What Did You Or Your Former Church Consider Heretical Or Too "liberal"

[HelloWorld]

I thought it would be interesting for us to share what we and/or our church considered heretical, liberal, or just "bad". What sorts of ridiculous or not so ridiculous things were frowned upon by you or your former church community? Were there things that your community pushed that you thought were "evil" or otherwise inspired by Satan?

 

I hope for this to be a fun, informative topic. I am sure we will find that many of us here would have thought some other among us as simply heretical or "bad" for the most silly reasons.

 

Anyway, for me, some of the things my family considered (well, still do consider) too "liberal" or unacceptable were (are):

 

-People who do not kneel during the consecration at mass

-General absolution instead of private confession

-My mom seems to extremely dislike taking communion from extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist (EMEs) instead of the priest. For those who don't know, EME;s are lay people who help the priest give out communion. This is necessary in large parishes where it would be impractical for one priest to give out communion to the entire congregation on his own

-People who let their kids take sex-ed at school (We don't have abstinence only here, thank god)

-People who read Harry Potter

-Priests who step down from the altar to shake hands with some of the people in the pews during the sign of peace

-Priests who move away from the lectern (the podium thingy)when giving their homilies

-People who do not go to mass every Sunday (or Saturday evening)

-People who say they are Catholic but vote for pro-choice politicians

-People who say they are Catholic but use artificial birth control

-People who say they are Catholic but fully support LGBTQ rights

-People who eat meat on Friday

-People who don't say the rosary every day (I am sure that when my mom finds out about my deconversion, she is going to put some blame on the fact that I stopped saying my daily rosary when I went off to university)

-Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation

-People who do not go to confession often

-People who let their kids snack on crackers during mass

 

........ I could go on and on and on..........

 

Note that when I say "people" I pretty much mean people in the church, not your random Joe Blow on the street. Of course, we still thought (they still think) that it is "bad" for Joe to read Harry Potter for example, but the really Catholic things of course wouldn't exactly apply to him since he wasn't Catholic. Then again, we would wish that he was Catholic lol.

[PocketAces]

I thought it would be interesting for us to share what we and/or our church considered heretical, liberal, or just "bad". What sorts of ridiculous or not so ridiculous things were frowned upon by you or your former church community? Were there things that your community pushed that you thought were "evil" or otherwise inspired by Satan?

 

I hope for this to be a fun, informative topic. I am sure we will find that many of us here would have thought some other among us as simply heretical or "bad" for the most silly reasons.

 

Anyway, for me, some of the things my family considered (well, still do consider) too "liberal" or unacceptable were (are):

 

-People who do not kneel during the consecration at mass

-General absolution instead of private confession

-My mom seems to extremely dislike taking communion from extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist (EMEs) instead of the priest. For those who don't know, EME;s are lay people who help the priest give out communion. This is necessary in large parishes where it would be impractical for one priest to give out communion to the entire congregation on his own

-People who let their kids take sex-ed at school (We don't have abstinence only here, thank god)

-People who read Harry Potter

-Priests who step down from the altar to shake hands with some of the people in the pews during the sign of peace

-Priests who move away from the lectern (the podium thingy)when giving their homilies

-People who do not go to mass every Sunday (or Saturday evening)

-People who say they are Catholic but vote for pro-choice politicians

-People who say they are Catholic but use artificial birth control

-People who say they are Catholic but fully support LGBTQ rights

-People who eat meat on Friday

-People who don't say the rosary every day (I am sure that when my mom finds out about my deconversion, she is going to put some blame on the fact that I stopped saying my daily rosary when I went off to university)

-Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation

-People who do not go to confession often

-People who let their kids snack on crackers during mass

 

........ I could go on and on and on..........

 

Note that when I say "people" I pretty much mean people in the church, not your random Joe Blow on the street. Of course, we still thought (they still think) that it is "bad" for Joe to read Harry Potter for example, but the really Catholic things of course wouldn't exactly apply to him since he wasn't Catholic. Then again, we would wish that he was Catholic lol.

in my experience with all the types of Churches i went to:

 

non-regular church attendance

smoking cigarettes, and in one church drinking alcohol

universalism

gay marriage

abortion(even tho i'd like to know how one can be pro-abortion and anti-death penalty)

taking communion when you've got known sin in your life

the charismatic attributes of the pentecostal churches

saying goddamn, or jesus christ in vain or aas vulgar words or cussing

annihilationism(sp?)

many views of Roman Catholicism

all other beliefs

[Amethyst]

Pretty much anything non-Church approved.

