Paranormal?

[Matt]

So, myself and some mates were 4wd'vin off the coast in W.A today. We spotted the Alkimos, a shipwreck just off the beach. My mate told me a few stories about the Alkimos, which made me think about a subject that I really hadnt given much thought about. The Paranormal.

 

Now the paranormal doesnt proove the existence of god, more importantly the Jewish/Christian/Muslim/ any god with the concept of eternal punishment. So I came here and decided to search for some discussion on such issues other then just simple, it doesnt exist attitude.

 

http://www.hauntedaustralia.com/content/view/95/47/ <Article on the Alkimos

 

Any thoughts?? Lets have a discussion. Maybe someone could post me a link to an older discussion. I dunno, but all those sorts of stories,even thou possible to not be true in many ways, always seems to make me think, how can people be lying or be tricked to make them believe in what they had seen/heard.

 

Thanks.

[Japedo]

 

The mind plays tricks. Walk into an Assembly of God church and you'll see people slain in the spirit, talking and shouting in a language you've never heard. These people are convinced they are filled with the holy spirit.

 

Oddly enough people who participate in Voodoo have the same types of symptoms. They call it going into trances and so forth.

 

In reality it's neither voodoo or a holy spirit. It's a form of hysteria.

 

As far as ghosts and what not, same type of thing. A person hears a story then their minds convince them they see or hear something. It's the power of suggestion and imagination, nothing more IMO. I don't think the people are lying, I just think people are easily spooked and don't wish to look for answers so blame something supernatural.

[Jubilant]

As far as ghosts and what not, same type of thing. A person hears a story then their minds convince them they see or hear something. It's the power of suggestion and imagination, nothing more IMO. I don't think the people are lying, I just think people are easily spooked and don't wish to look for answers so blame something supernatural.

 

Kind of like after watching a really good, mind-screwing horror flick at night...sometimes, you (in general) walk to your bathroom to brush your grill and purposely avoid looking into the mirror. LOL Or you'll swear you saw *something* out of the corner of your eye.

 

I completely agree with you, btw, I don't think that those people are lying one iota.

[Piprus]

As far as ghosts and what not, same type of thing. A person hears a story then their minds convince them they see or hear something. It's the power of suggestion and imagination, nothing more IMO. I don't think the people are lying, I just think people are easily spooked and don't wish to look for answers so blame something supernatural.

 

...And I love ghost stories, even though I don't believe in ghosts. People have for thousands of years. They tickle our imaginations. And the person telling a ghost story, if they're good at it, can embellish, rather than downplay, the experience, so to increase the dramatic effect.

I think every maritime culture has its share of "ghost ships", and this one from the land down under is a pretty good tale. Thanks for sharing.

[Japedo]

...And I love ghost stories, even though I don't believe in ghosts. People have for thousands of years. They tickle our imaginations. And the person telling a ghost story, if they're good at it, can embellish, rather than downplay, the experience, so to increase the dramatic effect.

 

 

I ditto that, I have books upon books of Ghost stories, curses, local folklore and the like. I don't believe in ghosts or curses either but it's among one of my favorite things to read.

[HadouKen24]

There's a discussion on the paranormal going on right now.

 

http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?showtopic=16634

 

A post of mine from that thread:

 

 

A close look at the history of science will show that science in the West has never looked at this sort of thing until parapsychological research began this century. The predecessors of modern science, such as Descartes, all presupposed a mechanistic world. Our ideas of the physical come from them. Not only did they never closely and methodologically examine claims of "unqantified invisible forces," but they rejected them on their face. Newton had a great deal of trouble getting his theory of gravity accepted, despite its obvious brilliance, because it merely resembled something like an occult philosopher would say. Such claims were simply presupposed to be wrong, and were never adequately tested.

 

 

 

I believe that the more recent tests of paranormal phenomena, and especially psi, have shown beyond a reasonable doubt that psychic phenomena do exist. There have been 13 broad-ranging analyses of the tests that have been done in the last thirty years, and only two of them failed to show statistical significance--two run by the same people, and which have undergone whithering criticism by other scientists in the field.

