Hal Lindsey

[Deva]

So I am flipping the channels and land on Trinity Broadcasting. There is old Hal Lindsey, looking like a piece of petrified wood, going on about how "Christianity is not a religion. Religion is people trying to gain God's favor by their own deeds. Religion is having a relationship with Jesus Christ, who loves us, etc. ad nauseum".

 

Here's my question. How is it that this old fool has the nerve to show his face on TV or anywhere else after predicting the end of the world in the 1980's? Of course he wrote "The Late Great Planet Earth" in the 70s and collected millions for that rapture hysteria but, correct me if I am wrong, didn't he think the whole tribulation thing was actually going to happen before 2000? He and Salem Kirban (anyone remember "Your Last Goodby") wrote this hysterical, fear-mongering, fear based literature in the 70's. None of it materialized. It seems to me I remember a book which had a cover which showed a gas gauge going toward empty. Empty was set for the 1980's or 90s when the rapture would occur.

 

Maybe this guy squandered all his money by now, therefore has to get on the media again. That is the only reason I can think of why he would be so shameless and unrepentent of his errors.

[Taphophilia]

I'm pretty sure it was 1988 (or was it 1984, Nope that was a different book) that the rapture was supposed to happen. It had to do with Isreal being founded as a country in 1948 and the Bible says a "generation shall not pass away." A generation is 40 years. So, viola the rapture would take place in 1988.

[Deva]

I'm pretty sure it was 1988 (or was it 1984, Nope that was a different book) that the rapture was supposed to happen. It had to do with Isreal being founded as a country in 1948 and the Bible says a "generation shall not pass away." A generation is 40 years. So, viola the rapture would take place in 1988.

 

 

Yeah Taphophilia, thanks, I thought I was right about that. Again, I have to wonder what kind of nerve it would take, what chutzpah, after such an error, to get on TV and presume to preach to anyone? What a shameless lack of contrition!

[ShackledNoMore]

1988. I was assured that the rapture would occur at or before that time. Looking at the Wikipedia page on The Late Great Planet Earth, I see that although I never read it, its contents were regurgitated to me as fact and I was well indoctrinated from it. It would have been nice to receive an apology and withdrawal of all of that nonsense when 1989 rolled around.

[Deva]

1988. I was assured that the rapture would occur at or before that time. Looking at the Wikipedia page on The Late Great Planet Earth, I see that although I never read it, its contents were regurgitated to me as fact and I was well indoctrinated from it. It would have been nice to receive an apology and withdrawal of all of that nonsense when 1989 rolled around.

 

 

Actually, I know I still have a paperback copy of The Late Great Planet Earth in the house somewhere. It was the same as church doctrine where I was raised. Don't know why, just couldn't part with it. Salem Kirban's "Your Last Goodbye" was a scare novel about the tribulation and death. I think I let that one go.

 

I think it would be entirely appropriate for Lindsey to have something in print across the bottom of the TV screen as a disclaimer the entire time he is on. It would state "I predicted the rapture in 1988, but I was WRONG." Maybe better yet, a sign around his neck with the same sentence. Who in their right mind would listen to him? But then again, we are talking about Christians.

[leftofpunk]

My parents were supporters of Hal Lindsey. When I was in 3rd or 4th grade a few years prior to 1988 I remember my mom scaring the shit out of me about revelations. I remember her talking about the mark of the beast and living in communes with other christians because without the mark we wouldn't be able to buy food so we'd have to grow our own. I also remember freaking out about that cause I didn't like vegetables. She would talk about how she had nightmares about the moon turning blood red and that in only a few years this would all happen.

 

I didn't become an atheist because of this, but that environment certainly attributed towards my distaste for christianity.

 

 

 

As a side note, who was that guy that always did the show (similar to lindsey) with his wife (roxanne?)? All I remember is white hair and he had fully memorized the bible.

[Taphophilia]

How many pastors have said that the Rapture would occur during their lifetime? and are dead or at least pretty close.

 

The Pastor of the church that I used to attend calls himself an apostle not Pastor. I'm not kidding. Faith Center Staff

[Piprus]

Hooooo.....!

