PandaPirate Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 believing in something invisible and unprovable will get you landed in the loony bin? As it stands now, I think Christianity should be classified right up there with schizophrenia. Prayer is simply talking to someone that no one can see. It's mass delusion. It's craziness! Angels, demons, devils. All INVISIBLE YET PEOPLE STILL TALK ABOUT THEM AS if they are real. There are scientific explanations for this stuff yet people refuse to see it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piprus Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 believing in something invisible and unprovable will get you landed in the loony bin? As it stands now, I think Christianity should be classified right up there with schizophrenia. Prayer is simply talking to someone that no one can see. It's mass delusion. It's craziness! Angels, demons, devils. All INVISIBLE YET PEOPLE STILL TALK ABOUT THEM AS if they are real. There are scientific explanations for this stuff yet people refuse to see it! ...because, for whatever reasons, there are still needs within people to believe in those things. For many, their beliefs are shallow, but rooted in traditions and reinforced in multiple iconic symbols. Like the family bible, the ancestral names on church rosters, the engraved markers of ancestor's resting places in the cemetary. It's continuity. Those things may not be important to some of us, but to others they are. It's often about identity. Some people just need that. So they go ahead and take in and even defend the nonsense and superstitions. Such people don't want to think...they want belonging. I don't call that schizophrenia. I call it choosing what makes life feel good. We as ex-christians have chosen differently. But we cannot expect to pursuade satisfied christians to just follow along with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hereticzero Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I think our government will drop nuclear bombs on our own country before religion takes a back seat. Delusional christians are in charge of the weapons of mass destruction. Do you think they will let that power slip away without a fight that would literally kill millions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted April 16, 2008 Super Moderator Share Posted April 16, 2008 I could see that happening in an atheistic totalitarian state, but the totalitarian state in the USA will be (is) theocratic. It's almost a crime, and you are at the very least considered fringe if you don't speak to the invisible magic guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I believe in a lot of invisible things. In fact, the most apparent things to me are invisible to others, my own thoughts and emotions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I think our government will drop nuclear bombs on our own country before religion takes a back seat. Delusional christians are in charge of the weapons of mass destruction. Do you think they will let that power slip away without a fight that would literally kill millions? I don't know. Just over a generation ago Italy and France were nutty up to their ears in religious piety now they are both virtual bastions of hedonism as France has taken the atheist route and Italy the ambivelant route while the churches have become museums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbobrob Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I don't think it will be given "looney bin" status, but I do see a time, way off in the future, where the religions that survive will be the ones that best blend the knowledge learned through the sciences, but still give a level of compassion and hope to the masses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hereticzero Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I think our government will drop nuclear bombs on our own country before religion takes a back seat. Delusional christians are in charge of the weapons of mass destruction. Do you think they will let that power slip away without a fight that would literally kill millions? I don't know. Just over a generation ago Italy and France were nutty up to their ears in religious piety now they are both virtual bastions of hedonism as France has taken the atheist route and Italy the ambivelant route while the churches have become museums. You may be surprised at how many Americans, Christian and nonChristian, believe that America IS the chosen people of god. This is why America sucks up to the 'other' chosen of god, Israel, who are fighting also with god's chosen, the Palestinians and Islamists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I had a curious thought the other day. What if religion’s purpose or function is to circumvent or placate the ego? And if so, then what might serve that same function? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
