 
      What do you believe???? 
        • Thanks
        • Like
      • 11 replies
    • Is there sufficient evidence to believe complex life could have evolved on its own from non-life without some intelligent creative force?  Is it at all plausible that some intelligent being, perhaps from another universe, could have been the creator of the complex life on our planet (and any other planet in this universe that may have complex life) using evolution as a tool? 
      • 67 replies
    • "No bibles, no preaching, no god-bothering!" These were the conditions B put upon his two brothers, who had recently converted to Pentecostal Christianity, if he were to visit them while on holidays. What happened next would change the course of his life and still continues to impact who he is today.
      View the full article
      • 0 replies
    • I owe pittsburghjoe, along with every member participating in this discussion 
      for helping free me from my former Christian belief.
      I'm forced to admit to myself and anyone reading here that as a Christian I had never truly considered the extent to which all Christian belief rests upon the silly-assed irrational concept of "original sin".
      There was no one in the Garden with an iPhone recording video, people.
      There was no one there with a quill and scroll of parchment writing it all down.
      There were no eye-witnesses at all.
      It's a MYTH.  A silly, ancient myth.
        • Like
    • My attached short essay on Precession as the Framework of Christian Origins was published last year as an Appendix in The Christ Conspiracy Second Edition by DM Murdock (Acharya S).  (4000 words)
      I helped Dr Robert M. Price to edit this new second edition. This book was quite controversial when it first came out in 1999, with its uncompromising presentation of the hypothesis that the myth of Jesus Christ arose as a personification of the Sun.  I agree with this argument, and consider that it presents a complex and coherent perspective on religion.
      Before her death in 2015, Acharya began editing her planned CC second edition, aiming to remove some of the more contentious material and present her main arguments more clearly. I had worked closely with her on some areas of her analysis of astrotheology, so was pleased to be able to help with this work, and enjoyed going through the book in detail to edit it. 
      My own long term theological interest is in this topic of Precession as the Framework of Christian Origins, which I consider provides a compelling scientific explanation of many of the perspectives that Acharya presents. This idea helps to explain the role of conspiracy in Christianity, firstly among the secret Gnostic mystic philosophers who first developed the Christ Myth as allegory, and secondly in the orthodox church, as they systematically rewrote Christian origins to exclude its founding natural cosmology and pretend that the events described in the Gospels actually happened.  
      As a hypothesis, the precession hypothesis raises such controversial material that it is difficult to discuss. The essential argument is that Jesus Christ was deliberately invented as avatar of the zodiac ages of Pisces and Aquarius. I think this idea should be of interest to ex-Christians, as a way to help excavate the abiding truths that are hidden beneath the supernatural rubble of Christendom. 
      I would welcome any questions or critique or conversation about the ideas in this paper.
      Precession as the Framework of Christian Origins by Robert Tulip, published in The Christ Conspiracy Second Edition.pdf
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      • 101 replies
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    • The relevant statistic is ICU availability, and that seems pretty cut and dried. Hospitals report how many of their ICU beds are occupied and how many of those are COVID related. COVID patients who do not need intensive care are segregated and census is taken every day. The hospital I frequent for blood work and imaging has started shifts an hour earlier recently, though they are by no means in crisis. Part of it is that people who have been waiting to have procedures done are just finally going ahead with them and not waiting any longer for the virus to go away.
    • From what I have read, many people who test positive for COVID and go to the hospital, never have symptoms. Some fake their symptoms after testi8ng positive so they can stay in the hospital because of their fear of COVID -- but they were never sick at all, not even a higher temperature, cough or sneeze. But many may have serious anxiety because of their positive test. At least one nurse discussing this problem mentioned that many of these people are on social welfare whereby the government pays for their hospital stay, sometimes weeks until they test negative.  They do not want to go home to infect their spouse, children, relatives, or neighbors.   of course such people unnecessarily fill up hospitals and mess up the related statistics. overestimating the quantity of people who are really sick.
    • There is also the problem of hospitals being full and people having to travel to find an open spot, some not finding one. I'm not sure if the reporting happens when someone finally finds an open spot and the hospital handles the reporting or some other way.  