[OpheliaGinger]

Here is what my churches found liberal:

 

Having a kitchen

Raising of one's hands

Singing enthusiastically

Shouting "amen"

Moving worship days to accommodate holidays

Not being a Republican

[Deva]

I have to think back, its been a lot of years,but here goes from time to time, in every Baptist church I went to:

 

Considered Liberal/Unacceptable to Barely tolerable:

 

Everything on PocketAce's list, and:

Dancing

Rock music- I specifically remember a preacher in the early 90s slamming Madonna, earlier it was the Beatles

Not believing the Bible is the Word of God.

Not believing in a literal resurrection.

Not believing in a literal creation story, the Flood, the rapture, the antichrist, dispensationalism, the virgin birth, etc.

Women in pants and short skirts.

Women with too much makeup.

Men with long hair

Divorce and divorced people, especially women

Not just gay marriage, but a gay person had to remain celibate.

sex before marriage

Really getting down to it - sex

candles in church

talking while the communion platter was being passed around.

 

Parking lot police. This means no skipping Sunday School by staying outside in the car (yes, some guy came out there and said I was to go back in or he would tell my parents).

[ixolite]

Here is what my churches found liberal:

 

Having a kitchen

 

 

My church (catholic):

 

abortion

sex before marriage

[HelloWorld]

candles in church

 

What specifically was wrong with candles in church? I have never heard of that before. Was it considered too liturgical or something? Also, I have been to Baptist weddings around here, and one of the things that they do as part of the ceremony is have the mothers from the bride and groom light a candle together or something. Did you guys not have that? Maybe it is just a very congregation specific or regional custom?

 

Parking lot police. This means no skipping Sunday School by staying outside in the car (yes, some guy came out there and said I was to go back in or he would tell my parents).

 

Now that is just plain funny.

[MikeyMac]

I thought it would be interesting for us to share what we and/or our church considered heretical, liberal, or just "bad". What sorts of ridiculous or not so ridiculous things were frowned upon by you or your former church community? Were there things that your community pushed that you thought were "evil" or otherwise inspired by Satan?

 

I hope for this to be a fun, informative topic. I am sure we will find that many of us here would have thought some other among us as simply heretical or "bad" for the most silly reasons.

 

Anyway, for me, some of the things my family considered (well, still do consider) too "liberal" or unacceptable were (are):

 

-People who do not kneel during the consecration at mass

-General absolution instead of private confession

-My mom seems to extremely dislike taking communion from extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist (EMEs) instead of the priest. For those who don't know, EME;s are lay people who help the priest give out communion. This is necessary in large parishes where it would be impractical for one priest to give out communion to the entire congregation on his own

-People who let their kids take sex-ed at school (We don't have abstinence only here, thank god)

-People who read Harry Potter

-Priests who step down from the altar to shake hands with some of the people in the pews during the sign of peace

-Priests who move away from the lectern (the podium thingy)when giving their homilies

-People who do not go to mass every Sunday (or Saturday evening)

-People who say they are Catholic but vote for pro-choice politicians

-People who say they are Catholic but use artificial birth control

-People who say they are Catholic but fully support LGBTQ rights

-People who eat meat on Friday

-People who don't say the rosary every day (I am sure that when my mom finds out about my deconversion, she is going to put some blame on the fact that I stopped saying my daily rosary when I went off to university)

-Catholics who do not believe in transubstantiation

-People who do not go to confession often

-People who let their kids snack on crackers during mass

 

........ I could go on and on and on..........

 

Note that when I say "people" I pretty much mean people in the church, not your random Joe Blow on the street. Of course, we still thought (they still think) that it is "bad" for Joe to read Harry Potter for example, but the really Catholic things of course wouldn't exactly apply to him since he wasn't Catholic. Then again, we would wish that he was Catholic lol.

 

I became a Calvary Chapel member and I was told everything that didnt come from the bible was heretical, even other Christians, I didnt understand this at all. I still dont understand or see where the bible says it is the sole guidebook to god, I went in under the impression that it would be a roadmap that led to many types of teachers, spiritual practices, different customs etc., I was in for a surprise!

 

I hope that answers your question, I dont know if you are familiar with Calvary Chapel, I do remember them accusing the Catholic church of being of Satan, that was weird to me bcause I had considerd the Catholic church to be the basis for Christianity before I became a Calvary Chapel member. I thought that I was joining a certain Christian group because I had been introduced to the sinner's prayer by people who attended Calvary Chapel, i did not know until later that most Christians are suspicious and condemning of other groups of Christians, this was one of the first turn offs for me, I just do not understand it.

 

They really just didnt think anything was good or true unless it was Calvary Chapel stamped and approved.

 

Has anybody else had this experience with a Calvary Chapel?

