Your Opinion Needed

[soor]

there is a local radio Christian host who is adament that the earth is only 6000 years old. I give him credit he is an excellent debater and challenges anybody to prove him different. in an article on his website he wrote

 

"Creation scientists and Creation Museums have in their possession fossilized items such as hats, food, sausage links, hams, bags of flour and even a foot in a cowboy boot....., completely fossilizedThe point is that we have all been conditioned to believe certain things “must†be millions of years old.

Another example of this brainwashing is the Geologic Column. We've all seen these impressive layers of ground as we drive on a road that has been cut through a mountain or when we look at the walls of the Grand Canyon. We also see this Geologic Column on paper in our Geology books. Here's a dirty little secret the evolutionary scientists don't want you to know. The Geologic column in your school textbook doesn't line up with the actual geologic strata in the ground. Over 99% of all the layers in the actual ground are different than the official “Geologic Column†you see in your Geology book. Bottom line, it appears that way on paper, but not in the ground. The layers in the ground are actually all out of sequence, upside down, inverted, missing layers, etc. The layers are all randomly shuffled throughout the entire planet like a deck of cards. This is exactly what we would expect to see if there were a worldwide flood producing massive mudslides all over the Earth. It is not what we should see if these layers supposedly represent the surfaces of the Earth over the last “500 million yearsâ€.

Simply put, the Creation Scientist says the Geological strata we see in the ground was all laid down at about the same time as part of the natural layering that takes place after massive flooding and mudslides, or in other words, after Noah's flood about 4500 years ago. Evolutionary scientists say the layers in the ground were the various surfaces of the Earth over the last 500 million years. Remember, they need that to be true because they need 100's of millions of years for Darwin's Theory of Evolution. So let's examine the evidence to see which theory makes sense.

 

In the ground, right now are literally thousands of “polystrate†fossils. These are fossils that are standing upright, vertically punching through many (poly) of the layers (strate or strata) in the ground. In other words, picture a fossilized tree standing upright, right in the middle of the Geologic Column going up through “millions of years†of several layers. If the evolutionists are right, that would mean the bottom of that tree would be in layers of the ground millions of years older that the top of the tree. How logical is that? There are literally thousands of these polystrate trees, right now, in the ground all over the Earth. I can assure you, you'll never see their photos in your school Geology books because evolutionists don't want you to know about them. What's also interesting is that the majority of these fossilized trees do not have branches or roots. They literally look like telephone poles. So how did they get there?

In 1980 when Mt. St. Helens erupted, we noticed a fascinating phenomenon. The force of the eruption blasted the forests in the area with such power that it broke the trees off at the base of the ground, leaving the roots underground and stripped the branches from the trunks leaving the hillsides littered with thousands of, what appeared to be “telephone polesâ€. No branches, no roots. We see that this is common when when volcanoes erupt near forests and leave thousands of branchless, rootless trees littering the hillsides. Near Mt. St. Helens, thousands of these “telephone pole†trees rolled into nearby Spirit Lake creating massive log mats. To see the photos, it just looks like thousands of telephone poles floating in the water. As the trees became waterlogged, they sank, but they didn't sink horizontally. It was observed that as they got more waterlogged, they eventually turned upright, floating vertically until finally they sank to the bottom, punching their way down into the muddy bottom. Additional mudslides into the lake covered them up even more. This is not theory, this is what was actually observed.

Now let's go back to Noah's flood. If there were a worldwide flood and waters were springing forth from the deep as the Bible says, there would have been massive continental shifting. We know today that continental shifting triggers volcanoes, so it is safe to presume that if the story of Noah is true, there would have been volcanoes erupting all over the Earth. That means there would have been forests laid bare, it's trees stripped of it's roots and branches, and floating log mats worldwide of branchless, rootless trees. (Remember, we can now observe that this is what happens when volcanoes erupt) These trees back then would have done exactly what they did in 1980. They would have gotten waterlogged, turned vertical in the flood waters, and eventually sank that way, punching down through the mud and being covered up by the natural layering that mudslides produce."

 

 

what do you think of what he says??

[Piprus]

Sounds like a lot of pseudoscience bullshit to me.

 

One sure mark of the pseudoscientist...they always declare "here is what the so-called experts don't want you to know". (In order to discredit facts with false information and wild assumptions.)

[Brother Jeff]

what do you think of what he says??

I think it's a bunch of maddeningly ignorant BULLSHIT that is very easy to debunk. I highly recommend the Talk Origins site. Their Index of Creationist Claims is located here:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/

 

Link on polystrate tree fossils:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC331.html

 

Links on the Geologic Column:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD101.html

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD102.html

 

Hope that helps!

 

What these dishonest morons (Creationists) don't want is the education they could easily get, and they count on the scientific ignorance of Christians and the public in general so they can prey on them like vultures and pass off their ludicrous bullshit that doesn't have a scientific or factual leg to stand on as being "fact". Goddamn, these people piss me off! :angry:

[soor]

what do you think of what he says??

