Seeking Advice From Christians

[FiddlingAround]

So many of us on this site grapple with the question of how to deal with our Christian family members. Personally, I haven't told my family yet, though I feel like a hypocrite so often now when I talk to them. I have to wonder, besides my own (considerable) discomfort with their possible reaction, would it be selfish of me to tell them something that would cause them such distress just so I can feel like an honest person?

 

So I come to you, seeking advice. What if one of your loved ones left the fold and became an ex-Christian? Would you want them to tell you, or keep it to themselves? How would you react? How would you deal with your loved one in that moment and in the future?

 

Sheer speculation on your reaction and the possible reactions of other Christians of your acquaintance (since your participation on this board already makes you a little unusual in Christian circles) is most welcome. I truly do want to handle this matter in the best way for all involved.

[Guest end3]

So many of us on this site grapple with the question of how to deal with our Christian family members. Personally, I haven't told my family yet, though I feel like a hypocrite so often now when I talk to them. I have to wonder, besides my own (considerable) discomfort with their possible reaction, would it be selfish of me to tell them something that would cause them such distress just so I can feel like an honest person?

 

So I come to you, seeking advice. What if one of your loved ones left the fold and became an ex-Christian? Would you want them to tell you, or keep it to themselves? How would you react? How would you deal with your loved one in that moment and in the future?

 

Sheer speculation on your reaction and the possible reactions of other Christians of your acquaintance (since your participation on this board already makes you a little unusual in Christian circles) is most welcome. I truly do want to handle this matter in the best way for all involved.

 

FA,

 

My father de-converted without ever much "coming out" when I was younger. As a younger adult, I had a few discussions/arguments with him that he really believed down deep but was just something, in denial maybe, I didn't know what.

 

Long story short, I would guess that it has much to do with the understanding of the ones you would tell. Sure, there might be a few attempts to "help you understand" by reasonable or maybe even unreasonable means, because in their hearts, I am sure they think that belief is the best option. (Please don't confuse this with those that would use religion for abuse). (Please, you heathens, hold all comments about OT animal sacrifice to thyselves )

 

To end, my dad was very sad that he could no longer believe to the point of becoming almost apologetic and in tears, which today makes me feel like an ass for "beating him with my God stick"....

 

Now we talk and sometimes discuss "for sport" as I think I now know more of the paths he has traveled, but still pray FA, that God has a special case for each of us.

 

My two cents...

[FiddlingAround]

Thanks for chiming in End3. And yeah...I guess I already knew that it really comes down to the personalities of the people involved. It's just a nerve-wracking thing, so I keep seeking more input.

 

At any rate, it's nice to hear of the fairly harmonious outcome in your family.

[Guest sonysj68]

Thanks for chiming in End3. And yeah...I guess I already knew that it really comes down to the personalities of the people involved. It's just a nerve-wracking thing, so I keep seeking more input.

 

At any rate, it's nice to hear of the fairly harmonious outcome in your family.

I personally would love you and treat you just the same. My feelings towards you would not change. I would pray for you earnestly but would not drive you nuts trying to cram my beliefs down your throat. My good friend had a very similar situation happen. She didn't see it coming and couldn't have predicted how she would react, but her "gut reaction" and her honest feeling was that her child (adult child) was still her child and she didn't feel differently about him and she wouldn't do anything to destroy their relationship. However, I can't predict how your family would react.

[FiddlingAround]

 

I personally would love you and treat you just the same. My feelings towards you would not change. I would pray for you earnestly but would not drive you nuts trying to cram my beliefs down your throat. My good friend had a very similar situation happen. She didn't see it coming and couldn't have predicted how she would react, but her "gut reaction" and her honest feeling was that her child (adult child) was still her child and she didn't feel differently about him and she wouldn't do anything to destroy their relationship. However, I can't predict how your family would react.

 

Thank you, sonysj. I think at this point I've decided to keep quiet for now. Most of the family I'd go ahead and tell, but my mother isn't ready yet. It's not that I'm afraid she'll get angry and disown me; she's much more likely to get panicky and emotional. Then there would be a series of conversations where she asked a left field sort of question, didn't really listen to the answer and keyed on the first 2 words to prompt a rant.

 

I did an unintentional test run of this when I attended an Orthodox church a few years back, so I know just how it would be - except this would be more so.

 

Anyway, my plan now is to drop hints for awhile, so that when the time does come it's something she's sad about but suspected, rather than a complete shock.

[Seeking]

I find this to be an interesting and relevant question. I'm fighting what I suspect is a losing battle against the disappearance of my faith, and I live in fear of the day my parents find out. Since they're Calvinists who wholeheartedly believe in election, it's not like they'd blame me, so it's not anger I fear: it's the deep, eternal sorrow I know they'd feel. The idea that their own daughter, whom they raised to love and honor God, might not be one God chose, would cause them such despair and heartache. I don't feel I can justify subjecting them to that just to ease my guilt about not being completely honest with them. The outcome would not be worth it.

