To Go or Not To Go

[Lilith]

Hubby told me last week, "I'm going to church this Sunday."

 

He announced it like he was announcing it to the world. His next question? "Do you want to come with me?"

 

Loooong, pregnant pause.

 

"No, I don't think so."

"Ok, I had to ask."

 

And he did ask....two more times. I told him (politely and gently) no both times. But I wonder...I am thinking it would be prudent for me to attend one service with him. First, so that everyone there doesn't automatically martyr him for being married to an unbelieving spouse (you all remember how you felt when you saw a married believer attend w/o their spouse, don't you?). And second, so that he knows I'm not a total ass when it comes to Christianity. I do kind of want to know what style of church he's attending. And if I see something really awful, he may even be open to listening to me. Maybe.

 

So....I think I will attend one service at least. Which leads to the "Been Borg Again" question: Do I tell anyone that I'm an apostate? Or do I just play along? I'm leaning toward tellin' 'em.

 

Oh...and he slept in this past Sunday (well...sorta ). I have a feeling he's going to ask me to go as a sort of Father's Day gift to him this coming Sunday. If he does, I'll tell him no, I won't go because it's Father's Day, but I'll attend once because it's important to you.

 

Advice?

[pandora]

Oh damn. I feel bad for you. I think it is an extraordinary expression of goodwill for you to go to a service. I don't think you could keep it up though. Just for his sake, however, I would not say either way what your beliefs are, but that only applies if he keeps attending. He may not like it.

 

Best of luck!

[Reach]

Appellation, it's your call.

 

I think you should do a cost/benefit analysis. There's no need for you to answer me on this, but you might think about these kinds of questions: Does it hurt you to go to church (once in awhile)? Does it help your husband? What will it cost you to go? Is the benefit of going worth the cost?

 

On disclosing your apostasy, the questions are similar. I would add that you have a right to privacy, if that is what you feel is best.

[Ouroboros]

That’s a difficult situation.

 

Maybe you need to be a little smart with this one, like pretending to some degree that you still believe, but that you have doubts. And then start having some discussions about faith with him. In a way, start working the ground, loosening up the dirt.

 

I understand your feeling, because when I de-converted, I didn’t tell my wife at first. It took a while before I decided to talk to her. And she admitted she was not a strong believer anymore either. After more discussions I know that she is more of a Deist or Theistic in her view, but she doesn’t follow the Christian faith anymore. After that I didn’t have to go any deeper in the conversation because I feel she has her right to have a faith, but at least we’re not bound to a certain congregation anymore.

 

My suggestion is that you need to sit down and talk with him. But don’t reveal everything yet, but just a little at a time. It’s a matter of molding together and come to agreements, even when you have different beliefs.

[Lilith]

  Appellation, it's your call.

 

I think you should do a cost/benefit analysis. There's no need for you to answer me on this, but you might think about these kinds of questions: Does it hurt you to go to church (once in awhile)?

I don't know. I've not been back since I deconverted.

 

Does it help your husband?

It would probably make him feel better about life in general, yes.

 

What will it cost you to go?

My sense of control over my own life? My sense of dignity? Most likely minor anxiety attacks followed by stretches of sheer boredom?

 

Is the benefit of going worth the cost?

This is just an educated guess on my part, but probably not. At least not on a regular basis.

 

On disclosing your apostasy, the questions are similar. I would add that you have a right to privacy, if that is what you feel is best.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm of the "new and improved" mindset that if you don't like me as I am, screw off. However, I don't want to cause trouble for hubby either. I can't help but think how delicious it would be to shake hands with the pastor and respond to his, "How long have you been a believer" question with, "Oh, 20 years minus 1.5" On one hand, there will be my husband, who has vowed to defend my beliefs in public (and again, I believe him) and the pastor (or other unwary person) standing there looking to hubby for some kind of explanation. None will be forthcoming. I almost see it as a bonding moment for us.

 

But I'm twisted that way.

 

The trick will be to do it w/o the kids around. I don't think he would be too happy if I did something like that in front of the kids.

[Lilith]

That’s a difficult situation.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All good advice, but we are beyond that point already. He knows of my deconversion. The rest of his future congregation does not.

