Why The Term "atheist"?

[woodsmoke]

Gwenmead nailed it on the head.

 

Wally, you're doing the same thing theists do in trying to attribute more to the word than it actually means.

 

An atheist is not an atheist is not an atheist. Our rejection of the existence of deities is the only detail we necessarily have in common. Beyond that, we're all different.

[Euthyphro's Thorn]

Belief does not require evidence. Therefore, this atheist prefers to make logical deductions.

 

Belief can be a detrimental road block to the truth. Aristotle believed objects could only remain in motion as long as they were physically pushed, and that a sentient "Prime Mover" continually rotated the heavens around us. With that kind of belief hindering Aristotle, it was up to someone like Galileo to develop the idea of gravity and inertia being responsible for the planets' orbits, which in turn gave Newton a solid foundation of ideas to further build upon.

 

I don't believe in gods. I don't believe there are no gods. I doubt the existence of gods, but if solid evidence for the existence of gods were to somehow arise, I wouldn't dismiss it without giving it due consideration.

 

I don't believe I exist. I know I exist. If I'm wrong about this, then no me = no bad consequences for saying I "know" I exist.

 

I don't believe in equality and justice for all. I want equality and justice for all, and reasoning tells me that the world would probably be a much better and more peaceful place if we had equality and justice for all.

 

I don't believe the sun will rise tomorrow. I am reasonably assured that the sun will rise tomorrow, because it has risen every day of my life, just like it has done so for billions of years before I was born.

 

I don't believe in life after death, nor do I believe that death is final. Death appears to be final, so until I find evidence to the contrary, I will base the only life I'm aware of on the current evidence I have available to me.

 

If I feel that something may be true without sufficient evidence to back it up, I will acknowledge that it is just a feeling and not try to promote it to a belief.

 

That's not to say I haven't believed things that weren't true. When I was a child, I believed in God and Jesus. Until recently, I also believed that JFK wanted to pull out of Vietnam. That said, I can't always stop myself from believing things whether they're true or not, but if belief is the best word I can use to describe what I... well... believe, then that belief means nothing to me, because it means I don't have enough evidence for it to be a logical deduction.

 

As you may have noticed, the word "belief" in itself almost has a negative connotation when applying the word to myself, because I will only use the word "belief" in relation to myself when I later discover that it was a false belief.

 

As stated at the beginning of this post, belief does not require evidence. Therefore, when other people use the word "believe" to describe their position on something, that word in itself means nothing to me, unless it's used in a context that tells me a word like "deduce" or "figure" would be more descriptive of that person's position than "belief."

 

What do atheists believe? As you can see, some prefer not to believe anything, but would rather base their lives, philosophies, actions, etc., on things that have either been proven, on things for which there is a lot of evidence to support, on their own reasoning that is based on these things, as well as any other number of things.

 

There is no such thing as atheist dogma; dogma is a product of theism. We are all individuals, and we all live our lives according to how we see fit. Being atheist simply means that we do not subscribe to theist beliefs. I repeat, no beliefs.

 

Now, let me ask you: What do people without beliefs believe? That is how your question sounds to me.

 

I hope this and other posts in this thread have helped to further de-program you from the theistic way of thinking about the atheist label, Wally. I understand how difficult it can be to break free from habits we see as undesirable, thus the repetitive nature of this post to help you break free from this one.

 

Now you know one thing that I'm not. What I am, as well as other things I'm not, are things that can take several years to learn.

[Asimov]

I'm pretty new to this site, but I've already benefited from it a great deal. It's great to have others who have similar experiences, thoughts and feelings. It makes you feel normal. Thank you.

As I said before, I don't identify myself as an "atheist." I am not really ready to identify myself as anything yet. I guess I'm just trying to detoxify and purge myself. I don't want to rush into something else that's harmful.

I would, however, like to know what atheists actually believe. I know what they do NOT believe in, e.g. God, church, Christianity, religion, etc.

I've already inquired, quite sincerely, what atheists do believe in, but to no avail. I'm sure each atheist believes in something different.

Maybe it would help if I addressed my problem with the term "atheist". I find it curious, at best, that people would identify themselves as something they are not. If you don't believe in God, why identify yourself by using the negative of a term for an entity that you don't believe exists? Is that healthy? They say in politics you should not tell people what you are against but what you are for. Vegetarians identify themselves by what they eat, not by what they don't eat. Imagine if girls were called "non-boys" instead of "girls"?

