Attention, Mr Neil and other expert Evos!

[Onyx]

Refute this thread....

 

 

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showthre...92&page=1&pp=16

 

 

This would be appericated.

[Ouroboros]

Darwin and Huxley were not racists, at least not anymore than what the Church had taught them, they only saw a pattern in evolution.

[Mr. Neil]

I'm not a member of theologyweb, so I can't see the topic. Maybe you could quote the part that you want refuted.

 

[Edit] For some reason, it wasn't scrolling down the first time. I see it now.

 

The fact is that whether or not they were racist, it doesn't matter. They're trying to discredit evolution by attacking the man who spawned the theory. The personal beliefs of the originator have no relation to the theory, especially since the modern theory and study of evolution is far removed and much more advanced than it was in Darwin's day.

 

Discrediting evolution by calling Darwin a racist is like discrediting Neutonian physics because Neuton was a Christian.

 

In addition to that, you might want to look at this:

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CA/CA005_1.html

 

Always check Talk.Origins.

[Reach]

I'm not a member of theologyweb, so I can't see the topic.  Maybe you could quote the part that you want refuted.

Here's the topic opened by Jerry Don Bauer,

 

WAS DARWIN and HUXLEY RACISTS??

 

I'm not sure but I've began some research lately after I posted a story on my Web site a week or two ago where the state legislature of Louisiana is considering a bill placing him in the same league as Hitler. One science educator in that state says it's going to be a rough year for evolutionists.

 

"Be it resolved that the Legislature of Louisiana does hereby deplore all instances and ideologies of racism, and does hereby reject the core concepts of Darwinist ideology that certain races and classes of humans are inherently superior to others," reads the Legislature's statement, which was approved 9-5 Tuesday by the state's House Education Committee. It will soon go before the full House.

 

And.....these guys DO seem to have some extremely strange reasons for this new fangled 1800s stuff called evolution.

 

In the Decent of Man (Charles Darwin, The Descent of Man 2nd ed (New York: A. L. Burt Co., I 874, p. 178) Darwin writes: "At some future period, not very distant as measured by centuries, the civilized races of man will almost certainly exterminate and replace the savage races throughout the world. At the same time the anthropomorphous apes ... will no doubt be exterminated. The break between man and his nearest Allies will then be wider, for it will intervene between man in a more civilized state, as we may hope, even than the Caucasian, and some ape as low as the baboon, instead of as now between the Negro or Australian and the gorilla."

 

Huxley seems to have some problems in this area as well (Huxley, Lay Sermons, Addresses and Reviews" (New York: Appleton, 1871) p. 20. Huxley seems to argue that blacks cannot compete intellectually with Caucasians, even under equal and fair conditions):

 

"No rational man cognizant of the facts, believes that the average Negro is the equal, still less the superior, of the white man. And if this be true, it is simply incredible that, when all his disabilities are removed, and our prognathous relative has a fair field and no favor, as well as no oppressor, he will be able to compete successfully with his bigger-brained and smaller-jawed rival, in a contest which is to be carried out on by thoughts and not by bites."

 

Gee, people. Are we teaching our kids to be racists? Why would anyone in their right mind want this in modern society?

 

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[Mr. Neil]

NM, Reach. I was just being a dumbass. I see it now.

[Ouroboros]

Typical propaganda machine, when they can't miscredit the theory... miscredit the person.

 

And this comes from religious people that supported slavery 100 yrs ago.

[Lokmer]

Of course Darwin and Huxley were racists. They were Victorians, sitting atop the greatest and most sophistocated empire in history. The Victorians were convinced of their own superiority and eventual triumph over the world (they had no reason to think otherwise). This set of attitudes runs all through their philosophy, literature, and science, but that does not mean that it invalidates their findings, any more than the Nazi's anti-semitism invalidates the medical information they garnered from their experiments on Jews, or any more than our own conviction of the equality of all people taints our scientific studies. The question isn't "was the asshole who started this a racist?" The question is "Is what he said true?"

 

To limit inquiry into the truth of a thing because of the character defects of someone who espoused or pursued that thing is nothing less than establishing thoughtcrime. It's dishonest, foolish, and fascistic - i.e. "politically correct."

 

-Lokmer

[Lokmer]

Typical propaganda machine, when they can't miscredit the theory... miscredit the person.

 

And this comes from religious people that supported slavery 100 yrs ago.

 

That brings up an interesting point...

 

The man who wrote "Amazing Grace" was a slave trader? Does that make the melody less beautiful (I know most of us can't stomach the lyrics, but the melody is stirring nonetheless)?

 

The idea that a person's pet evil necessarily makes all that they are anathema is a Christian concept - one sin condemned the whole human race, etc. The truth is that all people - even the most evil, even the most good - are a mix of the laudable and the despicable.

 

Take people as they come, honestly. I will be the first to step up and say that Hitler and Stalin were brilliant men. Their brilliance made their evil all the more dangerous and effective. By demonizing people, we allow ourselves to gain distance from them and feel superior to them, because we can then avoid looking into those dark places in ourselves. I prefer to live with my darkness, and drag my demons out into the light from time to time. This way isn't without its pitfalls, but these are the pitfalls I prefer.

 

-Lokmer

[Ouroboros]

And some presidents of US were racists, or am I wrong here?

 

And some presidents like to go to war over false information, so should US be flagged as Nazi Germany?

 

It's just so typical. People throw dirt when they run out of arguments.

 

Oh, actually the best one:

 

Martin Luther was a racist too, it's well documented, he was very antisemitic.

 

So we should get rid of the whole protestantic branch of Christianity, right now!

[MrSpooky]

Newton was also an asshat who derived personal satisfaction from destroying the reputations of his rivals through his influence and hand-picked review committees.

 

Does this mean that Newtonian physics includes a lesson on such dishonest and dishonorable conduct?

 

Fuck no.

 

Morons.

[Druid]

George Washington on wolfs and native americans:

 

which as we have already experienced is like driving the Wild Beasts of the Forest which will return as soon as the pursuit is at an end and fall perhaps on those that are left there; when the gradual extension of our Settlements will as certainly cause the Savage as the Wolf to retire; both being beasts of prey tho’ they differ in shape

 

This is from a letter to James Duane.

 

Should kids stop being taught about Washington and american democracy because of this? No.

 

Should kids stop being taught about Darwin and evolution if he was a racist? No.

 

Honestly racism is evil but pretend it wasn't in the majority in the past is wrong.

[spamandham]

Virtually everyone born before 1960 was a racist, as are many born after that. That doesn't discredit natural selection in general, but it does mean we should look more crtitically at claims that seem to be racist at first glance, knowing that they may very well be nothing more than a reflection of predjudice, and not actual observation.

[Vixentrox]

Han, you are right, Luther loathed the Jews.  Before I discovered the truth I held him in a high regards.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

So did I....but I was taught that Jews were mostly evil people and responsible for Jesus death. I remember this one boy had drawn swastikas all over his bible study book. He got in trouble for doodling but not for WHAT he was doodling. Heh...yeah, I was in a hard line Lutheren sect.