Church As The Basis Of Socializing...

[crazycanuck]

I have posted my story in the testimony section and am a new "de-convert" and am only recently becoming comfortable with admitting to myself that I am really no longer a christian, after a lifetime of being raised in a fundementalist background, asking jesus into my heart, etc.

 

I have been pondering lately about how to tell others. I have been keeping it pretty quiet. Interestingly, I had an awesome discussion with a coworker yesterday about religion, belief, everything, and it was more intellligent and open minded and exhilarating to me than the closed minded ness that I have gotten from believers (this lady was an athiest)....no "us vs. them", defensiveness, etc. that I remember as the undercurrent of church, christian lit, etc from my believing days.

 

We have not gone to church for about a year now. Dd has some hearing issues (auditory processing) and finds the large Sun School overwhelming anyway, and there were veiled threats to just send her back to the sanctuary for not "behaving", no trying to accomadate her, I just went in as her "helper" and it was getting to be too much of a hassle anyway. We are still going to a cell group (well at least dh and the kids now) and I do have a few friends from there who know of my doubts (I was always the shit disturber who asked the perplexing questions) but have no clue as to the fact I don't believe now. I work shiftwork and have not gone for a long time, at least my job is a good excuse!

 

I have not brought it up as to why I am not coming anymore, and my approach is just been to avoid it so far and am waiting until the topic comes up. I feel the need to become more versed in "athiest apologetics"...like christians have their apologetics... ie-no its not that I am "mad at God" or something or want an excuse to sin, here are some rational ideas as to why I can't believe anymore but everyone I know is so blind that I know they will not accept these reasons and I might as well talk to a wall.

 

I am realizing SO MUCH that ALL MY LIFE, in my childhood and adult life, that church has been the basis for my socializing...the thing that I have in common with others/my friends. I am not going to change my mind just to keep friends, but we don't have many here to begin with (only have lived here a few years) and church is the social basis of pretty much EVERYTHING here...even the various homeschool groups here are all religious based, started by people who all go to the same church (we are homeschoolers BTW but WAAaaay different than most I know). THere isn't much like sports that my kids would like to be involved in as a means of meeting other parents either.

 

Thoughts anyone? I am already sad about losing friends, as I know that christianity and religion is about all we have in common right now. Do you tell, and then there is always this "wall", this rift or difference and you don't talk about this controversey and your friendship is "different" and not the same anymore, and it just drifts apart, or what???

[Deva]

Unfortunately there is no rule book that says you have to tell them or if you do decide to tell them, just how to go about it. I think that it is hard to maintain a friendship with fundamentalist christians. I must add that I am not an atheist. I just don't believe in the Christian God. That is still enough to put up a huge wall in a friendship with someone who centers their life around the church. It is hard to imagine a friendship enduring too long with someone where christianity is the only common ground you have with them-- considering you are not a christian anymore.

 

If you should be asked about why you no longer believe I would just be honest and tell them. So what if the reason is "rational" or one that they would accept? I also don't think you are necessarily obligated to give reasons at all for why you don't believe, unless you want to. Actually, that is a christian command - to be "ready to give reasons for your faith", aren't you free of that? Decide on a case by case basis if they are entitled to know. It is true that you might lose some friends over this. You must ask yourself what is more important -- your integrity to be true to yourself, or the approval of others.

 

If I had a family with children to consider, and the church was the only social outlet I would be more inclined to compromise and let them go to some of the social church events, I think. It very much depends also on what kind of church it is, if it is really fundamentalist - I am not sure my conscience would permit me to let them be indoctrinated.

[R. S. Martin]

Unfortunately there is no rule book that says you have to tell them or if you do decide to tell them, just how to go about it. I think that it is hard to maintain a friendship with fundamentalist christians. I must add that I am not an atheist. I just don't believe in the Christian God. That is still enough to put up a huge wall in a friendship with someone who centers their life around the church.

 

Right on! All I told my sister--by accident as part of another story--was that I was looking into paganism and she turned cold on me. This was not HER god and therefore no god at all. I had sinned and tresspassed and for all intents and purposes was an evil atheist. She had made me promise some time earlier not to tell her when I stopped going to church. Apparently telling her that I was investigating paganism was telling her that I had stopped going to church. To tell the truth, I don't even remember if I was still going to church at the time or not. Probably not, but investigating paganism and church attendance had very little to do with each other. I have intentionally attended worship service as an atheist for the specific reason for fellowship.

 

It didn't last long because I found it empty. Even the music lost its meaning. But I did go. Paganism turned out not to be right for me. I did not think that she deserved to know this, nor that I attended church a few times. Given the way my family has treated me since then I feel they don't deserve to be related to me anymore.