par4dcourse Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 believing in something invisible and unprovable will get you landed in the loony bin? As it stands now, I think Christianity should be classified right up there with schizophrenia. Prayer is simply talking to someone that no one can see. It's mass delusion. It's craziness! Angels, demons, devils. All INVISIBLE YET PEOPLE STILL TALK ABOUT THEM AS if they are real. There are scientific explanations for this stuff yet people refuse to see it! My pat answer is: prove it. Gawd did this or that? Prove it. The debble is at work is so and so's life? Prove it. I'm going to hell for not believing in your invilsible sky spook? Prove it. I state right off the bat that I think the bible is about the worst piece of fiction ever written and if your gawd produced it he's a narcisistic asshole. I don't consider "because the bible says so" as a legit argument. So, without using the book of fairy tales, prove any of your ridiculous claims. Shuts 'em up quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGiant Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I'd point to the many things that you take on faith that they just work. There always exist unprovable statements (or if all statements are proven, then inconsistent statements), as such, an axiom must be defined to cover a weakness inherent to whatever logical system that you use. In fact, we use unprovable concepts all the time, despite our own (copious) anecdotal evidence that the universe we occupy works that way. No, it isn't something that can or should land you in the looney bin as you put it. Sorry, but a purely rational system is provably going to fail. Then again, I'd expect that one as obviously well versed in psychology, physics, and reality as you already knows this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I had a curious thought the other day. What if religion’s purpose or function is to circumvent or placate the ego? And if so, then what might serve that same function? All I can say Legion is that I think that is a very interesting question. I have been thinking about it all day. Such is the value of this site, so many interesting ideas and questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 believing in something invisible and unprovable will get you landed in the loony bin? As it stands now, I think Christianity should be classified right up there with schizophrenia. Prayer is simply talking to someone that no one can see. It's mass delusion. It's craziness! Angels, demons, devils. All INVISIBLE YET PEOPLE STILL TALK ABOUT THEM AS if they are real. There are scientific explanations for this stuff yet people refuse to see it! But that's the beauty of it all... Let's imagine a future where things are all mostly rational. But, in this same rational future times are getting tough. And there's some fringe weirdo's going on about "god," "gods" or even "pixies" (doesn't matter) and how this <pick your poison from the list> is going to make something(s) happen (or not). This "prophet" happens on the right combination and is absolutely right. He hits the "prophet" lotto. Since our friends "reason" and "rational" can't provide a proper explanation to the desperate masses our "prophet" is thrust front and center. His belief system (perhaps the pixies) is now validated. Kudos to our crazy friend. Of course there are other ways to hit the "jackpot" but the point is that "reason" only goes so far for most people. They want answers (in this case) and if those "answers" are "magical" then so be it. At least they're something (and you'll hear people say this even today for even the worst answers being offered up "At least they're offering something. What do you have?" Not caring that even the slightest investigation would offer something better but delays are seen as unacceptable of course so the worst solution often wins the day). To tie this in to what I've said. I have no "solution" to anyone's "afterlife" concerns beyond "you just die and that's it." So "magic" and all the crazy that goes along with it wins the day. mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozimoto Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 I personally hope that this day never comes. Because as soon as you are "insane" for believing in a religious revelation, any fundy who kills a heathen will walk away from court free as a jaybird - not guilty, by reason of insanity. And I don't know about you , but I want any person who commits a crime b/c of religious conviction to serve their time, and to serve it hard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunder 34 Posted April 20, 2008 Share Posted April 20, 2008 God willing, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted April 21, 2008 Share Posted April 21, 2008 Wouldn't such a society also drop the hammer on neo-pagans, new agers, and anyone who believes in the existance of ghosts or some kind of StarWars-like cosmic force or something? I vote "no" on this one. It's like Orwell's notion of Thought Crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. S. Martin Posted April 21, 2008 Share Posted April 21, 2008 God willing, yes. Amen. The same applies, in my book, to the other religions or para-religions you mention VC. Crime in the name of religion MUST be punished HARD--the ones that can be pinned down and labeled, that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.B. Posted April 23, 2008 Share Posted April 23, 2008 ...the religions that survive will be the ones that best blend the knowledge learned through the sciences, but still give a level of compassion and hope to the masses. It's not a religion (unless you mix in Tibetan or Chinese folk-magic), but Buddhism is a philosophy that in fact DOES freely allow for anyone to investigate, accept or question what is learned through science as well as literature, etc. The Way of the Buddha is also profound in its ability to give hope to the masses... after all, if I am pursuing harmony by eliminating the causes of suffering (in my life and, by extension, in yours), and you're doing the same, aren't we both free to be full of hope that one day, perhaps, the flame of unreasonable desire will ultimately be blown out? I see the teachings of the Buddha as supremely hopeful and also rational and calming. My US$.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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