Mr. Neil Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Okay, I'm sick and fucking tired of these creationists showing up and acting like fucking experts only to show their naivity when drilled about real biological phenomena. Time and time again, many of us have shown that hardly any of the creationists know anything about biology. The problem is that if they don't know anything about biology, then what the fuck are they doing acting as if they're raising "serious questions" about evolution? Heck most of them don't even seem to know that evolution is a theory of biology. They keep showing up, thinking that they can debunk evolution by attacking dating methods or using Hovind quotes about fossils. You have to pull teeth to get them to actually answer questions about genetics, and even then, they're like, "Well I don't know much about that. Perhaps you could fill me in." FUCK YOU!!!! I'm tired of doing all the work for creationists. I'm not your fucking bitch! Do the research your fucking selves, you lazy-ass mother fuckers! Besides, you are the one who came here acting as though you know enough to raise "serious questions" about evolution, and yet you know abso-fucking-lutely zero about it. I think that if you're going to act as though you are some kind of informed skeptic of evolution, that you should at least know a little something about biology. Is this a justifiable expectation?! YES! This expectation is in no way unreasonable. I'm tired of vapid arguments that could only have come from uninformed minds. I'm tired of nitwits who read nothing but creationist sites all day and come here like they have any understanding at all. Creationists! We know when you do that. We know when you ignore pro-evolution resources. You say things that no informed human being would say. Don't think that you're going to fool us. Read a book by a real biologist some time. It's not going to fucking hurt you! Jesus fucking christ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I do SO love a good rant! Go get 'em, Mr. Neil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkenmoon Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I know what you mean. "If evolution is right, and we came from monkeys then why are there still monkeys?" Sheesh! Arrogance and ignorance. a very bad combination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I agree MrNeil. It all gets really frustrating. At least there should be a minimal required amount of reading about the subject before they start criticizing. I hate the "I don't know anything, but I know it's all wrong!" Don't they see that they might think it's wrong, just because they don't know enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixentrox Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Your wrong Neil. Creationist know plenty about evelotion. They know only athesits and satan worshipers belive in it. They know thier preacher told them it was evil. They know thier bible doesn't really speak on evolution. They know they are being persecuted by Darwin worshipers. See...they know a lot about evolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trashy Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Speaking as an ex YEC believer; ignorance comes because of having faith in the "expert" Christian creationist. It is sad, but true and you have every right to feel this irritablity towards those who attack the theory of evolution. I don't know enough science one way or the other, but I so looked up to Hovind. :-( However, I'm glad that now, we're reading secular materials and I'll learn slowy but surely. I remember when I first discovered that 'Dr.' Carl Baugh might have received his supposed degrees from a diploma mill. Then I ran across evidence that the people at ICR had similar issues. Very disconcerting. Believe it or not, that was the first time I had doubts about YEC. I mean, if the only people supporting the YEC position are all faking their degrees, what does that say? Speaking of simians, if I understand correctly the current theory is that we share a common ancestor/ancestry with the simian branches, right? This is what confuses YEC-types so much since they think of it as one single line of progression rather than multiple branches, which is why you get those "why are there still apes?" questions..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highvoltage Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Speaking of simians, if I understand correctly the current theory is that we share a common ancestor/ancestry with the simian branches, right? This is what confuses YEC-types so much since they think of it as one single line of progression rather than multiple branches, which is why you get those "why are there still apes?" questions..... Yeah, humans and "apes" (ie. chimpanzees, gorillas, orangutans, etc) share a common ancestry; we did not evolve from them. (to the best of my understanding, anyway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixentrox Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Humans didn't evolve from apes...just had a common ancestor. Somewhere along the way our paths split from that ancestor. That's the basic gist of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I'm tired of vapid arguments that could only have come from uninformed minds. What is fascinating in sort of a demented way is that they find the balls to argue with something they don't understand and actually challenge expert opinions. I'm probably as poorly equipped to argue for or against evolution, or more so than TJR or even Invictus, but I know better than to enter the debate arena. Why do they feel they are qualified to enter? Of course I have taken biology and botany at the university level, and even passed with decent grades, but I can't imagine trying to defend or worse, attack evolution with my very elementary knowledge of the subject. I find it astounding that they don't have this same sense of self preservation and that they enter into the debate forum when it is obvious to even those such as myself that they know nothing about the subject. Someone told them that xtianity and evolution are diametrically opposed, so they step out in faith and make fools of themselves in front of everyone but themselves. It would be funny if it weren't so sad. Even so Mr Neil, and Hans, and CT, et al, I am thoroughly grateful for the free education you are providing me and others as we follow along in your debates. I look up to all of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Of course I have taken biology and botany at the university level, and even passed with decent grades... Even so Mr Neil, and Hans, and CT, et al, I am thoroughly grateful for the free education you are providing me and others as we follow along in your debates. I look up to all of you. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> How can I put this... You qualifications in biology and botany far out-strip mine. (hell, I didn't even manage basic biology at school... too busy with Chem and physics) Most of what I know is all self-taught or learnt by reading debates. You do me a great honour by even implying that I'm in the same class as Neil and Han. