Lunar Shadow Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Hello all, New guy in town here looking for some help. I am looking for some good reading that gives some good solid arguments against Christianity. I know about people like Richard Carrier and Infedels.net but that’s where my resources end -- any help you guys can offer would be much appreciated. I am recently deconverted Christian of 18+ years I grew up the son of a theology professor forced to go to church every Sunday and Wednesday. I am at this point looking for answers but I am sure as Hell that I am NOT going back to the LIE that I have wasted my life on known as Christianity. I feel as if I am the only one in the world who has come to the conclusion that Christianity is a crock. Anyone else out there?? Thanx, Jester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitchu Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome to Dave's House, Jester. You've come to the right place. Lots of smart people here who'll make recommendations for reading and pursuing. The home page has lots of suggestions, too. Maybe even more important is the camaraderie and steady supportiveness of those who gather here. Rant, question, offer, jump in anywhere, and have a good time while you're at it. Breathe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Slayer-2004 Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 depends , what was your main reason for deconverting ? Logical fallacies in the bible ? Contradictions ? False prophecies ? The problem of hell and love ? I have a pretty long list myself . PS - you are in the minority , but your not alone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 While I don't know of any specifically anti-Christian books (that have well developed arguments), Elaine Pagels offers some nice books. Any books from secular authors on the historical Jesus and the history of the early Christians might help too. If my internet service weren't being a pain in the ass right now, I'd give you some links. Sorry! Welcome ot the forums! I hope you like it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunar Shadow Posted May 26, 2005 Author Share Posted May 26, 2005 depends , what was your main reason for deconverting ? Logical fallacies in the bible ? Contradictions ? False prophecies ? The problem of hell and love ? I have a pretty long list myself . PS - you are in the minority , but your not alone I would have to say all of the above. I was lucky enough to have some one open my eyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome to the forum, Jester. Hey! How do we know that you're really serious with a name like that? If you haven't stumbled across the archive section of ExC yet, CLICK HERE. There's plenty of reading material there. Enjoy your stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Hello all, New guy in town here looking for some help. I am looking for some good reading that gives some good solid arguments against Christianity. I know about people like Richard Carrier and Infedels.net but that’s where my resources end -- any help you guys can offer would be much appreciated. You don't need to have arguments against Christianity.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSpooky Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Atheism: The Case Against God, by George H. Smith. Best philosophy out there in terms of epistemology and metaphysics. Heck, I'm teaching a class this coming semester using Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunar Shadow Posted May 26, 2005 Author Share Posted May 26, 2005 You don't need to have arguments against Christianity.... When I say that it is a 2 sided statement one is that I find stuff like this to be incredibly interesting and 2 I am in the process on learning how to structure arguments and put up points that are not so easily smacked down. I am pretty sure that one way to do that is to increase my knowledge base. But then again I have found even my (weak) arguments with Christians seem to work due to the fact that most of them like to use circular arguments and apologetics and just dodge the issue all together. When you call them on it they act like it never happened. So needless to say I am a little frustrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome to the forum Jester. I'll give you the name of a good book and a wonderful website, It will take days to read the website as their is so much there, but it's all very fascinating. The Jesus Mysteries By Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy, Show's the Pagan roots of Xtianity. Also, there is a wonderful website that helped me alot, It has a lot of info on the pagan roots, Christ's original religion and contradictions in the bible. It was put together by a former Xtin Pastor.. It's one of my favorite Sites. There are many links on this page: BET EMET MINISTRIES.......OUR VARIOUS WEBSITES FOR YOUR STUDY Lots on "sun" worship and how it relates to Xtinanity here. THE PAGANIZATION OF THE FAITH OF YESHUA ...AND THE BIRTH OF "GENTILE CHRISTIANITY" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome Jester, Here's some sites that helped me when I deconverted: Freedom From Religion Foundation Freethough Firefighters The Jesus Puzzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome Jester, Here's some sites that helped me when I deconverted: Freedom From Religion Foundation Freethough Firefighters The Jesus Puzzle YES, he Jesus Puzzle is another great one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 When I say that it is a 2 sided statement one is that I find stuff like this to be incredibly interesting and 2 I am in the process on learning how to structure arguments and put up points that are not so easily smacked down. I am pretty sure that one way to do that is to increase my knowledge base. Best learning is practice. You joined the right place to debate and state your opinions. This site is a good place to increase your knowledge, and complement your list of arguments against religion. But then again I have found even my (weak) arguments with Christians seem to work due to the fact that most of them like to use circular arguments and apologetics and just dodge the issue all together. When you call them on it they act like it never happened. So needless to say I am a little frustrated. You’re absolutely