Hal Lindsay was a real, bona fide, "flash in the pan" in the 1970s. I read "The Late Great Planet Earth", etc. in those times. It was part of the New Age/ mysticism of the 70s, along with the Bermuda Triangle bullshit, a la "Chariots of the Gods" by Eric von Daniken, the Bermuda Triangle by Berlitz. Novels of the time included "The Exorcist" by William Peter Blatty, "Rosemary's Baby" and "The Omen". Hal Lindsay is a relic of the past, just like RCA radios and the 15-cent Mc Donald's hamburger.(And 12-cent French Fries). Move on, Hal....you are REALLY old news.

[♦ nivek ♦]

What was to happen to those who took the name of the Lord up and spoke for Him, and in turn were WRONG?

 

Seems they got a rock party given them, guest of honor outside the town kinda party...

 

Hal won't STFU even after being exposed as a fraud and charlatan.

 

I met him years ago at a meeting where he was headliner. While meeting and greeting the faithful Followers after (taking donations and selling books and assorted ministry shit) (talk about tempting, a smart cat and some fassssssst wheels could have made one hellova haul, no securitat to speak of when they put the cash dinero away in buckets...), he was cornered by an EBBILE AFEEISSST and asked so many questions, quickly, shotgun approach, that he, Hal, looked like he'd just been run over by a truck.

 

His security, as it was hustled Hal away. The questioner followed him and crew shouting questions about his *ministry*....

 

That was one of the things that caused me to start questioning the LGPE theology and the pre-Mil thinking. If HAL couldn't stand up and give the guy a fair fight, using God's word and all that armor shit, then WTF-O? was happening?

 

In the passing years I have followed Hal and his messes with interest, doanting some time to help investigate this assclown of god. He *seems* to be, in my opinion, to be a dirty dirtbag spendthrift with a taste for expensive toys and things that his ministry pays for.

 

Think like Benny Hinn, but with less ready cash.. But fuckin' still comfortable.

 

Hal is a joke, but a joke that the Xtian Far Right, the armed folks that like to make their points with showings of force, are the majority of his paying followers.

 

Be scairt of the klown, he still has a *possee* of folks who take his word as "gods".

 

I like Robert Heinlein and the 2nd Amendment..

 

kFL

[Deva]

So, Skip-n-Church, you actually met this clown? I still can't believe I saw his face on TV. He, and all preachers who taught the "rapture" was imminent in the 70's were so DEAD WRONG. Indeed, I am sure many of them are literally dead by now. How many times did I hear some middle-aged guy say from the pulpit "Jesus is coming in my lifetime"? Probably hundreds.

 

In the 1970's in the fundie church there was not the political emphasis we see today, I am pretty sure that started in the 80's with Falwell. That was because in the 70's the teaching was that a good Christian was not to be a part of this world. Instead it was prepareing for the rapture and end-times, Hal Lindsey etc. It was every bit as wild a science fiction/horror scenario as Stephen King could ever dream up. The mark on the forehead was a big thing. Russia (was it Gog or Magog?) was real big in this end-times business. I have not been back in a fundie church for many years, but I am willing to bet no one preaches about Russia now. How come they couldn't predict the collapse of the Soviet Union?

 

It was shocking to see Lindsey having the nerve to show his face on TV, much less feeling he was qualified to preach to anyone, even my cat. What a complete, unrepentent, fool. I use the word fool because (a) it describes someone who won't admit their mistakes and move on, and ( it shows my contempt for Matthew 5 where Jesus says anyone who calls his brother a fool is in danger of hell fire.

 

I say "fool" is a perfectly fine word. It should be used when deserved. As a sidenote, I don't actually recall any scripture where Jesus says homosexuals or anyone who has sex outside of marriage is "in danger of hell fire." But if you call someone a fool, you are. Has anyone heard a sermon on this?

 

By their own words and by their own scripture these preachers are condemned. Yet they have the nerve to condemn others.

 

The tragedy of all this is that while millions of people were engrossed in the complete fantasy of the rapture, the real problems of this country were not addressed. So we have the mess we are in today.

[OnceConvinced]

At the very least he should be branded by all churches as a false prophet.

[Guest bdp]

I say "fool" is a perfectly fine word. It should be used when deserved. As a sidenote, I don't actually recall any scripture where Jesus says homosexuals or anyone who has sex outside of marriage is "in danger of hell fire." But if you call someone a fool, you are. Has anyone heard a sermon on this?