Please understand that I am NOT criticizing anyone or poking fun. I am just saying that I think it's absurd that those who don't believe in a deity would label themselves as "one who does not believe in a deity" rather than something independent of what they deny. I don't believe in the toothfairy, but I'm not an "atoothfairist". If I ever get to the point that I do NOT believe in God, I will not call myself an "atheist". I don't know what I would call myself relative to that issue. Either way, I consider myself a freethinker.

 

I identify myself as an Objectivist.

[Wally]

We are all individuals, and we all live our lives according to how we see fit.

 

This was what I suspected and stated at the outset.

 

 

Now, let me ask you: What do people without beliefs believe? That is how your question sounds to me.

 

Questions and comments, evidently, are similar to labels. They are the product of each individual's experiences, personalities, education and so forth. The "same" question, comment or label coming from 10 different people probably would actually be quite, or at least slightly, different if we were to break them down according to nuances and detail, which is basically what has transpired in this thread. I appreciate everyone's input. It's been helpful.

Part of the impetus behind my question, which I didn't state before, was the fact that atheists all too often simply come off as anti-Christians and nothing more. I understand many atheists come out of very bad and tragic backgrounds in Christianity, which makes everything perfectly understandable. My background is horrid too. I guess I just got tired of atheists always talking about what they didn't believe. I wanted to hear what they did believe (feel, know, desire, etc.). I don't want to go from being a miserable Christian to being an angry Atheist. I didn't want to present my question this way as I didn't want to sound hostile. At the same time, I wasn't going to make up a long list of specific questions to post to everyone or individuals. Hence the generic plea, "Please tell me what you DO believe." That threw some people. Either way, it's been a beneficial thread for me.

Finally, it was stated that my picking apart the label I use for myself is a waste of time. I disagree. Ex-Christians should know (not believe!) better than anyone what it's like to have labels, ideas, dogma, behavior, etc. shoved down their throats (by pastors, leaders, teachers, etc.) without their consent. I simply want to avoid this and carefully choose my ideology and identity.

 

I hope this and other posts in this thread have helped to further de-program you from the theistic way of thinking about the atheist label, Wally. I understand how difficult it can be to break free from habits we see as undesirable, thus the repetitive nature of this post to help you break free from this one.

 

Now you know one thing that I'm not. What I am, as well as other things I'm not, are things that can take several years to learn.

Thanks.

[NearlyInsane]

Maybe it would help if I addressed my problem with the term "atheist". I find it curious, at best, that people would identify themselves as something they are not.

Depends on the setting. If I meet someone in a bar, I'm not going to say, "Hello, I'm an atheist..." I'd be more likely to label myself as a musician, a programmer, a bookworm, etc. If I'm talking to people about religion, especially if I'm looking for like-minded people, then it makes sense to identify myself as an atheist.

 

If you don't believe in God, why identify yourself by using the negative of a term for an entity that you don't believe exists? Is that healthy? They say in politics you should not tell people what you are against but what you are for.

Here's another take on the 'atheist' label. For many non-believers, the choice of labels such as 'agnostic' and 'atheist' comes down more to personality than beliefs. I've known people who call themselves agnostic who really consider themselves to be atheists, but consider the term too antagonistic. Yet I've purposely used the term atheist for the same reason. It's just my way of taking a stand against the religious bigots.

 

you still didn't answer my question about what atheists believe? Identifying onself with what one does not believe just seems rather vacuous. There must be something "atheists" believe in that can be used to form a term.

It think someone else said this, but there really isn't any belief you could assume 2 atheists would automatically share, other than the belief that theism is incorrect. Vacuous or not, the term is useful in making it quite clear that we do NOT believe in xianity or any other brand of theism. Personally I like being able to make that absolutely clear - I don't want to hedge about it, say I'm a 'humanist' or some such other thing to keep people in the dark about my beliefs. I'm not ashamed of it - I DON'T BELIEVE. People have a problem with that I'll be happy to discuss it with them.

 

 

I am simply saying that I don't like being labelled by other people on their terms. If it's to be done, I'd rather do it myself on my terms. I guess that's due to my having a lengthy background of severe and fruitless religion.

I understand that feeling. Many of us have strong reactions to religion after what we've been through, & it colors much of our decisions and lives, not just the words we use to describe ourselves. I suggest you use whatever term you feel comfortable with. In the end that's probably the biggest factor in the labels ex-christians choose for themselves.