Llwellyn Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 I think that we as ex-Christians need to squarely address that possibility that Christians are correct about hell. We need to make some contingency plans to determine what we shall do and how we'll react if it should turn out that the Bible is 100% accurate. By deliberately thinking through this matter and coming to some decisions that we can live by, we can solve several problems: (1) We will eliminate a lot of anxiety and "what if" doubts. Instead of saying "Oh it's not true," while having sneaking "what if" doubts, we can put the issues to bed without worrying in the future. (2) We will avoid that embarrassing "death bed conversion" because we would have made our carefully thought out choices decades earlier. (3) We will have an answer every time a Christian poses the Pascal's Wager or asks us "But what if it's true?" So, how would you maintain your hope, composure, and infedility in face of the prospect that Yahweh, a God of vengeance and pardon by faith, exists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piprus Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 Llewellyn, it looks like you have a hell-fear. I see no need to make any contingency plans, and I see no evidence that the bible is anything other than a compilation mainly of folktales. Personally, I have no "what if" doubts. The issue of maintaining composure, to me, is a non-issue. I see no evidence that Yahweh, or any other god, is real. There is no more evidence for Yahweh or Jesus than there is for ogres and hobgoblins. The Pascal wager, to me, is not a basis for meaningful discussion. There really is no "wager" at all, and my beliefs, or lack of them, does not involve a gamble. Christians can pose all the "questions" they care to. It does not matter. The answer, in every case, is, "what is the evidence that what you say is true?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 How can hell logically exist? And even if it did, why should I worship a bully? For only a bully would threaten people with eternal torture if they did not bow down to him. You might as well worship Hitler or Saddam Hussein then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narcissist Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 If it really is worrying you, just say the sinners prayer and continue your ex-c life as it was. It's only a 'cosmic insurance policy' after all. You don't need to go to church and do the xn stuff to experience the 'benefits' of eternal salvation. An alternative and possibly more cynical view is this: God is a malevolent prick. All my life he's done nothing but hurl crap an misery at me. When I die he can no longer touch me. If I go to heaven, then I'll be in a great place where there is no misery, playing the harp in my white robe, so he can't touch me there. If I go to hell, I am eternally separated from him, so he can't touch me there either. Possibly flawed but I don't care... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 Yes, it is a possibility, but technically, everything that we can't prove is a possibility. It's possible that pink flying unicorns exist, but not likely... same for hell. I mean really, a place of fire and brimstone, gnashing of teeth, and Satan? Forever? For not thinking the same way as whoever decides on who goes to hell? The whole thing just doesn't make sense and is obviously a scare tactic. I don't worry myself with it at all, but I understand where you're coming from because my husband has the same fear and it troubles him a great deal. Like narcissist, he just assumes that if God exists, God has to be the Christian God, except cruel and sadistic and incompetent as well as Creator and Judge. It doesn't make sense to me because I think that kind of thinking stems from a pathological fear of Hell instilled as a child. Sorry for the rant, I hope you can think your way out of this. I can't imagine having to deal with an emotional demon like that. *hugs* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 So, how would you maintain your hope, composure, and infedility in face of the prospect that Yahweh, a God of vengeance and pardon by faith, exists? Delete that "pardon by faith" part. I've made my decision quite some time ago, and it reads "if jehoover is real, it's the duty of every ethical human to spit in its face whenever you can". After all, the lying sadistic bastard, if real, can't be trusted as far as you can throw a battleship. If jebus personally came down and told me about that mercy part, I'd want his confession that all the monstrous crap in da wholly babble is nonsense, and his apology for him ever letting it get slipped into the book. If he then confirms that to me, I might start to think about it once more. Until then, he can kiss my arse. And "monstrous crap" definitely includes each and every thing that even hints at him not being kind and loving to all people, unconditionally. How can hell logically exist? And even if it did, why should I worship a bully? For only a bully would threaten people with eternal torture if they did not bow down to him. You might as well worship Hitler or Saddam Hussein then. Abso-fucking-lutely true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostOrFound Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 I think Llwellyn is just having a little fun. I don't get the impression that he's the least bit concerned. Along those lines, perhaps we should be reconsidering our rebellion against Posieden, as well. It's pretty damned obvious from the recent damaging hurricanes, typhoons and other disasters that Mr. P is pretty well fed up with being ignored! What might we do to appease him so as to avoid further planetary destruction and mayhem? Perhaps a monument or two would calm him for awhile. ?? BTW, I would be happy to spearhead the campaign to erect said monuments. Please send all donation to me, LostOrFound, at PO Box We'reAllFunkingIdiots, Jax, FL 55555 - Only certified funds please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piprus Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 BTW, I would be happy to spearhead the campaign to erect said monuments. Please send all donation to me, LostOrFound, at PO Box We'reAllFunkingIdiots, Jax, FL 55555 - Only certified funds please. The check's in the mail... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smellincoffee Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 I was thinking on this this weekend. I went to a church camp-out, and the guy in charge kept roasting hot dogs on the fire and making hell references ("See how black and burned that is? That's how we would be if not for the grace of God. Praise Jesus", things like that. I wanted to call him on how the idea a god who claims to be loving and just and the idea of Hell cannot be reconciled -- but it was neither the time nor the place. I'm can't come clean just yet, but if they ever try to hell-scare me.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderer Posted December 3, 2006 Share Posted December 3, 2006 Easy answer to dealing with Hell: 1. Reconvert 2. Become a Calvinist (Once saved, always saved.) 3. Deconvert again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chefranden Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 If it turns out to be so, I will attempt to start a riot by pointing out the emperor's lack of clothing. And if I get up to the throne, I will attempt to poke the old coot in the eye. In for a penny, in for a pound I'd say! But if you are really worried, follow the directions in Matthew 25: 31-46. That ought to be easy enough. Nothing in that requires any goofy beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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