[MikeyMac]

Oh, and SEX!

 

Sex was bad, even if you were married it seemed more of a no-no than anything.

 

I have never been a promiscuous man, I have had 3 long term, serious relationships and nothing inside me told me that it was in any way wrong to have sex with my girlfriend.

 

I went through a period of abstinence with my ex-girlfriend when I joined Calvary Chapel, she did not take kindly to this and left me for an ex boyfriend I think. Live and let live.

 

Now that I have left I have not been sexually active with anybody since we have broken up and since I do not have to abide by those regulations, I am ready for a new relationship. I am lost on the emphasis that was placed on abstinence. I can see not being a "whore" or a "man-whore", but I do not see how two consentiing adults in a committed relationship would be bothersome to god, arent there more troubles in the world than two grown adults who care deeply for eachother making love?

 

Before I became a member I saw there was a "Sex and Christianity" board of some type, I think that was the name of it. It is not appearing on my list of boards, I would be interested in seeing what others have to say about the matter. I want to see the tales of others and how they dealt with it or were affected by it.

 

Where do I go to get to that board? Can someone email me, or is the answer in a FAQ somewhere?

 

TIA

 

Apparently I martyred my relationship, that should be enouh to buy my way into heaven

[hereticzero]

I became a Calvary Chapel member and I was told everything that didnt come from the bible was heretical, even other Christians, I didnt understand this at all. I still dont understand or see where the bible says it is the sole guidebook to god, I went in under the impression that it would be a roadmap that led to many types of teachers, spiritual practices, different customs etc., I was in for a surprise!

 

I hope that answers your question, I dont know if you are familiar with Calvary Chapel, I do remember them accusing the Catholic church of being of Satan, that was weird to me bcause I had considerd the Catholic church to be the basis for Christianity before I became a Calvary Chapel member. I thought that I was joining a certain Christian group because I had been introduced to the sinner's prayer by people who attended Calvary Chapel, i did not know until later that most Christians are suspicious and condemning of other groups of Christians, this was one of the first turn offs for me, I just do not understand it.

 

They really just didnt think anything was good or true unless it was Calvary Chapel stamped and approved.

 

Has anybody else had this experience with a Calvary Chapel?

 

I have not been a Calvary Chapel member but what you wrote is found among most Protestant churches. If one does not worship as Protestants, then one is of the devil. This crap goes way back to the Reformation era and the Protestants have never gotten it out of their heads that their denominations are a direct result of Catholicism. Without Catholicism, there would have been no Protestant churches and no Bibles being written and rewritten by Protestants. The 'sinner's prayer' is a Protestant marketing ploy, undoctrinal Biblically, that has been used since the 1970s in many churches.

 

When I attended church as a youngster, Deacons often smoked in the Fellowship Hall. There was a lot of grumbling when the practice was abolished by voting members, it is sinful dontchaknow? I can remember some folks bringing beer on church picnics before the ultra righteous took over the church.

 

When I was a xtian, I hung out with the Catholics because they were much more liberal than what I grew up with as a Protestant.

[hereticzero]

Before I became a member I saw there was a "Sex and Christianity" board of some type, I think that was the name of it. It is not appearing on my list of boards, I would be interested in seeing what others have to say about the matter. I want to see the tales of others and how they dealt with it or were affected by it.

 

Where do I go to get to that board? Can someone email me, or is the answer in a FAQ somewhere?

 

...

Maybe Christians ran out of sex?

[deb]

Before I became a member I saw there was a "Sex and Christianity" board of some type, I think that was the name of it. It is not appearing on my list of boards

 

Welcome Mikey...and that particular forum will not appear until you've made a certain number of posts. So just keep posting and it'll show up eventually

 

Deb

[Deva]

What specifically was wrong with candles in church? I have never heard of that before. Was it considered too liturgical or something? Also, I have been to Baptist weddings around here, and one of the things that they do as part of the ceremony is have the mothers from the bride and groom light a candle together or something. Did you guys not have that? Maybe it is just a very congregation specific or regional custom?

 

Independent Baptist church. It is congregation specific, or to be more accurate, pastor specific. The pastor's word is law in these type of churches. I think this guy believed any candles would smack of Catholicism. No art that I can think of was in the church. A plain cross, some flowers on the "altar" and an American and Christian flag. That was it.

 

This particular church also had a school. The teachers in the school were not permitted to date non-Christians.

[LastKing]

For me its little more complexes. You see my mom went to a presbyterian church. They were very liberal and I'll ambit I still like them a lot. However I was sent to a Christian counselor all my life who was a Baptist. Then at some point for complexes reasons I could not go to my own Church so I started looking for my own Christian community. It was during this time I my counselor started to betray my trust and try to covert me to her brand of religion. At the same time I became friends with a new group of so called opened minded Christians.

