Poonis Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 I have thought about this awhile, but have not really seen this discussed on our board, and by positing this, I suspect this topic may make me less than popular. If I am a true atheist, my rejection of theism also includes that of judaism. If I did not reject judaism, this would make me hypocrytical, as if to rail against all religions... except judaism. Just as I hold that all of christianity is absolute bullshit, I also contend the same for islam, judaism, and every other theistic ideology out there. Considering judaic doctrine is part of the christian bible, it is not possible to make this exception when one declares the bible is pure garbage. If I am to be true to myself, I cannot ignore this out of fear of retribution. Am I anti-semitic because I am an atheist? Why is it OK to rail against christianity and islam, but judaism is taboo? What makes judaism so special? If I remember correctly, the same god we as ex-christians rejected is the same god of the jews. According to christianity, the jews just have not accepted Jesus Christ as their savior (depending on the denomination of christianity you were indoctrinated with). The big 'dont-go-there' seems to revolve around the holocaust. Is this where we learned to metaphorically walk on eggshells? If so, I would like to logically point out that I had nothing to do with it, being I was born in 1979, and I am not sorry for something I did not do. Who here is afraid to touch this subject? *pandora's box now opened* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Depends on the definition... If you go by the most common one, that it's discrimination of Jews/prejudice and/or hostility towards Jews based simply on the fact they are Jews, then no... If you go by the less common one, that it's hostility and/or prejudice towards Jews or Judaism based simply on the fact that they are Jews/they believe in Judaism... then classing not believing Judaism/thinking it's a load of garbage and telling them so as Anti-Semantic would mean that everyone who isn't Judaic is Anti-Semantic. Thus, no... If you go by the stupid definition that it's Anti-Semantic to disagree with any Jew on any subject that comes up, then yes... Atheism is Anti-Semantic. But then again, so would everyone else in the world... (I said it was stupid) Basically, if Atheism makes you Anti-Semantic, so does believing in ANY theistic belief that isn't Judaism... Almost forgot... the Holocaust was against the Jews as a Semantic Genetic Group, not against their belief... so attacking the belief isn't wrong at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Some thoughts: I think it is possible to be completely against the ideas or beliefs held by a people and yet be completely for the people themselves. I think if anyone takes it upon themselves to rid a people of their beliefs then they would be most likely to succeed if they do so out of a love for those people. Open Minded recently showed me some words of Gandhi. Let us say that all those with theistic beliefs are in some sense our "enemy". Let us then posit that it is effective to love one's enemy. That is, that by loving them we are more likely to "defeat" them. What then are some genuinely good things about people with theistic beliefs? I think if we are ever to rid ourselves of theistic notions our motives and our methods will have to be utterly transparent. Nothing hidden. Why would we want to rid people of their belief in gods? And how would we go about doing that? Many of my friends and family are Christian. If I was motivated solely by ego to rid them of their beliefs, I think that is a piss poor motive. That is, if my motive is solely to "win" then what is the point? How will they benefit from my winning? Is it a fool's errand to try and control the subjective experience of another? Are we teachers or are we conquerers? Well there's a few quick thoughts off the top of my head. I don't like applying the term atheist to myself. I rarely think of myself in those terms. I am more inclined to be for naturalism than I am to be against supernaturalism. But I suppose that I fit the criteria for being an atheist. And I am not anti-semitic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 For people to think Atheists or all those who oppose Judaism are automatically anti-semetic is ridiculous. Judaism is a religion and being Jewish is an ethnicity. It's like saying that because I'm Polish in ancestry that I automatically follow Roman Catholicism, or to say that rejection of Roman Catholicism equals a rejection of the Polish people. I think Judaism is a crock of shit, as much so as Xianity, and only marginally more moral only because of the lack of the Hell doctrine and the fact that it's not a universalist religion, so Orthodox Jews pretty much keep their cult to themselves. They don't try to force it on others, unlike Xians or Mooselims. Otherwise, there are just as many reasons to reject Judaism as there are to reject the Old Testament, since Judaism is based on the writings of that book (as well as the Talmud, but certainly the Torah is more central). And it is from the Torah that we have Xianity and Is-lame, so I see nothing to like about that root of evil. Anyone who insist that haters of Judaism are haters of Jews is simply a bigoted moron indulging in persecution complexes and/or simply ignorant of the facts. Hell, there are plenty of Jews who are Atheists and want nothing to do with the cult of Moses, either. Edit: and being "Anti-semetic" means you hate all people of Semetic ethnicity, which includes Arabs and others, not just Jews. If hating a Semetic religion makes one an anti-Semite, then every Jew who opposes radical Is-lame is an anti-Semite as well. "Anti-Semite" is a grossly misunderstood phrase to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 A semite is, according to one dictionary, basically: a member of any of various ancient and modern peoples originating in southwestern Asia, including the Akkadians, Canaanites, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and Arabs. Yes, being anti-semitic can mean to be anti-Jew but rejecting their god and hating the people themselves are two different things and, I'm quite certain, even a Jew would agree. The xians supposedly LOVE the Jewish god but many of them throughout history are quite anti-Jew while there are many people in the world who could care less about said god and are indifferent about the Israelites/Jews (except for the fact their claimed territory always seems to be in turmoil). So, to be truly an anti-semite, you should hate all the groups I listed at the start of this post like I try to do. Damn Akkadians! I'm glad they're gone. And those Phoenicians with their alphabet. Who the hell do they think they are? Bastards. mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Am I anti-semitic because I am an atheist? Unbelief != discrimination. Case closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlerman Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Does being atheist mean being anti-anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramen666 Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 I think Christianity is more anti-semtic honestly. The reason I say that because creating the New Testament and making the Jews the cause of the death of Christ is one factor in anti-semitism. Is it possible that Christianity is the seed of anti-semitism? I think so on that but being an atheist and being anti-semitic is not the case. Me= atheist= anti semetic= no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taphophilia Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 I think that Jewish encompasses a heritage, a culture, and a relgion. Being against a religion or any religion does not take away our respect for the culture and heritage of a people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGJ@ReligionisBullshit Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 I honestly don't believe I am anti- any religious group even though I'm an atheist. To be anti you must be against and as far as I am concerned they can do anything they want within their own religion and within the laws governing their society. If being atheist required antitheist I would probably be something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGJ@ReligionisBullshit Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. I don't hate them for being Jewish, I hate them for being Israelis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. I don't hate them for being Jewish, I hate them for being Israelis. Doesn't matter, by not being for them, you're against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGJ@ReligionisBullshit Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. I don't hate them for being Jewish, I hate them for being Israelis. Doesn't matter, by not being for them, you're against them. No middle ground for jooos? You remind me of Bush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramen666 Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. I don't hate them for being Jewish, I hate them for being Israelis. Doesn't matter, by not being for them, you're against them. No middle ground for jooos? You remind me of Bush. No he doesn't remind me of Bush, he reminds me of Mel Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGJ@ReligionisBullshit Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whatever, we all hate Jews, just accept it. I don't hate them for being Jewish, I hate them for being Israelis. Doesn't matter, by not being for them, you're against them. No middle ground for jooos? You remind me of Bush. No he doesn't remind me of Bush, he reminds me of Mel Gibson. Yea him too. I said Bush because he said, "You are either with us or with the terrorists." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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