Guest stinky-tofu Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 I attended a wake tonight for a friend who was a Christian. I met her husband, who is very religious, and expressed my sadness about his wife's death. We discussed how she'd lived for nearly five years after her cancer diagnosis, finally succumbing at the age of 43. He said, "It's a miracle." Then, as if trying to convince himself, he repeated, "It *is* a miracle." Let's see now, it isn't a "miracle" that modern medicine kept her alive and hopeful for 4 years. No, that's science. So what's the miracle? That god chose to torture her for five years with chemo- and radiation therapy, then finally to kill her when it looked like she'd survive? I guess he'd say that god was testing her to see if she was worthy. But wait, god is omniscient, so he'd know already even before torturing her. Maybe he'd say that she's in a better place, that god needed her there. So why did god make her suffer for five years? Maybe we learn something from suffering and god wanted her to grow in knowledge. But god could just put that knowledge in her head without the need for torture. If god is omniscient, he could eliminate suffering, but I guess he won't because he seems to really enjoy watching. I guess the BTK killer helped people grow by allowing them to understand suffering. He tested people to see what kind of character they really had. Maybe religious people should just worship the BTK killer. He seems very god-like, and at least we know he existed. Actually, Catholic priests who abuse little boys help those boys to grow through pain and suffering. That's why they do it! That's why the pope won't stop it! Praise Jesus! I understand it all now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 Stinky tofu, welcome to the forum. I can see why the rant. That's heavy stuff. Thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garrisonjj Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 I attended a wake tonight for a Good post! I am so sorry for your friend. As far as god-religion is concerned, this story had been repeated so many times in my family it finally made me disbelieve. Yea,a jesusfuckinchrist miracle allright! That person's suffering and the pain and loss of her family must just glorify fuckin god to no extent. But the holy rollers will tell you you gotta have faith! Faith in what? A sadist? Also, those priests abusing young now resulted in millions of people (myself included) quitting the catholic church and empty schools. Now they are begging for your prayers! Oh yea, fuck the prayers, send more dollars! Thanks for the painful post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknowing1 Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 Welcome. Please know how sorry I am about the death of your friend. It is never easy to lose someone we care about and to see them improve, get worse and put up such a fight over such a long period of time is very hard. You make very valid points, points I don't think anyone here would dispute. Being a former x-tain I can see why your friends husband said what he said, he was trying to find something good out of something so bad and was falling back on what he has be brainwashed to believe. But like you said I don't believe he would be able to justify any part of it as a miracle if he really thought about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 Then, as if trying to convince himself, he repeated, "It *is* a miracle." I think you said it all right there. Trying to convince himself. Because he knows, deep down, there were no miracles here. No trace of god in any of it. Just cancer and death. No help to be had, in spite of all the prayers. Sad. But not as sad as trying to somehow find a miracle there. The poor guy is going to spend a lot of time by himself saying "what the fuck, God?" Sorry for the loss of your friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stinky-tofu Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 Thanks to all of you for your understanding. I needed to get that off my chest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naughtyhamster Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 This thread reminds me of the website for an organization created by a guy that created a Make-A- Wish kind of organization before he died of cancer. As he was a student at the school I attended sometimes I hear xtian students ( some of them were friends of his) chatting of "what a miracle!" it was for him to create an organization before his demise. I thought "What the fuck?! So God had to torture this intelligent (he graduated from highschool when he was fifteen), big hearted guy for almost five years so he could start an organization to grant wishes for sick kids whose wishes were for tutoring in the arts?!" This guy's death was one of the many reasons I left the xtian religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Neil Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 I think some Christians are just desperate for miracles. Subconsciously, they know that they'll never actually get a true miracle, so they start looking to mundane coincidences or hard luck stories with happy endings. If some good can come out of a terrible situation, then it's a "miracle". I think we all have funeral stories where we hear something that's supposed to sound good and uplifting but is actually either nonsensical or utterly disgusting. My own grandmother died this year, and while she wasn't particularly religious (she actually stopped attending church decades ago), the wake and funeral were notably religious. I know the feeling all too well. You're there to remember a person for who they were, and you can't help noticing the fanciful way in which other family members try to superimposed mythical/spiritual meanings over the situation. In many cases, I can't help but see their beliefs, that this person has somehow lives on in a higher plane, as a complete denial of what has actually happened. The most disgusting thing I heard at my grandmother's funeral was when one family member (I won't say who) suggested that she was up in heaven, holding my dead neice in her lap. It was that point that I nearly got up and walked out of the building. But I suppose I'm derailing this topic a bit. The point here is that people seem to miss the point of services for the recently departed. They try to so hard to create meaningfulness out pain and suffering, when they should really just be thinking about the good times they had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pseudovillain Posted October 22, 2006 Share Posted October 22, 2006 This reminds me of a recent death of someone at my parents' church. His family had planned no funeral for him, because they were convinced it wasn't God's will for him to die yet. And then when he did die, they were convinced he would be resurrected. It's really sad that these people put so much of their hope into something that, in the end, lets them down. It makes me angry that people preach this stuff, causing people to rely on something that isn't there, that can never help them when they really need it. It'll give them a day without rain, or a parking spot close to the entrance, but when it comes to the things that really matter... God says, "Well, fuck you. I don't actually care that much." Of course, everyone dies, and this person was in his old age, so it's not something entirely unexpected. What bothers me is that his family had so much faith that it wasn't his time to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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