 

 

 

From my moms church.

 

Any thing could fly. It was a really open minded Church. The people there I still really respect and wish more Christians could be like them.

 

 

From my Counselor

 

-I did a wrong deed by defending a gay person from homophobic Christians

-I was not allowed to included Pagans/wiccans in interfaith talks because they "worship Satan" Her words not mine. However every other religion was okay for some reason.

-Realted to the last one I did a wrong deed by defending a Pagan girl who was being harassed for her religious beliefs by Christians.

-I could not listen to secular mental music or anything that is on the heavy side unless it was religious in theme. (Most of which sucked by the way)

-I was told not to take any science class in college because Evolution is Just a "Theory, not a Fact" (BTW http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oBtjcPL3EQ

)

-I was not allowed to write horror.

-It was wrong not to support Israel because the bible said that land belongs to the Jews. (BTW. I was told this after a childhood friend of mine was almost killed by Israeli soldiers)

 

 

From my so called "Friends"

-It was wrong to be friends with Muslims or be respectful of there religion (In fact it was wrong to look at Muslim as anything more then just Muslim. These Christians were a hate group IMO)

-It was wrong to prayer for peace with people of other religions. Instead we had to pray "for there Salvation and defeat, not for there peace" There words not mine.

-once again, evolution is just theory and I was not allowed to debate them one that.

-It was wrong to coexist with other religions or promote tolerance of any kind.

-It was wrong to have my own opinion on anything. In the end was just agree with them or your the outcast of the group.

-It was wrong to be pro-peace or be a democrat (Which may have some reason to do with why I am now also a Ex-Republican and ex-War supporter)

- Homosexuality was wrong

-Abortion is wrong

-Do not question Lee Bullshit Strobel

-Don’t question what the bible has to say.

-All hail Kirk Ass hole Cameron.

 

I could go on all day.

[Trike]

-Taking a vow of poverty or not believing in Prosperity gospel

-not speaking in tongues (my church believed that if you were saved you spoke in tongues)

-being Catholic or basically any other denomination

-following a liturgy during church

-having a sermon less than an hour long

-singing for less than an hour during worship

-watching most tv (although my pastor, it seemed, watched every show at least once to "warn" us about them)

-any sort of belief in magic (which included letting your children read books like Harry Potter)

 

that's all I can come up with right now, it's been a few years.

[HelloWorld]

My former church thought that any bible that was not King James was heretical....even New King James.

 

I have always wondered what is considered so exclusive about the KJV. Do you have any idea why they considered all other translations heretical? Even new versions of the same one?

 

Of course, I am pretty sure that xtian faiths say that this or that translation is "good" and some other is "bad". I was always taught that there were some good translations and some bad ones, but I never advocated only one.

[HelloWorld]

Taking a vow of poverty or not believing in Prosperity gospel

 

WOW.

 

WOW.

 

Wow. That really surprises me. I have never ever heard that taking a vow of poverty was considered "bad", nor have I even heard of Prosperity gospel.

 

This is so interesting because in my experiences, living in poverty was often shown in a much more positive light than living in prosperity. Not that we ever believed or were taught that wealth was intrinsically bad or that you couldn't be a good Christian if you were rich, but poor people and poorness always got the attention. I mean, one of the vows very common to RC religious life is poverty.

 

Hahaha. I told my boyfriend about this Prosperity gospel, and he laughed and said, "Oh, those are the special kind".

[HelloWorld]

-It was wrong to prayer for peace with people of other religions. Instead we had to pray "for there Salvation and defeat, not for there peace" There words not mine.

 

That is really sad. I feel genuinely sorry for people who continue to believe that. How is that even close to loving one's neighbour? I will have to agree with you that they are a hate cult.

[Exalya]

Sex ed was a big no-no. Any kind of sex ed, from parents or school. It was really cool being totally uninformed.

 

The bible was the only book you needed to read or should read, aside from schoolbooks. If you read any other philosophy, any books about the bible, or any fantasy revolving around a fake religion/magic/etc. you were polluting your mind with the word of man. My mother found it very difficult to pry books away from me and just made snide comments all the time.

 

Since the word of man is no good, almost all pastors and churches were not good enough. Arnold Murray of the "Shepherd's Chapel" was the only guy who had it right. We had to meet in a shack and read the bible word for word and take as many words as possible back to the original hebrew. Any comments about the bible and its laws were totally inappropriate. Any interpretation aside from the "original" interpretation were useless.

 

Followed the "food laws".