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TruthWarrior Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Humans didn't evolve from apes...just had a common ancestor. Somewhere along the way our paths split from that ancestor. That's the basic gist of it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Seems like it's splitting hairs. Wasn't the common ancestor ape/monkey-like at one point anyway? Christians just can't fathom, nor desire to be related to any sort of animal. It's just icky and sinful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TruthWarrior Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I'm tired of nitwits who read nothing but creationist sites all day and come here like they have any understanding at all. You should make a website for them. Would save alot of time having to repeat yourself. Something easy reading with short words and big pictures. Reading theistic evolution websites help me transition out of the wackiness. Now I really dont care much about it all. Everyone stresses out too much over it. It's a silly thing to send people to hell for not knowing the exact age of earth and when it will end. But they love to do it for some twisted reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Your wrong Neil. Creationist know plenty about evelotion. They know only athesits and satan worshipers belive in it. They know thier preacher told them it was evil. They know thier bible doesn't really speak on evolution. They know they are being persecuted by Darwin worshipers. See...they know a lot about evolution. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Amen, Brother! Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 I completely agree! I'm tired of Christians wanting us to do their own homework for them. Why should we have to prove anything? They are the ones making irrational statements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Well, what do you expect? Most creationists thinks: 1: I'll beat Mr Neil! 2: Posts idiotic semantics 3: Mr Neil correct me. 4: I win! Honestly, there's no reasoning with Jesusfilled groanbarks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 FUCK YOU!!!! I'm tired of doing all the work for creationists. I'm not your fucking bitch! Do the research your fucking selves, you lazy-ass mother fuckers! Besides, you are the one who came here acting as though you know enough to raise "serious questions" about evolution, and yet you know abso-fucking-lutely zero about it. I think that if you're going to act as though you are some kind of informed skeptic of evolution, that you should at least know a little something about biology. Is this a justifiable expectation?! YES! Don't throw in the opportunity-for-education-towel just yet, Neil. Few people can explain the intricacies of evolution in such a way that people who have never studied it can more easily grasp the science behind it. You are one of those people. I still think that you should plant your feet in the publishing industry and write a book along the lines of, Evolution For Dummies, or something like that. Heck, you've got the writing skills. The illustrations are a given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Neil Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 I still think that you should plant your feet in the publishing industry and write a book along the lines of, Evolution For Dummies, or something like that.Or better yet, I could title it Evolution For Creationists. *waits patiently for everyone to get that* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Or better yet, I could title it Evolution For Creationists. *waits patiently for everyone to get that* Oh hell yes!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Yes, I chime in: the world would profit from any public explanation of evolution you might make, Mr. Neil! We'd all profit on here, that's for sure. I think we all should challenge every person who talks about Intelligent Design Theory. Force them to state the conditions under which ID could be falsified. So far I have not seen any IDer answer that question on this site, at least. And it's been posed to each one who has come on here recently. I also have one area of disquiet: people like Invictus have zoomed straight from the debate on evolution to the debate on abiogenesis without grasping that they are two different questions. IDers fold evolution into abiogenesis. In addition to telling them that they are two different questions, I find it has helped when Mr. Neil, CT, Han and Mr. Spooky, to name a few, have reported the results of work done so far on constructing a model for abiogenesis. Ditto with the Big Bang. Here the problem is different because we can't do experiments. But I have learned a lot from Han and others who have presented hypotheses. From what I have read, Anthony Flew's "conversion" to deism was motivated by his inability to imagine how the Big Bang and abiogenesis could have occurred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highvoltage Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Actually, the big bang model can and has been tested. By studying the cosmic microwave background, we can deduce the conditions present in the early universe (this is simple black body radiation from thermodynamics). The fact that this background is almost uniform across the sky tells us that the energy distribution of the early universe was once much more uniform, and judging by the temperature of the radiation now, VERY HOT! Add to this the data from our telescopes telling us the farther out something is, the faster it's flying away from us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highvoltage Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 And about what caused the big bang, no one knows. Well duh, but the truth is we know nothing about creating universes. It cannot be ruled out that our universe is only a part of a larger "metaverse", in which it is not against the laws of physics to create matter and energy, and thus, our universe. It is a logical fallacy to apply our laws of physics which bind us in our universe, to the force that created our universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highvoltage Posted August 7, 2005 Share Posted August 7, 2005 The fact that this background is almost uniform across the sky tells us that the energy distribution of the early universe was once much more uniform, and judging by the temperature of the radiation now, VERY HOT! A little more background on this. Our universe is very much like a black body radiator. The cosmic microwave background is an afterglow of when our universe was much younger and much hotter. It is an afterglow of what, to the best of our knowledge and reasoning, was a tremendous explosion at the earliest point in time that we can trace the history of our universe. It's "birth", so to speak. The subsequent expansion of the universe has cooled it down (think ideal gas law). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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