Recovering Ex-christian

[Snakefoot]

I hope you will forgive me for cutting and posting part of my intro from another board. (I type all day in my work, so any and all shortcuts enthusiastically exploited.)

 

To wit:

 

For half a century, I have lived under the yoke of christian dogma (non-capitalization intentional). Constant confusion and unanswered questions prompted me to search for clarity on my own. To that end, I learned to read Koine Greek, spent hundreds of dollars on lexicons, commentaries, dictionaries, language grammars, and so on. I started learning, and the more I learned, the more questions I had. One day, I finally realized why it was all so confusing, why so many questions remained unanswered--and unanswerable: all of it was a lie.

 

Although I still struggle with a lot of the bullshit built up in my psyche over half a century of indoctrination, I can honestly say I feel more free than I have in many years. Unfortunately, the realities of a somewhat "public life" and a bit of minor local celebrity prevents me openly proclaiming my newfound freedom from the yoke of religion/bible/god. I am therefore making my THIRD "public profession" of non-faith here.

 

I hope to find others here of similar mind.

 

As an addendum, I add that my wife and her family (I am estranged from my patriarchial/matriarchalfamily, most of whome are/were protestant or catholic christians; most are dead, anyway) are all devout Jesus-is-the-answer fundamentalists. Therefore, in the name of a passable peace, I am an even more deeply cloistered "free thinker" than even public life demands.

 

I noted on the front page of the site today (Saturday 29 March) "A letter from Kim." I strongly identify with her: we are about the same age and facinc similar situations. The only difference is that I am past the point where she is now. I hope to be a source of help and encouragement to others like Kim and me.

 

And I yearn for the day when people like us no longer feel we must cower in a clost, and such damn-fool discrimination is an unpleasant historical footnote.

[Legion]

Hey there Snakefoot and welcome.

 

Yes, I think you will find others here of a similar mind. There was time when I too thought of Christianity as a "lie." But now I just think it is a myth. And myth is different from a lie in my opinion. I also went through some anger. And I suspect that it fairly typical. Now I don't get angry so much anymore.

 

Anyway, I'm glad that you've found your way to us. Again welcome and I hope you enjoy your stay.

[florduh]

Welcome, Snakefoot.

 

At long last it's OK for gays to come out in most situations, but it may be some time before it's safe for non-believers to be openly honest.

 

Some of us find it easier and wiser to keep a low profile while others just can't contain their new-found freedom. You have to do what works for you, but the more high profile atheists/agnostics we can muster, the more it encourages the rest to speak up

 

I suspect we're not as small a minority as we are portrayed to be.

 

Thanks for your story and for joining us!

 

- Chris

[SWIM]

Welcome, Snakefoot.

 

At long last it's OK for gays to come out in most situations, but it may be some time before it's safe for non-believers to be openly honest.

 

Some of us find it easier and wiser to keep a low profile while others just can't contain their new-found freedom. You have to do what works for you, but the more high profile atheists/agnostics we can muster, the more it encourages the rest to speak up

 

I suspect we're not as small a minority as we are portrayed to be.

 

Thanks for your story and for joining us!

 

- Chris

 

I would guess if the raw TRUTH were known, we are probably in the majority.

 

Welcome Snakefoot!

 

Yeah you will find lots of like-minded people here, and likely a friend or two!

 

 

[cm_christ]

welcome to the boards.

[hereticzero]

Hi there Snakefoot and welcome.

 

I believe Christianity is a lie because it was created out of a religious system (Judaism) known for its intensive control over people which led me to believe Christianity is only in it for the control over others. I am suspicious of any religion, especially those who claim they got their guidance from ONE man who heard it all from God personally.

[pitchu]

This is a place where you won't have to cower, Snakefoot. Feel free to say it all.

 

Welcome.

[R. S. Martin]

Snakefoot, there's so many parallels between your story and my own. Age, for starters. Estranged from family of origin for another. Knowing what's good for me and just staying in the closet on the public level, at least for now--though I realize now that I may have let it slip in my academic writing without thinking it through thoroughly. It's such a pain in the ass when you're not allowed to be your real self. I told my profs, and promptly forgot that my thesis will be read by an unknown fourth party and available to others. So I'm probably out--unless people give me a break and put it down to "just a phase" that some individuals go through when studying theology. Others have confessed to going through similar phases when confronted with the big questions of education, and then "recovered" afterward.

[wonderer]

Welcome, Snakefoot.

 

I'll be 60 in less than two hours, and I've been out of the church (fundamentalist, Pentecostal) for just about 27 years now. I hear you about what you can say, and where you can say it. You might find what I'm about to say encouraging.

 

I'm the president of a local Rotary club. When I joined the club, everyone was expected to take turns leading the club in prayer at the start of every meeting. When I became president, I declared that starting the meetings with prayer forced everyone to bow his or her head, and to engage in behavior that they may not believe in. There was a confrontation in the meeting between the old-time Christian members and me. One of the most devout said something to the effect that we all worship the same God, don't we? And I thought about it for a moment, weighing the possible ramifications of telling them the truth.