 

People who were mentally unstable were demon-possessed. People who thought differently or followed other religions were demon-possessed. Atheists were definitely possessed. When I decided I had enough of the crap and got angry about it, I was possessed as well. Obviously.

 

Singing songs was bogus. A sermon was to have one song, and then a whole lot of bible study. Worship and self-fulfillment was for crazy liberal christians.

 

Friends were considered overrated and dangerous. Most people could not follow the bible as we could, so most people were sub-standard. Anyone who drank at all, cussed at all, or was considered "liberal" in any fashion was to be avoided.

 

Marrying someone of another race was considered cruel to the children and unnatural. Black people were fine as long as you didn't have kids with them.

[Trike]

Taking a vow of poverty or not believing in Prosperity gospel

 

WOW.

 

WOW.

 

Wow. That really surprises me. I have never ever heard that taking a vow of poverty was considered "bad", nor have I even heard of Prosperity gospel.

 

This is so interesting because in my experiences, living in poverty was often shown in a much more positive light than living in prosperity. Not that we ever believed or were taught that wealth was intrinsically bad or that you couldn't be a good Christian if you were rich, but poor people and poorness always got the attention. I mean, one of the vows very common to RC religious life is poverty.

 

Hahaha. I told my boyfriend about this Prosperity gospel, and he laughed and said, "Oh, those are the special kind".

 

Oh, it is indeed "special". Basically an excuse for the pastor to get a Jaguar while the rest of the congregation was struggling to keep their homes, put their kids through school, pay medical bills, etc (and the congregation I belonged to was not poor, but we had other preachers come through from poor congregations that flew in on their private jets!) And if you aren't rich then you haven't got enough faith.

 

And I think the connection to the vows taken historically by many Catholic orders is one of the main reasons why being poor=bad in many churches that hate Catholicism.

 

Which brings me to another thing deemed heretical by my former church. If you didn't believe that the Roman Catholic church was the whore of Babylon and that Catholics weren't true Christians then they wouldn't fellowship with you.

[Guest M_H]

Yeah, I went to a Calvary Chapel spinoff, Applegate Christian Fellowship.

 

In addition to most the others, the one that hasnt been mentioned is masturbation.

 

What a harmless thing thats not even mentioned in the bible to disallow. Im pretty sure enjoying rainbows and sunsets were next on the list.

[peejay]

I went to an independent church that was pretty disillusioned with most of what is happening in the church at large anyway.

 

The Biggies Include:

-the bible is not the word of god, christ is

-no dating because bf/gf relationships are not mentioned in scripture

-no drinking, smoking, or premarital sex

-god doesn't live in heaven, he lives in "us"

-communion means fellowship in greek so they don't do crackers and grape juice

-in jesus' name is not allowed at the end of prayers because name means "character" and emphasis was placed on the character behind the prayer rather than the mantra

-tongues are encouraged in personal life not in public

-worship is man's purpose ...not ministry, not missions, not jobs or spouses, but worship (not just singing but submitted every part of your life to god)

-dedicated members are "one with the body" and therefore do not move to the city to get good jobs etc. they stay in this small town of 15K people where average family income is much less than they could make otherwise.

-rumor around town for a while was we were a gay cult ...they actually preach against homosexuality, the kids just waited until after college to start getting married and since most of them are the same age, they all got married in a three year span

-once saved always saved is a lie

-no christian tv, books, radio, etc., (UFC is fine though)

-it is possible to attain perfection through the power of the holy spirit by submitting one's mind, will, and emotions to him at the moment of temptation

-the basic message of the place is fall in love with god, fall in love with people, walk with god until perfected

-science is discouraged...maybe not publicly but I was informed on numerous occasions that I couldn't rely on science and I would have to lay it down to walk with god...I was told I was too smart for my own good, and publicly ridiculed from the pulpit (well ridiculed is a strong word...made fun of though) for knowing "big" words like epiphany, and certain scientific principles

[upstarter]

I had honestly shut out many of these completely cracked things I had been taught. Thanks everyone for the horrific reminder of what I have shed!!

 

Um... one question... please clarify what is heretical about a church having a kitchen???? That one is new to me.

 

Heather

[OpheliaGinger]

Here is what my churches found liberal:

 

Having a kitchen

 

 

As assbackwards as it sounds, there are some segments of the Church of Christ (real fundamentalist) that believe that it is a sin to have a kitchen in the church. But honestly, how can you reason with someone who genuinely believes that the Church of Christ descended directly from 1st century Christians?

[Raul]

Ignoring the OT (heh,we didn't even call it that )... You know,not obeying kashrut,not celebrating easter according to jewish calendar , that stuff...