[chefranden]

...I don't feel I can justify subjecting them to that just to ease my guilt about not being completely honest with them. The outcome would not be worth it.

 

Have you ever asked them if they would want to know? That would be tough if you are an only child. If you have siblings you could ask it hypothetically. "If it turns out that God has not chosen one of us, would you want to know?"

[Deva]

Thanks for chiming in End3. And yeah...I guess I already knew that it really comes down to the personalities of the people involved. It's just a nerve-wracking thing, so I keep seeking more input.

 

At any rate, it's nice to hear of the fairly harmonious outcome in your family.

I personally would love you and treat you just the same. My feelings towards you would not change. I would pray for you earnestly but would not drive you nuts trying to cram my beliefs down your throat. My good friend had a very similar situation happen. She didn't see it coming and couldn't have predicted how she would react, but her "gut reaction" and her honest feeling was that her child (adult child) was still her child and she didn't feel differently about him and she wouldn't do anything to destroy their relationship. However, I can't predict how your family would react.

 

Sonys: some of us would rather not say anything to our Christian parents. Reason being, we don't like the idea of them "praying for us earnestly" because they figure we are hellbound. I commend you though, if you really are serious when you say "My feelings towards you would not change" and you wouldn't try to witness everyday.

[Deva]

I find this to be an interesting and relevant question. I'm fighting what I suspect is a losing battle against the disappearance of my faith, and I live in fear of the day my parents find out. Since they're Calvinists who wholeheartedly believe in election, it's not like they'd blame me, so it's not anger I fear: it's the deep, eternal sorrow I know they'd feel. The idea that their own daughter, whom they raised to love and honor God, might not be one God chose, would cause them such despair and heartache. I don't feel I can justify subjecting them to that just to ease my guilt about not being completely honest with them. The outcome would not be worth it.

 

My parents are not Calvinists, but Fundamentalist Baptists. I completely sympathize with what you are saying Seeking. If anything, my situation is even worse because my folks do not believe in election, so the blame is entirely mine. This is why for the last 10 years I have not told my parents I am not a Christian, for much the same reasons as you describe. It is a very difficult situation.

[HRDWarrior]

I also have not chosen to tell my parents, however, I am curious for those who have also chosen "not to tell" for the time being, how do you deal with comments and conversations regarding religion that seem to be inevitable with our Christian families. That has been the most difficult part of my choosing not to tell - when they make comments like "praise God" or "God must have a plan" I have trouble responding. Thus far I tend to stick with a non-commital uh-uh or say nothing at all and move on with the conversation. However, it drives me nuts to have them sit there and not make their own decisions because they're so busy waiting on their non-existant god, yet they complain to me constantly about all their problems! If an opportunity arises I try to find a way to provide "real" advice, but my non commitment to god in my answers has my mom questioning my belief - which is true, but I KNOW she doesn't want to hear the real answer (unfortunatly I know her far too well to think I'm interpretting it wrong).

 

Theological debates I can generally hold my own, but even then I still sometimes have to be careful not to let my knowledge come out too much...the contradictions I see I have trouble not bringing up if they pertain to the subject matter, and since I cannot just go with pat answers, my mom knows something is up, even though we live across the country, I can't stand lying all the time, and it's got her questioning me on a regular basis.

 

So how do you guys deal with that end of it?

[Seeking]

I also have not chosen to tell my parents, however, I am curious for those who have also chosen "not to tell" for the time being, how do you deal with comments and conversations regarding religion that seem to be inevitable with our Christian families.

 

So how do you guys deal with that end of it?

 

How do I deal with it? Avoidance would be my preferred method, but like you said, that's not always an option! In fact, a few months ago my parents drove my husband and me to the airport after a visit, and on the ENTIRE 2+ hour drive, my mom, dad, and husband engaged in a theological debate about election and whether or not God is being "fair" when He condemns those whose hearts He himself has hardened. My husband (who is at the same place I am with Christianity) gave my parents a run for their money, but he never let on that he had doubts or didn't believe. I, however, spent the whole drive huddled up against the door of the car in agonizing silence, hoping upon hope that no one would ask my opinion! It was the most miserable 2-hour car ride I've even been on. I felt like such a coward, but I was terrified that I'd inadvertently say something like, "Actually, I disagree with your viewpoint because IT'S ALL COMPLETE RUBBISH!!" And then the earth-shattering silence would be followed by my mother's sobs.

[Guest ephymeris]

I haven't told my family either. It would break my in-laws hearts and I secretly worry they would hold me responsible for deconverting their son and be unendingly worried for our (as of yet unborn) children. I haven't told my own parents because my mom is more than a little crazy and lashes out viciously when she feels something is wrong then retreats and refuses to talk about the issue or to you at all. I know she would also live knowing I'm hellbound and that would torture her.