    • I get that, but I'm only looking at one set of people sharing the same testing protocols and behavior patterns. I'm looking at months of data. What made me take notice early on was when Miami-Dade (which I mistakenly referred to in my text as Hillsborough) had by far the highest rate of vaccinations yet had more daily cases per 100k than my own county which was slow to vaccinate. There are virtually no public health mandates in the state so the majority still carry on as if nothing's going on - that behavior doesn't change but all the statistics do just as if one month we have mask mandates/lockdown and the next we're wide open for business as usual. Hospitals fill and empty, fill and empty, as our behavior never changes. A county with nearly twice the vaccination rate of another county doesn't do any better with the numbers, and that's just one thing that doesn't make sense to me. On paper stats and ICU admissions the virus seems to do what it does independent of our efforts or lack thereof. I'm really starting to wonder if when we do institute some safety protocol and virus activity declines, perhaps it's coincidence because the opposite also has happened.
    • Yeah Florduh,   There are a number of problems relating to the understandings of what is going on with COVID. Each state has different rules and testing abilities and facilities to handle their cases, their case statistics, and the results in the US from state to state cannot be consistent. There are many opinions concerning logical analysis of the results, often with conflicting opinions.   But here’s my opinion.   Of the great many people tested randomly and who test positive for COVID,  have no symptoms at all. This estimate is thought to be about 30%., and 40% for or the US.. Of these, about 11% come down with a mild case of COVID in the coming two weeks, and about 1.5 % with a more serious case.   For those people who have a COVID test because they have symptoms of some kind, only about 4% test positive for COVID.   https://hartfordhealthcare.org/about-us/news-press/news-detail?articleId=29806&publicid=743#:~:text=The%20South%20Korean%20estimate%20of,%2D19%20are%20asymptomatic.   Also 2-3% of those tested yield a false positive. This is known by those who have a verification test following their positive test. Other pathogens like the papilloma virus also can give a false positive for COVID for the great many people who have it.   Other testing problems and false results are explained below.   https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices/letters-health-care-providers/potential-false-positive-results-antigen-tests-rapid-detection-sars-cov-2-letter-clinical-laboratory   Death rates have now dropped for COVID patients when the patient’s immune system is suppressed, by keeping these patient’s immune system from killing them, a type of allergic reaction to COVID which builds up lung fluids that drown them. Deaths for this reason have dropped from 18% to about 4%.   One problem with statistics is that if someone has a terminal disease like terminal cancer, and if in an autopsy they test positive for COVID, .their death will be reported as death from COVID based upon the rules for most states. This is true for all terminal diseases.   The percentage of US hospitalized patients in the US who died from the flu and pneumonia, have been higher than those who died from COVID during this pandemic.   https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/pdf/covidview.pdf   I was in Sweden just a few weeks ago, No masks, social distancing, businesses closings, restaurants and bars stayed open. Most everything is voluntary. Recommended social distancing for restaurants, bars, businesses where people work in close quarters, For certain workers they recommend working from home when possible.   They have the same or fewer problems from COVID as the US, and very few people wear masks or adhere to social distancing. It looks like the US before COVID.  They promote vaccinations the same as in the US, as do nearly all the countries of the world.   Germany, on the other hand has rules similar to what we have here in most states, so it’s not so much fun there. They have made social distancing exceptions for bars and restaurant which is better IMO  But to go into many bars and restaurants you must show your vaccination card.   Here are other opinions concerning false opinions and the seriousness of COVID in the US.   https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2020/12/04/covid-conspiracy-why-people-dont-believe-deadly-pandemic-misinformation/3803737001/  
    • A few things could be happening: Variations in time of reporting (e.g. reporting all the weekend cases on Monday, making it look like the caseload tripled overnight). Weather variations (e.g. people spending more time indoors when it's particularly rainy, and more cases showing up a few days later). Or their data collection is just plain sloppy.
    • Hopefully in my own Harem with 100 virgins. In my harem  the girls do not have to be 9 years old like Mohammad's second wife who he said he never had relations with until she went into puberty. Instead all my girls can be 16 years and older as long as long as they are pretty, sexy, and virgins. The problem for me to achieve this goal is twofold. First, there aren't very many pretty, sexy girls 16 and older who are still virgins. But my second problem is even bigger; I'm not willing to die in a suicide bombing.
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