 

On the one hand, if I played along with them, I would be going against my own principles, but could probably get a lot of support for the projects I wanted to do, such as raise funds to help women in Ecuador start chicken farms, put clean water supplies in villages where people drink out of sewage-fouled rainwater, etc. On the other hand, if I told them the truth, I would be honoring my own beliefs, but taking a big chance on alienating most of the club, risking the possibility that none of my projects would come to fruition, and I would waste a year of my life.

 

I decided to answer truthfully, and told them that not everyone worshiped the same God, or any God, for that matter. I told them that I'm not a Christian, and that I don't believe in any sort of personal God at all, and that it isn't fair to make people pretend to believe in God, and as long as I was president, that just wasn't going to happen. The room got deathly quiet. But guess what? Nobody else wanted to be president, and I stood my ground.

 

Since then, a few people defiantly lead the group in prayer when it's their turn, but more and more of the people have switched to my style, which is to share a thought for the day.

 

And my projects? My club rallied behind me, and I'm happy to say that my $23,000 grant to help 20 women in the village of Los Bancos, Equador start chicken farms and learn to read and write was approved. Another project to supply clean drinking water to a village in Nepal was also approved.

 

So, take heart. My advice? Be yourself. Stand up and be proud that you live in a country where freedom is still more important than comfort, despite how it seems. The more of us who stand up for freedom to think for ourselves, and to believe what we want to believe, the more others will follow.

 

 

Peace.

 

 

Rob

[Snakefoot]

Welcome, Snakefoot.

 

I'll be 60 in less than two hours, and I've been out of the church (fundamentalist, Pentecostal) for just about 27 years now. I hear you about what you can say, and where you can say it. You might find what I'm about to say encouraging.

 

I'm the president of a local Rotary club. When I joined the club, everyone was expected to take turns leading the club in prayer at the start of every meeting. When I became president, I declared that starting the meetings with prayer forced everyone to bow his or her head, and to engage in behavior that they may not believe in. There was a confrontation in the meeting between the old-time Christian members and me. One of the most devout said something to the effect that we all worship the same God, don't we? And I thought about it for a moment, weighing the possible ramifications of telling them the truth.

 

On the one hand, if I played along with them, I would be going against my own principles, but could probably get a lot of support for the projects I wanted to do, such as raise funds to help women in Ecuador start chicken farms, put clean water supplies in villages where people drink out of sewage-fouled rainwater, etc. On the other hand, if I told them the truth, I would be honoring my own beliefs, but taking a big chance on alienating most of the club, risking the possibility that none of my projects would come to fruition, and I would waste a year of my life.

 

I decided to answer truthfully, and told them that not everyone worshiped the same God, or any God, for that matter. I told them that I'm not a Christian, and that I don't believe in any sort of personal God at all, and that it isn't fair to make people pretend to believe in God, and as long as I was president, that just wasn't going to happen. The room got deathly quiet. But guess what? Nobody else wanted to be president, and I stood my ground.

 

Since then, a few people defiantly lead the group in prayer when it's their turn, but more and more of the people have switched to my style, which is to share a thought for the day.

 

And my projects? My club rallied behind me, and I'm happy to say that my $23,000 grant to help 20 women in the village of Los Bancos, Equador start chicken farms and learn to read and write was approved. Another project to supply clean drinking water to a village in Nepal was also approved.

 

So, take heart. My advice? Be yourself. Stand up and be proud that you live in a country where freedom is still more important than comfort, despite how it seems. The more of us who stand up for freedom to think for ourselves, and to believe what we want to believe, the more others will follow.

 

 

Peace.

 

 

Rob

 

Very encouraging and inspirational. Thank you!

[elana]

Welcome, Snakefoot.

 

I'll be 60 in less than two hours, and I've been out of the church (fundamentalist, Pentecostal) for just about 27 years now. I hear you about what you can say, and where you can say it. You might find what I'm about to say encouraging.

 

I'm the president of a local Rotary club. When I joined the club, everyone was expected to take turns leading the club in prayer at the start of every meeting. When I became president, I declared that starting the meetings with prayer forced everyone to bow his or her head, and to engage in behavior that they may not believe in. There was a confrontation in the meeting between the old-time Christian members and me. One of the most devout said something to the effect that we all worship the same God, don't we? And I thought about it for a moment, weighing the possible ramifications of telling them the truth.

 

On the one hand, if I played along with them, I would be going against my own principles, but could probably get a lot of support for the projects I wanted to do, such as raise funds to help women in Ecuador start chicken farms, put clean water supplies in villages where people drink out of sewage-fouled rainwater, etc. On the other hand, if I told them the truth, I would be honoring my own beliefs, but taking a big chance on alienating most of the club, risking the possibility that none of my projects would come to fruition, and I would waste a year of my life.

