garrisonjj Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Over the last 2 years, I have happily given up all religion after being a lifelong, skeptical, catholic. I also now find that since I stopped attending, my wife has followed suit. We laugh at religious references together without mentioning our personal beliefs. Our use of jezzzuschrist! and godamns! has noticebly increased. Its like we both hated it, but were afraid to insult the other. Its refreshing to be a heathen and also to discover your wife is one as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trashy Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Over the last 2 years, I have happily given up all religion after being a lifelong, skeptical, catholic. I also now find that since I stopped attending, my wife has followed suit. We laugh at religious references together without mentioning our personal beliefs. Our use of jezzzuschrist! and godamns! has noticebly increased. Its like we both hated it, but were afraid to insult the other.Its refreshing to be a heathen and also to discover your wife is one as well! It's fun to look back at things you once believed in and shake your head at your previous idiocy. It's much more fun when you have someone to do it with! To your original thread title, I immediately thought of cult deprogramming. Maybe we should start with fundies.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Congratulations Garison, I'm glad you're wife changed with you. The same happened to me and my wife and kids, and not everyone is that lucky. Regarding forcing deconversion, I seriously doubt you can, because some people have too much emotions and pride invested in their belief that even if you prove to them they are wrong, they won't budge. The change has to come from inside, at the right time and the right way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
☆ TexasFreethinker ☆ Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Can You Force Deconversion? No, and we shouldn't try to force anyone to deconvert. People should be allowed to come to opinions by free thought not force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWIM Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 My mother, who even though has pictures of jesus on her wall, recently told me she really doesn't believe all that stuff after all. She is in her 70s and has COPD and wears oxygen all the time. She had always been passively xtian in my memories of her, but *never* declared she did not believe, when confronted she would claim she believed. She would even pray from time to time. It is amazing that as close to death as she is in her life, that she would just now start giving up dogma. I think, based on our conversations, that the doctrine of "hell" is what turned her away from it ultimately. This is a woman who claims to have had an NDE and actually saw jesus! After long discussions about how NDE experiencers see what they are programmed to see within their dying mind, like muslims seeing muhammed, and guilty conscious people seeing "hell" etc etc, she has come to have doubts. I am truly amazed at that and would never have guessed she could make the leap, especially at her age. I did not try to talk her out of her belief, but I have been quite frank and honest about my opinions when we discuss spirituality, so I don't feel that "I" deconverted her, more like she did it to herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 ...more like she did it to herself. That's the key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 No, you can't force deconversion - but I think you can encourage and support it. It's great that your wife is on the same page as you. That can make a huge difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 The change has to come from inside, at the right time and the right way. Like a flower that opens. I remember as a child trying to open a flower with my fingers. It was a large flower, a peony, that I could get my fingers on. I had watched them open. It seemed so simple. Just fold out the petals. But when I tried it, it didn't work. I could see why. Even though I tried with one that was partly opened, the petals weren't big enough in all the parts--they had to grow from the inside. I waited till the next day and the flower opened on its own. When that is applied to people, you can talk to them and explain things. I had a conversation with my little brother one day. He wasn't all that little anymore but he will always seem like my little brother because I was thirteen when he was born. He was a full-grown adult when we had the conversation. He agreed that my argument made sense. I forget what it was, but it was one of those items that, if you agreed with me, you pretty much had to make some changes in your life. At the very least, you couldn't just go on as though nothing had changed. But he did. Next time the topic was touched upon (and I did not raise it; it just happened that someone else did) I noticed that he had not budged an inch. What I don't understand is why he seemed to agree with me in the first place. Garrisonjj, I hope this with your wife is really for real. It's so wonderful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMathGuy Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 I don't know if a forced deconversion is possible, but even if it is I wouldn't recommend it. The trauma could do serious mental damage! As an analogy imagine forcibly extracting a bee stinger, which has backward pointing barbs to keep it in. If someone feels they are being made to do something forcibly, against their will, there will be trauma. At least when you deconvert yourself it may feel forcible but you're the one doing it (not that it can't still be traumatizing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGiant Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 No, you can't, at least not ethically. Forcing a conversion one way or the other is coercion at best and outright brainwashing at its extreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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