Is There A God?

[Brother Jeff]

I was browsing the Net the other day when the Spook of Kryasst who is also somehow magically Him magically caused me to find this page. The following is Part One of my response to Sister Marilyn:

 

Sister Marilyn: Just once wouldn’t you love for someone to simply show you the evidence for God’s existence?

 

Brother Jeff: Yes, I certainly would, but to date not one Christian who has visited this site has been able to do so.

 

Sister Marilyn: If a person opposes even the possibility of there being a God, then any evidence can be rationalized or explained away.

 

Brother Jeff: The problem that Christians have isn’t that evidence can be rationalized or explained away. The problem is that there is no evidence that a god of any kind actually exists - yours or anyone else’s. I’m not opposed to the possibility of there being a God. After all, I am an ex-Christian. I simply don’t see any evidence that your god or any other actually does exist.

 

Sister Marilyn: When it comes to the possibility of God’s existence, the Bible says that there are people who have seen sufficient evidence, but they have suppressed the truth about God.

 

Brother Jeff: I am not a student of religions besides Christianity, but I would be willing to bet that every holy book has some similar statement. Why should I believe your holy book over others that say basically the same thing? I am not guilty of suppressing the “truth” about God. I simply do not believe that there is a God.

 

Sister Marilyn: On the other hand, for those who want to know God if he is there, he says, “You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart, I will be found by you.”

 

Brother Jeff: What about the many people - ex-Christians among them - who have diligently and sincerely sought out God only to find nothing and only to get deafening silence in return for their prayers? I submit that this promise of the Bible is as false as the God of the Bible.

 

Sister Marilyn: If God does exist, would I want to know him?

 

Brother Jeff: Good question! Let’s take a brief look at the character of the God of the Bible. See this link and this link and then tell me if I should want to know that God or not.

 

Sister Marilyn: The complexity of our planet points to a deliberate Designer who not only created our universe, but sustains it today.

 

Brother Jeff: No, it doesn’t. See this link. "God" used to be the ignorance-based answer, but we now know that the complexity of our planet points not to a Creator but to the fact of biological evolution.

 

Sister Marilyn: The Earth…its size is perfect. The Earth’s size and corresponding gravity holds a thin layer of mostly nitrogen and oxygen gases, only extending about 50 miles above the Earth’s surface. If Earth were smaller, an atmosphere would be impossible, like the planet Mercury. If Earth were larger, its atmosphere would contain free hydrogen, like Jupiter.3 Earth is the only known planet equipped with an atmosphere of the right mixture of gases to sustain plant, animal and human life.

 

Brother Jeff: The Earth’s size is what it is. There is nothing miraculous about it. See this link on the many problems of the fine-tuning argument. I might also mention that while Earth is the only currently known planet that supports life as we know it, it is very likely not the only one in the universe or even our galaxy that does.

 

Sister Marilyn: The Earth is located the right distance from the sun. Consider the temperature swings we encounter, roughly -30 degrees to +120 degrees. If the Earth were any further away from the sun, we would all freeze. Any closer and we would burn up. Even a fractional variance in the Earth’s position to the sun would make life on Earth impossible. The Earth remains this perfect distance from the sun while it rotates around the sun at a speed of nearly 67,000 mph. It is also rotating on its axis, allowing the entire surface of the Earth to be properly warmed and cooled every day.

 

Brother Jeff: See the link given above on fine-tuning arguments. The orbit of the Earth around the sun actually varies considerably over time in terms of distances. No two orbits are ever the same. It is a fact that the Earth could support life from an orbital position halfway to Venus all the way to the orbit of Mars, so the Earth’s current orbit is by no means somehow a “perfect” one. The Earth’s speed through space also varies considerably over time. Planets do not travel at constant speeds. I should also point out that it should not be surprising that the environment we live in seems suited to us, because we evolved in the environment, the environment did not evolve to suit us!

 

Sister Marilyn: The human brain’s complexity shows a higher intelligence behind it.

 

Brother Jeff: No, it doesn’t. Biological evolution and genetics explain the complexity of the human brain beautifully without referencing a “higher intelligence”. See this link on the "gene that made us human".

 

Sister Marilyn: The human brain processes more than a million messages a second.7 Your brain weighs the importance of all this data, filtering out the relatively unimportant. This screening function is what allows you to focus and operate effectively in your world. A brain that deals with more than a million pieces of information every second, while evaluating its importance and allowing you to act on the most pertinent information… did it come about just by chance? Was it merely biological causes, perfectly forming the right tissue, blood flow, neurons, structure? An astounding an organ that it is, it surpasses being functional. There is an intelligence to it, the ability to reason, feel, move and relate. How does one explain the human brain?

 

Brother Jeff: You clearly, as is the case with most religious fundamentalists, do not understand science or biological evolution. The human brain did not arise just by chance. It is a product of millions of years of biological evolution driven by natural selection - NOT chance. How does one explain the human brain? Easily - evolution and genetics!

 

To be continued…

[Mr. Neil]

Sister Marilyn: If a person opposes even the possibility of there being a God, then any evidence can be rationalized or explained away.

Projections, pure and simple. I'm really getting tired of believers using that. That's usually what it comes down to after you've defeated all of their arguments. If they don't blatantly fall back upon the argument from ignorance, they jump instantly to an ad hominem and pretends as though they know your motives.

[jauggy]

Sister Marilyn: If a person opposes even the possibility of there being a God, then any evidence can be rationalized or explained away.

If God is omnipotent - surely he can provide evidence of his existence and tell us which is the correct religious text (if any) so that there is no doubt in our mind what is truth. If he can't do that - then he is not omnipotent.