 

I decided to answer truthfully, and told them that not everyone worshiped the same God, or any God, for that matter. I told them that I'm not a Christian, and that I don't believe in any sort of personal God at all, and that it isn't fair to make people pretend to believe in God, and as long as I was president, that just wasn't going to happen. The room got deathly quiet. But guess what? Nobody else wanted to be president, and I stood my ground.

 

Since then, a few people defiantly lead the group in prayer when it's their turn, but more and more of the people have switched to my style, which is to share a thought for the day.

 

And my projects? My club rallied behind me, and I'm happy to say that my $23,000 grant to help 20 women in the village of Los Bancos, Equador start chicken farms and learn to read and write was approved. Another project to supply clean drinking water to a village in Nepal was also approved.

 

So, take heart. My advice? Be yourself. Stand up and be proud that you live in a country where freedom is still more important than comfort, despite how it seems. The more of us who stand up for freedom to think for ourselves, and to believe what we want to believe, the more others will follow.

 

 

Peace.

 

 

Rob

 

 

Thank you, Wonderer. You just gave me the courage and incentive to write my former pastor & tell him the truth.

 

elana

[R. S. Martin]

Rob, thanks for that story. One thing I note. You played along until you were in an advantageous position of considerable power. I point this out just so people won't think they should come out of the closet without discretion regarding their situation and/or position. I see someone said she wrote her pastor about her position.

 

On a personal note, I find myself in a position of vulnerability and must depend on public good-will for survival. The stage of the process at which this is at, I am looking closely at dates. When will I defend my paper in which I publicly state my atheism? When will the hearing be at which major decisions will be made regarding my life? How fast is rumor likely to spread? Add to the mix: How strong is the "freedom of religion" sentiment in this particular town?

 

I think I will be safe but thought to use my personal example to alert people that we are not all presidents of rotary clubs, and that some of us might actually be dispensible when it comes down to brass tacks. Or cold cash. Or, more likely, fire and brimstone. However, the more public figures who risk their positions, and the more private citizens who tell their former pastors, the safer it will be for people like me to be honest about who we are. I solute you, Rob the Wonderer, for your courage. Thank you for sharing your story.

[wonderer]

Rob, thanks for that story. One thing I note. You played along until you were in an advantageous position of considerable power. I point this out just so people won't think they should come out of the closet without discretion regarding their situation and/or position. I see someone said she wrote her pastor about her position.

 

On a personal note, I find myself in a position of vulnerability and must depend on public good-will for survival. The stage of the process at which this is at, I am looking closely at dates. When will I defend my paper in which I publicly state my atheism? When will the hearing be at which major decisions will be made regarding my life? How fast is rumor likely to spread? Add to the mix: How strong is the "freedom of religion" sentiment in this particular town?

 

I think I will be safe but thought to use my personal example to alert people that we are not all presidents of rotary clubs, and that some of us might actually be dispensible when it comes down to brass tacks. Or cold cash. Or, more likely, fire and brimstone. However, the more public figures who risk their positions, and the more private citizens who tell their former pastors, the safer it will be for people like me to be honest about who we are. I solute you, Rob the Wonderer, for your courage. Thank you for sharing your story.

 

Ruby,

 

Of course, there's no magic freedom bullet that works for everyone, but I feel safe in saying that the keys to the gates are hidden in the darkest and scariest places. I have learned the hard way that if I'm afraid of doing something, it's probably the thing I should be doing. Sometimes just standing up and looking your demons in the face is all you need to do. But the how and when is something each person has to determine.

 

Sometimes it helps to use a metaphor for the work we need to do internally. Mine is this:

 

I think of my mind as a mountain, and inside the mountain are numerous caves, all different sizes. Each cave has a front door and a rear door. My healing has been all about opening every door, confronting whatever is in that cave, looking around, learning what I can, and walking through the back door into the next corridor, which is also filled with caves with doors...

 

For the first 55 years of my life, many of these doors had fire-breathing dragons behind them in pitch darkness, waiting to devour me. But one by one, I opened them, and found that most of the dragons were actually about two inches tall. My imagination had blown them up into monstrous proportions, and I had spent my time running from one safe cave to another, avoiding those rooms. I got stuck, in other words. I could have remained there for the rest of my life, but I got help from an excellent psychologist, who convinced me to start opening doors, one at a time, and gave me a hand to hold.

 

In the beginning, it was absolutely terrifying. Much of what I found wasn't pretty, but you know what? once I got into those first rooms and survived, I cleaned house. I lit the lamp and walked through to the next cave. Eventually, it became a sort of job to do, like exercising. Nowadays, exploring those rooms is more of an adventure than a nightmare.

 

Interesting dragons I've found in those caves. In one of them I found hell and damnation. That one had defecated all over the floor, and had thrown his turds on the walls. It was a real mess, and took a long time to clean it up. I turned it into a lovely little ecosphere with live shrimp swimming around in it.

 

Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

 

Rob