 

Not a sermon, but someone on a movie message board I go to posted some thoughts on it:

 

 

"The Sermon on the Mount was addressed to Orthodox Jews - there wasn't a 'Christian' yet in sight. That's why it makes sense to be a dispensationalist and recognize that not everything in the Bible is doctrinal for the church age we are presently in. Christians who take the Sermon on the Mount as doctrinal for Christians usually aren't good Bible scholars and I'd stay away from them."

 

"...Jesus wasn't addressing Christians in the Sermon on the Mount in Matthew 5. Jesus was an Orthodox Jew at the beginning of His ministry to ISRAEL and not the Christian church because the Christian church had not come into existence yet.

 

'But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.' - Matthew 15:24

 

So when Jesus said that anyone who said fool would be in danger of hellfire that obviously does not apply to Christians in this age of grace. We obtain salvation by grace through faith and once we have it we cannot be plucked out of His hand.

 

Just like we no longer sacrifice animals in a temple like people did in Old Testament times so too do many things that Jesus said to Jews during His earthly ministry to THEM have any doctrinal bearing on a Christian's life in the church age. One can make general spiritual applications of course but doctrinal applications? Not if the context does not apply to Christians.

 

You have to rightly divide the word of truth, the operative word being "divide". (2 Timothy 2:15). Failure to rightly divide leads to a thousand different cults.

 

The word of God has divisions in it which must be respected and taught properly or people get all confused -- and God is not the author of confusion. (1 Corinthians 14:33)"

 

This 'explanation' blew my mind - the words of Jesus not doctrinal??? Amazing the backflips that have to be done to try to eradictae biblical contradictions.

[Deva]

"The Sermon on the Mount was addressed to Orthodox Jews - there wasn't a 'Christian' yet in sight. That's why it makes sense to be a dispensationalist and recognize that not everything in the Bible is doctrinal for the church age we are presently in. Christians who take the Sermon on the Mount as doctrinal for Christians usually aren't good Bible scholars and I'd stay away from them."

 

"...Jesus wasn't addressing Christians in the Sermon on the Mount in Matthew 5. Jesus was an Orthodox Jew at the beginning of His ministry to ISRAEL and not the Christian church because the Christian church had not come into existence yet.

 

'But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.' - Matthew 15:24

 

So when Jesus said that anyone who said fool would be in danger of hellfire that obviously does not apply to Christians in this age of grace. We obtain salvation by grace through faith and once we have it we cannot be plucked out of His hand.

 

Just like we no longer sacrifice animals in a temple like people did in Old Testament times so too do many things that Jesus said to Jews during His earthly ministry to THEM have any doctrinal bearing on a Christian's life in the church age. One can make general spiritual applications of course but doctrinal applications? Not if the context does not apply to Christians.

 

You have to rightly divide the word of truth, the operative word being "divide". (2 Timothy 2:15). Failure to rightly divide leads to a thousand different cults.

 

The word of God has divisions in it which must be respected and taught properly or people get all confused -- and God is not the author of confusion. (1 Corinthians 14:33)"

 

This 'explanation' blew my mind - the words of Jesus not doctrinal??? Amazing the backflips that have to be done to try to eradictae biblical contradictions.

 

bdp: My first reaction to your post was "You have got to be kidding!". How could anyone be this stupid? If the Sermon on the Mount was not addressed to Christians today, then what parts where Jesus was quoted ARE ADDRESSED TO CHRISTIANS TODAY? This is another prime example of the pick and choose what we like and then justify it mentality. Incredible.

 

Once you accept that the Bible or any other book is "God's Holy Word" all reason goes right out the window.

[Grandpa Harley]

Actually, the sermon of the mount isn't a bad manifesto, when you take into account that it would have been delivered in Aramaic, not Greek... In Aramaic it makes a lot more sense since there are shades of meaning that just aren't possible in Greek... and wouldn't make sense unless you've studied other Eastern wisdom philosophies. The Bible Jesus was pretty much a Greek Jerk Man-God... but there is some stuff that even I think, 'Well, that has a point' when you take it as out of the context of the 1600 years of Dogma trying to harmonise a bunch of disparate books and letter...