 

In one (heated) conversation we had, I expressed my frustration at how he wouldn't even take the time to learn why I deconverted....to learn the process I went through. His response was something like, "You're right! I don't want to know what you know! I'm not interested in learning anything that might damage my faith."

[Ouroboros]

In one (heated) conversation we had, I expressed my frustration at how he wouldn't even take the time to learn why I deconverted....to learn the process I went through.  His response was something like, "You're right!  I don't want to know what you know!  I'm not interested in learning anything that might damage my faith."

Oh. Not fun.

[☆ TexasFreethinker ☆]

So....I think I will attend one service at least.  Which leads to the "Been Borg Again" question:  Do I tell anyone that I'm an apostate?  Or do I just play along?  I'm leaning toward tellin' 'em.

I don't think it hurts to go to church with someone you love once in a while. (Assuming they would do the same for you - go somewhere you want to go but they don't).

 

However, I feel strongly about the "playing along". I think it's wrong and I think churches depend on people who disagree with them remaining silent. They've manipulated it to where it's considered disrespectful to question what they say.

 

In fact, that's one of the biggest differences between science and religion, even tho many fundies try to say they are the same. In science you're encouraged to try to shoot down the current theory. In religion you're shunned if you do.

 

I don't think you should try to hide your apostasy. And anyone at that church who's honestly seeking truth, rather than simply trying to defend their current beliefs, should not have a problem with someone who says she's considered the evidence and come down on the side of non-belief. If they do have a problem with that, I'd ask your husband why he would want to attend a place that's afraid of seeking the truth.

 

I'm not suggesting you do this in a mean way. Nor am I suggesting that you wear your "No Gods No Masters" t-shirt into their 'sanctuary'. I am suggesting that you should feel free to give honest answers to questions or to share your true point of view if given the opportunity.

[Lilith]

Nor am I suggesting that you wear your "No Gods No Masters" t-shirt into their 'sanctuary'.  I am suggesting that you should feel free to give honest answers to questions or to share your true point of view if given the opportunity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

This made me laugh. Thanks.

 

And you're right, of course. I already knew it in my heart (forgive the analogy all).

 

I can't tell you what a comfort this site has brought me in the short time I've been here. I don't feel like I'm totally alone in this anymore.

 

*big fat schmushy hugs and kisses all around*

[Ouroboros]

This is a cool text for a T-Shirt (totally wrong topic, but anyhoo)

 

"God?

No thanks!

I'm not into S&M."

[been borg again]

APPELATION,

.

Maybe I am just being a complete coward. or just too lazy.

Or giving in to my fear of rejection, and I hate the feeling of being misunderstood anyways.

 

so far I just have a I-dont-give-a-shit apathetic attitude towards going to church and it seems to help my tolerance tremendously. That is I can effortlessly hide my critical opinions from my wife, smile and just go along with it and the stupid small talk after church, then we go home and I dont have to think about it for another week.

It doesnt bother me anymore.

Because of my I-just-dont-give-a-shit attitude... its kind of like a buddhist philosophy , keeps me calm and laughing while I watch this Comedy Luthern Church Service.

What really kills me is when the pastor shouts out all the prayer requests to God. the guy really shouts.

 

I am not in your situation, but maybe if you went with your husband, it would help with your relationship? I dont know.

 

 

My wife promised she would compromise and go to a Unitarian Church, as soon as I stop forgetting to look it up on the map

[Lilith]

One question Been, are those real babies in your avatar? Even with the yin/yang on the belly button, it kinda creeps me out.

 

You know, we had a long talk last night on an unrelated, but just-as-hot-button issue we've been dealing with. Through the course of that conversation I came to realize he really, really does love me and has been afraid that I might leave him. He was frank, honest and open with me. He expressed that he would not let this particular issue tear the family apart because it wasn't worth it (it dealt with money/job stuff). He said, somewhat tongue in cheek, that he didn't want to find another wife, re-train her and (here's the serious part) try to achieve the level of intimacy that we have. Tip guys: If you want to melt your woman's heart, that's one way to do it.