 

So much for my rant.

 

Canuck, if you're looking for companionship, would your atheist co-worker know of any freethinker of humanist or other secular interest groups in your area? Can you find something online? Or at your Community Information Centre? Sounds like your own area is extremely religious but what about the next county over? I'm thinking if you drive and have a car, you may have options. You might be interested in Humanist Association of Canada. Here's the website. You might be able to find a group near you in the link for "Regional Humanist Groups."

 

That website might also begin with meeting your "apologetics" concerns. On my website you can also find a lot of sources to start researching. The Secular Web is an excellent resource. Pagan Origins of the Christ Myth is an excellent resource. Grandpa Harley of these forums--exC--set up a lot of links for me here that help you study all kinds of problems with the Bible, church history, and Christianity in general.

[kozimoto]

I missed the social aspect a bit. I miss getting to show off new clothes! How sad is that??!

 

Unfortunately, most of my xian friends gossiped, regardless of how open and honest I was with them. I laid it down very simple, non-confrontational, and they still went around behind my back saying "blah blah whatever." (I know b/c my husband heard them and told them off, the champ!)

So I say, stuff em. You owe no man an explanation, and one that they would be too stubborn to accept anyway.

 

I found that my social world expounded somewhat after leaving, b/c all of a sudden I could feel comfortable hanging out with people I might otherwise have avoided (pagans! ha!). I joined the local atheist group, I visit an old lady at a home, I joined a book club.

 

And the plus is, I find all these things vastly more enjoyable than the '20min chit chat with friends followed by 2 and a half hours of lecture about how to be better' that church was.

 

Best luck, and have fun!

[Trev]

So I say, stuff em.

 

That's the attitude

[ogilvy]

I have posted my story in the testimony section and am a new "de-convert" and am only recently becoming comfortable with admitting to myself that I am really no longer a christian, after a lifetime of being raised in a fundementalist background, asking jesus into my heart, etc.

 

I have been pondering lately about how to tell others. I have been keeping it pretty quiet. Interestingly, I had an awesome discussion with a coworker yesterday about religion, belief, everything, and it was more intellligent and open minded and exhilarating to me than the closed minded ness that I have gotten from believers (this lady was an athiest)....no "us vs. them", defensiveness, etc. that I remember as the undercurrent of church, christian lit, etc from my believing days.

 

We have not gone to church for about a year now. Dd has some hearing issues (auditory processing) and finds the large Sun School overwhelming anyway, and there were veiled threats to just send her back to the sanctuary for not "behaving", no trying to accomadate her, I just went in as her "helper" and it was getting to be too much of a hassle anyway. We are still going to a cell group (well at least dh and the kids now) and I do have a few friends from there who know of my doubts (I was always the shit disturber who asked the perplexing questions) but have no clue as to the fact I don't believe now. I work shiftwork and have not gone for a long time, at least my job is a good excuse!

 

I have not brought it up as to why I am not coming anymore, and my approach is just been to avoid it so far and am waiting until the topic comes up. I feel the need to become more versed in "athiest apologetics"...like christians have their apologetics... ie-no its not that I am "mad at God" or something or want an excuse to sin, here are some rational ideas as to why I can't believe anymore but everyone I know is so blind that I know they will not accept these reasons and I might as well talk to a wall.

 

I am realizing SO MUCH that ALL MY LIFE, in my childhood and adult life, that church has been the basis for my socializing...the thing that I have in common with others/my friends. I am not going to change my mind just to keep friends, but we don't have many here to begin with (only have lived here a few years) and church is the social basis of pretty much EVERYTHING here...even the various homeschool groups here are all religious based, started by people who all go to the same church (we are homeschoolers BTW but WAAaaay different than most I know). THere isn't much like sports that my kids would like to be involved in as a means of meeting other parents either.

 

Thoughts anyone? I am already sad about losing friends, as I know that christianity and religion is about all we have in common right now. Do you tell, and then there is always this "wall", this rift or difference and you don't talk about this controversey and your friendship is "different" and not the same anymore, and it just drifts apart, or what???

as i 've said in another post, the people at my church have been as nice as possible about my leaving, and i'm still in contact with a couple of them, and welcome to visit them, although i dont like having visitors myself. i do regard them as friends, and i can honestly say they havent changed towards me.

however i'm finding nice companionship in another area, which is through art classes and groups. they are people my age and older. there is one group where we just go somewhere outdoors, like a beach or bush setting, take our lunch, and paint for a few hours.

i think you would find that most communities have interest groups you could try out. i'm really enjoying mingling with all kinds of people these days. hope you will have such a positive experience as i have.

pippa