[Jun]

This stuff - http://www.aaevp.com/ - is all the rage in Oz at the moment. Ghostly voices caught on tape!

[Grandpa Harley]

EVP? In the Antipodes? I'll pass it on...

[woodsmoke]

As far as ghosts and what not, same type of thing. A person hears a story then their minds convince them they see or hear something. It's the power of suggestion and imagination, nothing more IMO. I don't think the people are lying, I just think people are easily spooked and don't wish to look for answers so blame something supernatural.

 

...And I love ghost stories, even though I don't believe in ghosts. People have for thousands of years. They tickle our imaginations. And the person telling a ghost story, if they're good at it, can embellish, rather than downplay, the experience, so to increase the dramatic effect.

I think every maritime culture has its share of "ghost ships", and this one from the land down under is a pretty good tale. Thanks for sharing.

 

Seconded.

 

Though I would greatly appreciate it if someone could link me to a readable story about that ship. The run-on sentences and lack of punctuation on the page Matt provided make me want to claw my eyes out.

[The Sage Nabooru]

As a kid, for reasons unknown, you could tell me anything and I'd believe it. My parents, both the Christian and the atheist, never really encouraged me to believe in the paranormal. And yet I did. Any story at all, any ghost, possession, haunting, whatever, I'd swallow the bait whole.

 

As I grew up I became fascinated by the subject, and purchased and borrowed myriad books on it, watched TV shows, etc. And surprisingly, the more I learn, the more skeptical I become.

 

I do believe in paranormal phenomena, just not too broadly. I think 90% of all so-called paranormalities are either bunk or hysteria. But that little 10% intrigues me still. I'm a lot like a ghost hunter; if you ever meet people that actually specialize in that field, it's rare for them to consider an individual case genuine.

 

I believe in well-studied cases. I don't believe that footsteps down your hallway once in a while is a ghost. Why? Would you spend the afterlife just walking down a hall over and over?

[Lycorth]

This brings up the usual question: if the paranormal exists, isn't it just "normal" like everything else that exists?

[HadouKen24]

I do believe in paranormal phenomena, just not too broadly. I think 90% of all so-called paranormalities are either bunk or hysteria. But that little 10% intrigues me still. I'm a lot like a ghost hunter; if you ever meet people that actually specialize in that field, it's rare for them to consider an individual case genuine.

 

That's pretty much my approach. Most of the stuff out there is, in fact, bunkum. You have to approach this stuff rationally and critically.

 

Having done so, I've found enough examples of stuff that defies normal explanations that I must conclude that there are forces at work unexplained by conventional hypotheses.

 

This brings up the usual question: if the paranormal exists, isn't it just "normal" like everything else that exists?

 

In a sense. I consider the paranormal to be stuff that doesn't fit within the standard American/European common sense scientific paradigm. It's "normal" in that it goes on all the time, but it isn't normal to us.

 

I utterly reject the "natural/supernatural" dichotomy almost completely, though.

[UnholyBlackDeath]

 

The mind plays tricks. Walk into an Assembly of God church and you'll see people slain in the spirit, talking and shouting in a language you've never heard. These people are convinced they are filled with the holy spirit.

 

Oddly enough people who participate in Voodoo have the same types of symptoms. They call it going into trances and so forth.

 

In reality it's neither voodoo or a holy spirit. It's a form of hysteria.

 

As far as ghosts and what not, same type of thing. A person hears a story then their minds convince them they see or hear something. It's the power of suggestion and imagination, nothing more IMO. I don't think the people are lying, I just think people are easily spooked and don't wish to look for answers so blame something supernatural.

 

I agree. The "paranomal" is in the same category as God in my book. I have never seen any convincing evidence that it exists. Rational thought is the answer.

 

It would make life more interesting if ghosts did exist.

[Grandpa Harley]

I think the term is 'Conversion Disorder'