 

On one hand, it gave me a tremendous amount of relief. On the other, I am still left wondering if religion will be our demise.

[Loren]

I don't think you should try to hide your apostasy.  And anyone at that church who's honestly seeking truth, rather than simply trying to defend their current beliefs, should not have a problem with someone who says she's considered the evidence and come down on the side of non-belief.  If they do have a problem with that, I'd ask you husband why he would want to attend a place that's afraid of seeking the truth.

This also seems like a win/win suggestion in that either you will be recieved well (which makes it easier for you), or if you are treated badly for being honest, your husband will get a chance to see how these people treat the wife he loves.

 

If you are politely honest with them and they act like jerks, then that could be the very thing that gets your mate to leave the damned place.

[Lokmer]

This also seems like a win/win suggestion in that either you will be recieved well (which makes it easier for you), or if you are treated badly for being honest, your husband will get a chance to see how these people treat the wife he loves.

 

If you are politely honest with them and they act like jerks, then that could be the very thing that gets your mate to leave the damned place.

 

TFT, Loren...

 

You are the two most deviously honest people I know.

 

Hat's off!

-Lokmer

[☆ TexasFreethinker ☆]

TFT, Loren...

 

You are the two most deviously honest people I know.

 

Hat's off!

-Lokmer

I like that. I think I'll put "Deviously Honest Nontheist" under my avatar once I reach 500 posts.

[Jaded]

Tough call. I would probably go once, maybe a few times just so you can say that you tried and it still wasn't for you.

 

As far as the question goes, I would answer hanestly if asked. I would tell them that I don't believe and leave it at that. If they ask a direct question I would give them a direct answer but i wouldn't elaborate as to why, when, or go after their beliefs. If it becomes a pissing contest, the gloves would come off but it would probably be better to avoid that.

[Lilith]

Appellation,

 

My husband and I have a lot of love as do you two.  Lately, unless my husband is listening to Michael Savage, I don't even mention my disbelief anymore.  He loves me with all his heart regardless and I feel the same about him.  A good marriage is give and take, there are times when my husband has compromised and there are times that I have too.

 

Apparently, at least what I get from your posts, you are "in" love with your husband.  Not one time have you demeaned him or spoken negatively of him, that says a lot.  We live in a time where it is nothing for an anti-man attitude, to take over in a womans mouth about her husband.  You have not done that, I can't do it with mine either.  The reason I am pointing this out is because I truly believe, that when we are in love with someone, we can "take it" a little for them.  Try and put yourself in his shoes, he is concerned for you out of his love for you.  Right now, he is still blinded.  Going to church doesn't mean that you have to believe again and so long as he isn't pushing you into believing again, I think that that is what is so important.

 

Also, this could be a time for you to GENTLY bring him around to the truth.  For instance, take the sermon for that Sunday and ask your husband to "help" you understand problem scriptures.  Be firm, yet sincere, on "why" you are having problems with it.  KWIM?  In this way you are able to cast doubt in his mind over a period of time without making him resentful towards you.

 

Regardless of what you do, I hope the best for you and your family.

 

Sandy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Sandy,

This was such a thoughtful, perceptive post. Thank you.

 

Not one time have you demeaned him or spoken negatively of him

 

I appreciate you picking up on this. Soon after I deconverted and he was going through his own crises over my crises of faith, I repeatedly asked him if I'd been less of a wife to him, had I ever spoken badly of him, etc. Of course, he said no. He's a good man and I have no reason to speak ill of him.

 

Also, this could be a time for you to GENTLY bring him around to the truth. For instance, take the sermon for that Sunday and ask your husband to "help" you understand problem scriptures. Be firm, yet sincere, on "why" you are having problems with it. KWIM? In this way you are able to cast doubt in his mind over a period of time without making him resentful towards you.

 

This is an excellent point. Assuming I can tolerate the services, and assumiing I can do this in such a way that it doesn't look like I'm trying to find fault with the sermons, it just might work.

[Lilith]

This also seems like a win/win suggestion in that either you will be recieved well (which makes it easier for you), or if you are treated badly for being honest, your husband will get a chance to see how these people treat the wife he loves.