right. Today I say that "my Mind is my Bible". Just break apart their reasoning, and you usually find the fallacies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokmer Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome, Jester! I was wondering when you'd make it in here. Another place to look is in the Other archives - the one which archives valuable threads from past incarnations of the forum. You can find it at this link here. The search function does not yet work, but I'd recommend straight off reading the thread in the Debates section of the archive entitled "Josephus and the Testimonium Flavium" which deals with a lot of the apologetic roadblocks you've been stumbling over. You'll find good people here. I'm glad you made it! -Lokmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanakila Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Welcome Jester. It's great to see you here where you will find alot of information as well as a great group of friends, that are as close to a family as any church I ever belonged to. I love it here, and think you will too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokmer Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Jester - A good overview of the weaknesses in the Christian story and dogma, very well referenced (though he occasionally overreaches rehtorically) can be found here, at Paul Tobin's site. Enjoy! -Lokmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Jester, Welcome here! While there are numerous websites out there for the case against Christianity, against biblical errancy, etc, these sources must be weighed for their quality. While I like Paul Tobin's site, there are some sources I can only recommend to a cautious extent, and some resources I cannot in good faith recommend. Cautious examples would be Farrell Till's The Skeptical Review although Till has both good articles, mediocre articles, and some real stinkers. I would consider that The Skeptic's Annotated Bible to be another one. Carrier and Price are the best on the web while Acharya S and C Dennis McKinsey are probably among the worst out there. If you have any questions you can always ask us Matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted May 27, 2005 Share Posted May 27, 2005 Welcome, Jester. Since Christianity is supposed to be based on a solid foundation of Judaism, and claims to be a "fulfillment" of Judaism, you might want to find out why two thousand years of scholarly rabbis didn't just jump right up and become Christian. Christians have a couple of tawdry and shameful answers for that of course, but if those answers might possibly not be true, then they would be terrible slanders. One would think that that many serious Jewish theologians would be able to recognize their own messiah, wouldn't you agree? Here's what the rabbis say about it. Get it from the horse's mouth. Jews For Judaism (An answer to that despicable "Jews For Jesus" group.) Loren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokmer Posted May 27, 2005 Share Posted May 27, 2005 Oooh, that's a very good one Loren. As usual, you rock! -Lokmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtdude Posted May 27, 2005 Share Posted May 27, 2005 Welcome Jester, I have found re-reading parts of the bible to shore up my disagreements with christianity. I just read last evening in Joshua about the murder of the inhabitants of Ai: god found it necessary for all of the men and women to be slaughtered after taking the city. Any religion that has a god like that is just too weird for me. If you like reading fiction, E.M. Forster's book, "Maurice" presents an interesting argument for deconversion in the middle of a great novel. The articles by Dan Barker (google him) are really lucid and a great read. He's probably my favorite: passionate but not bitter. Also, on the old "Testimonies" forum, go to 9/12/04 and read ficino's story, "Time to say yes to life." He's a good writer and has ordered his arguments and thoughts extremely well. The webmaster's story is another good one that has given me a lot to ponder. Good luck and again, welcome. Curtdude San Francisco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunar Shadow Posted May 28, 2005 Author Share Posted May 28, 2005 Welcome Jester. It's great to see you here where you will find alot of information as well as a great group of friends, that are as close to a family as any church I ever belonged to. I love it here, and think you will too. I doubt that Lanaklia, because I never found a church with the closeness of family maybe I just never found the right one but oh well I guess. Thank you all for the mounds of reading that you have bestowed upon me I will be busy for quite a while but that’s a good thing. I could say you all have no idea how much this helps but you probably know cuz you all have been where I am now. oh I did forget to mention I am in the San Fran bay area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NakedSmurf Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Umm, Hi! I'm Jester's Wife. I'm 24 and was raised with the idea that as long as you believe in something. It doesn't matter if you're a Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, etc... (Just as long as your not Catholic or a Moron.. opps I mean Mormon). So, that is my background in a nutshell. So, Umm Yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Welcome, Naked Smurf! I hope you enjoy the site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexkitten Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 Welcome to the board, and hope you find what you're looking for here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Techster Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Hi Jester. Congrats on your new found Freedom! Here's some good links for you: http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/ http://members.aol.com/ckbloomfld/ http://www.geocities.com/wwu777us/Debunkin...n_Arguments.htm http://www.ctyme.com/bwash/bwash.htm#d http://members.aol.com/chasklu/religion/pr...e/question.html http://www.bidstrup.com/bible.htm http://www.outreachjudaism.org/response.html Please let me know if you would like additional links. I hope,I know these will help you. Best, Techster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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