 

But there's no evidence that the teacher was speaking to anyone other than the people gathered there...

[Deva]

Actually, the sermon of the mount isn't a bad manifesto, when you take into account that it would have been delivered in Aramaic, not Greek... In Aramaic it makes a lot more sense since there are shades of meaning that just aren't possible in Greek... and wouldn't make sense unless you've studied other Eastern wisdom philosophies. The Bible Jesus was pretty much a Greek Jerk Man-God... but there is some stuff that even I think, 'Well, that has a point' when you take it as out of the context of the 1600 years of Dogma trying to harmonise a bunch of disparate books and letter...

 

But there's no evidence that the teacher was speaking to anyone other than the people gathered there...

 

Absolutely right. Jesus did say some very compelling and interesting things in the light of Eastern wisdom philosophies, and the Sermon on the Mount has some value. But many Christians have no idea that when they open the Holy Book and read it that it isn't speaking to them directly (with the aid of the Holy Spirit), at least that is what I was taught in the Baptist Church. The way these people read it, there is no reference to Orthodox Jews or Greeks, and no historical context. Instead, what I remember was the "Scofield Reference Bible" (King James Version, of course) with its crazy premillenial rapture, prophecy interpretations printed at the bottom of every page. I heard it said many times by preachers that " the Bible is as relevent now as today's newspaper."

 

I will never forget trying to get my fundie parents interested in a book on Biblical Archeology. They didn't say anything to me, but that book sat around the house a long time and they never touched it. After all, to them the background history wasn't relevent and didn't apply. They read it to suit themselves, and that is what this person is doing.

[Mike D]

Hal Lindsey = buffoon.

 

'nuf said.

[Guest ThemOrUs]

As a side note, who was that guy that always did the show (similar to lindsey) with his wife (roxanne?)? All I remember is white hair and he had fully memorized the bible.

 

That would be Jack and Rexella Van Impe. He's another rapturist quack. He can quote the Bible backwards and forwards, though. Amazing memory he has, too bad he's wasted it by filling it up with nonsense.

 

And the hairdos.....MY EYES! GAAACK!!!

 

Todd in Cheesecurdistan

[centauri]

So I am flipping the channels and land on Trinity Broadcasting. There is old Hal Lindsey, looking like a piece of petrified wood, going on about how "Christianity is not a religion. Religion is people trying to gain God's favor by their own deeds. Religion is having a relationship with Jesus Christ, who loves us, etc. ad nauseum".

 

Here's my question. How is it that this old fool has the nerve to show his face on TV or anywhere else after predicting the end of the world in the 1980's? Of course he wrote "The Late Great Planet Earth" in the 70s and collected millions for that rapture hysteria but, correct me if I am wrong, didn't he think the whole tribulation thing was actually going to happen before 2000?

 

If I remember correctly, Hal has been divorced two or three times, and is now on wife number 3 or 4.

So much for the sanctity of marriage and following the instructions of Jesus.

I saw this inane drone on TBN where I think his show was called "International Intelligence Report" or something like that.

Hal is proof that if you sell fear in large gobs and link it to eternal punishment, while jabbing your finger at the Bible and quoting musty scripture, people will disregard your repeated moral and prophetic failures, giving you both money and attention in return for a daily dose of fear.

This is a parasitic death cult masquerading as divine revelation.

[Guest Jmaha]

Leftofpunk, your story sounds a lot like me.

 

I was 10 or so, and my mother bought in whole-sale to Lindsey's junk, and in my childish ignorance I believed all her awful stories. So naturally, I told all my friends in school how the world was going to end on such and such a date, and they were all going to hell, yada yada. The kids all freaked out too, told their parents, who flipped out and called my mother - resulting in a charming beating for me.

 

Oh Hal, the wonderful memories...

[Deva]

Leftofpunk, your story sounds a lot like me.

 

I was 10 or so, and my mother bought in whole-sale to Lindsey's junk, and in my childish ignorance I believed all her awful stories. So naturally, I told all my friends in school how the world was going to end on such and such a date, and they were all going to hell, yada yada. The kids all freaked out too, told their parents, who flipped out and called my mother - resulting in a charming beating for me.

 

Oh Hal, the wonderful memories...

 

 

Yeah, Hal, thanks for the memories, Welcome Jmaha.