 

If you are politely honest with them and they act like jerks, then that could be the very thing that gets your mate to leave the damned place.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

This is excellent too. Thank you

 

I appreciate everyone's input here. It goes against everything I know my husband would assume I would be receiving as advice from an ex-christian site. To be honest, I'm pleasantly surprised too. Yes, I really did expect more of "throw the bum out!" type responses. The care and tenderness with which everyone has responded warms my heart :: warm fuzzies ::

 

Thanks, everyone.

[crazy-tiger]

Not one time have you demeaned him or spoken negatively of him

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What do you expect? I haven't posted yet

 

Just kidding...

 

 

I do get the idea that if you don't go, your husband will keep bringing it up. Possibly due to the "don't knock it until you've tried it" attitude that most people have. (it being a new church and all that)

Honestly, I think it would be best for you to go, then you can knock any further attempts to get you to go on the head.

 

 

If you want something to pass the time while you're there, do what I did the last time I was in a church... listen to the sermon/preaching and play "spot the mistake"

 

Best I've managed was over 40 in 10 mins.

[Lilith]

What do you expect? I haven't posted yet

 

Just kidding... 

I do get the idea that if you don't go, your husband will keep bringing it up. Possibly due to the "don't knock it until you've tried it" attitude that most people have. (it being a new church and all that)

Honestly, I think it would be best for you to go, then you can knock any further attempts to get you to go on the head.

If you want something to pass the time while you're there, do what I did the last time I was in a church...  listen to the sermon/preaching and play "spot the mistake"

 

Best I've managed was over 40 in 10 mins. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's pretty dang good. It averages out to one mistake every 15 seconds. What the hell was he preaching on anyway, hell?

[crazy-tiger]

That's pretty dang good.  It averages out to one mistake every 15 seconds.  What the hell was he preaching on anyway, hell?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's weird, but all I can remember about it is how many mistakes he was making. (he gets 2 for the price of one when he mentions the last words of Jesus... 5 times in one minute. Talk about bumping up the average )

 

Saying that, he was one of those Hovind-type preachers... loves to machine-gun stuff at you as you can't concentrate on the specifics.

 

 

Speaking of which, he'll be doing a little "meeting" at my neighbour's on Mon... Think I'll listen out to see what crud he spouts this time.

[Lilith]

Well...he went. He's there now (Wed. night service) with three of the four kids. He called me on his way home from work and announced he'd be going.

 

Then, of course, he asked me if I wanted to go. I told him that actually, I'd been wanting to talk to him about that and that I would go one time on a Sunday morning, but couldn't promise anything beyond that.

 

*long, pregnant pause*

 

"And no, I don't want to go tonight. I'm tired and want to stay home." (I'd worked all day too.

 

I've had to grieve a bit tonight. I've fought off fears that this is the beginning of the end of our marriage. I'm a little down, but not out. Overall, I'm doing pretty darn good.

[Ouroboros]

Well...he went.  He's there now (Wed. night service) with three of the four kids.  He called me on his way home from work and announced he'd be going.

 

Then, of course, he asked me if I wanted to go.  I told him that actually, I'd been wanting to talk to him about that and that I would go one time on a Sunday morning, but couldn't promise anything beyond that. 

 

*long, pregnant pause*

 

"And no, I don't want to go tonight.  I'm tired and want to stay home."  (I'd worked all day too.

 

I've had to grieve a bit tonight.  I've fought off fears that this is the beginning of the end of our marriage.  I'm a little down, but not out.  Overall, I'm doing pretty darn good.

Feel sorry for you.

 

Here's a *HUG*.

 

Let's hope you find a way to either keep it together, or that you find what's best for you.

[Lilith]

Feel sorry for you.

 

Here's a *HUG*.

 

Let's hope you find a way to either keep it together, or that you find what's best for you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you Hans I appreciate the hug.

[Guest BLau]

My wife is a Christian and I only go to church when we go visit her Grandmother who lives out of town. I do that because I stay at her house when we are there. Otherwise, I never go to church. My wife understands my beliefs, or lack of, but I made her a promise about going when we visit. I usually just sit there daydreaming until services are over when I do go.