I think it's a bunch of maddeningly ignorant BULLSHIT that is very easy to debunk. I highly recommend the Talk Origins site. Their Index of Creationist Claims is located here:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/

 

Link on polystrate tree fossils:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC331.html

 

Links on the Geologic Column:

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD101.html

 

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD102.html

 

Hope that helps!

 

What these dishonest morons (Creationists) don't want is the education they could easily get, and they count on the scientific ignorance of Christians and the public in general so they can prey on them like vultures and pass off their ludicrous bullshit that doesn't have a scientific or factual leg to stand on as being "fact". Goddamn, these people piss me off! :angry:

 

 

LOL LOL LOL "BJ" you are an animal!!!

[Ouroboros]

soor,

 

My customary answer to this is SN1987A.

 

SN1987A is a supernova that was recorded and photographed in, guess when 1987. The "A" means it was the first one that year.

 

The clever thing with this one is that it is recorded the actual explosion, and also the following even days later when the light from the explosion hit a distant ring of dust. (I'm just repeating how I remember this, without looking up the website. I can get the exact details, since I don't remember the exact time frames etc etc)

 

Now, the thing is that we do know the speed of light in vacuum.

 

Also, we do have the mathematics for trigonometry, and we people do use triangulation in real applications in life and it works.

 

Now, but knowing the time between the supernova, and the reflection in the ring, they can calculate the distance between those two objects.

 

The next step, they can measure the angle between those two objects (or points)

 

This means, put it in a formula and you will get the distance tot he supernova.

 

With knowing the distance to the supernova, and the speed of light, we can then calculate the time it took for the light to travel from that event to us to observe it.

 

I think the time calculated is about 150,000 years.

 

Now, apologists want to "fix" this by changing the speed of light, but it has been proven with math that it wouldn't change the outcome, the light must (even if it has changed speed drastically) 150,000 old when it reached us.

 

Now how can it be explained that Earth and the Universe is only 6,000 years old, and this supernova MUST have happened 150,000 years ago?

 

The Young Earth Creationists are out of their minds and the only miracle we can observe there is that their skull isn't imploding from the vacuum inside. But on the other hand, they're famous for "magical math" when it comes to trinity and the nature of Jesus, so it doesn't surprise me if they could come up with some stupid explanation for this.

[Dave]

.....

what do you think of what he says??

Nothing new. It's the same old creationist BS.

[Brother Jeff]

The Young Earth Creationists are out of their minds and the only miracle we can observe there is that their skull isn't imploding from the vacuum inside.

[Taphophilia]

My mother is a HUGE fundie and doesn't accept YEC. This is what my mom has to say about it: In Genesis, God tells Adam and Eve to "replentish" the earth. Why did they need to "replentish" it? (Here in lies how she ties in science with creationism.) Because there were others before Adam and Eve. I'm not sure if she thinks god was practicing by making Homo Habilis then Homo Erectus until he perfected Homo Sapiens and then told them to "replentish" the earth because the other humaniod species didn't make it. The Neandrathal didn't make it, so neither did the others. Yeah, she's reaching.

 

BTW, she told me she doesn't want to discuss religion with me anymore, because I make her question her beliefs.

[Thurisaz]

what do you think of what he says??

 

 

Is that sufficient as an answer?

 

Seriously now...

 

...ad 1:

There are many places where the strata are out of order, that much is true... due to geological processes the effects of which can be examined and "taken out of the calculation". There are also places where the strata haven't been disturbed, and they prove the babblical cretinists wrong. As usual.

 

Ad 2:

This makes sense... if you believe that all strata must be millions of years old. This is not true, proving the babblical cretinists wrong. As usual.

[Ouroboros]

 

Ouch. It's dangerous to be a fundy. Now we know it happens. We have the photo proof. We can add this to the Anti-Pascal-Wager, see... you can lose something by being Christian.

[Deva]

what do you think of what he says??

 

I think there is something sad and pathetic, as well as dishonest, about someone (presumably an adult), trying to demonstrate that Noah's flood literally occurred. Haven't they heard about plate tectonics, carbon dating, radioactive isotopes, etc.?

[Thurisaz]

I think there is something sad and pathetic, as well as dishonest, about someone (presumably an adult), trying to demonstrate that Noah's flood literally occurred. Haven't they heard about plate tectonics, carbon dating, radioactive isotopes, etc.?

 

Oh, but of course they have.

 

Their führer told them that there's no plate tectonics (the earth is really expanding ), carbon dating depends on decay rates that are not fixed (never mind the evidence to the contrary), and that isotopes are a ploy from saaataaan.

 

And would their führer lie?

 

Seriously, if I had a single € for every time I hear a babblical cretinist hurl the same old, same old long-debunked crap, often right below a lengthy refutation...

[Islington]

what do you think of what he says??

 

I hear him talk and it might be confusing as long as he babbles on. But when he stops he has said nothing of evidence. So much hot air...