 

I had an opportunity to tell my Mom one time but when I tried to tell her she freaked out and told me I was a bigger disappointment than my drug addict, brain injured, complete fuck-up brother. That she had failed to raise either of her children "correctly." She also blamed me for hiding my "true nature" from her and accused me of secretly laughing at her and thinking she was stupid for her opinions. She told me she never wanted to know this about me, ignorance is bliss, blah blah blah. All this from a myspace invite and one non-christian on my friends list...I let it stew a few days then just decided it was easiest for me to lie. She didn't deserve to know the truth. So I lied an it soothed her but now she lets me know she thinks I'm a liar but she won't come out right and say it, she just treats me as if I'm marked with a scarlet A. Wouldn't be the first time in my life but I thought 25 years was plenty of time to grow up and change your ways...

[Deva]

The "not telling your parents in order to spare their feelings" thing does tend to wear you down over the years. I live 1,200 miles away, which helps, but my mother would send me subscriptions to Christian devotional materials. For about 10 years I just threw them in the trash and then one day decided I would write a letter. I wrote in a very polite way that I appreciated it, but I just didn't have time to read them, so please discontinue the subscription. That actually worked. I believe that one time i also wrote that I did not want to discuss religion with them. That has pretty much worked, but it is like the elephant in the room. They don't know a whole side of me that is really pretty important to know about. They used to send me tracts with every birthday and Christmas card but the last birthday card did not contain one. Maybe it was because told them I was seeing a counselor for stress, and that clued them in. If it does happen that they send me any more tracts, I may have to finally address the issue, but probably in writing.

 

My parents are pretty low key emotionally so that is good. They have not really tried to talk to me about religion, so that is good. It is really hard to visit them though. The walls in their house are lined with Bible verses and crosses, Bibles laying around, prayer lists where I can see them, and see I am on it, Rush Limebaugh, FOX news 24-4, etc. You get the picture.

[Seeking]

The "not telling your parents in order to spare their feelings" thing does tend to wear you down over the years.

 

My parents are pretty low key emotionally so that is good. They have not really tried to talk to me about religion, so that is good. It is really hard to visit them though. The walls in their house are lined with Bible verses and crosses, Bibles laying around, prayer lists where I can see them, and see I am on it, Rush Limebaugh, FOX news 24-4, etc. You get the picture.

 

Yeah, I'm feeling worn down, and I'm not even officially "de-converted" yet! (Or at least, I haven't admitted it to myself yet.) I currently live 1000+ miles from my parents, too, and while the visits are infrequent, in EVERY phone conversation with my mother, she asks me about church, Bible studies, etc.

 

Like yours, my parents' faith is very front-and-center in their lives.

[oddbird1963]

The "not telling your parents in order to spare their feelings" thing does tend to wear you down over the years. I live 1,200 miles away, which helps, but my mother would send me subscriptions to Christian devotional materials. For about 10 years I just threw them in the trash and then one day decided I would write a letter. I wrote in a very polite way that I appreciated it, but I just didn't have time to read them, so please discontinue the subscription. That actually worked. I believe that one time i also wrote that I did not want to discuss religion with them. That has pretty much worked, but it is like the elephant in the room. They don't know a whole side of me that is really pretty important to know about. They used to send me tracts with every birthday and Christmas card but the last birthday card did not contain one. Maybe it was because told them I was seeing a counselor for stress, and that clued them in. If it does happen that they send me any more tracts, I may have to finally address the issue, but probably in writing.

 

My parents are pretty low key emotionally so that is good. They have not really tried to talk to me about religion, so that is good. It is really hard to visit them though. The walls in their house are lined with Bible verses and crosses, Bibles laying around, prayer lists where I can see them, and see I am on it, Rush Limebaugh, FOX news 24-4, etc. You get the picture.

 

Ok, I've gotta inquire. What the heck is a "tract"? From what I've gathered here, they're like the grocery store circulars that pile up in my mailbox, except they're selling Jesus.

 

You have my sympathies, Deva. Christians. There's a big problem there.

 

Phanta

 

Phanta,

 

I've passed out more than a few "gospel tracts" in my day. They're essentially small foldout presentations of scriptures or little booklets. Very small - they can usually fit in your shirt pocket with plenty of room to spare.

 

Of course Chick Tracts are the most infamous. They are crude,insensitive and demonstrate a totally warped view of the universe. They are literally meant to scare the hell out of you.

 

More well known bible tracts are Billy Graham's "Steps to Peace With God" and Campus Crusade for Christ's "Four Spiritual Laws."

 

Hope that helps.

 

Thanks for the trip down memory lane - I think.

 

OB '63

[Seeking]

Ok, I've gotta inquire. What the heck is a "tract"? From what I've gathered here, they're like the grocery store circulars that pile up in my mailbox, except they're selling Jesus.

 

This is a tract.

[Deva]

Ok, I've gotta inquire. What the heck is a "tract"? From what I've gathered here, they're like the grocery store circulars that pile up in my mailbox, except they're selling Jesus.

 

You have my sympathies, Deva. Christians. There's a big problem there.

 

Phanta

 

Specifically, it is this one:

 

http://www.godssimpleplan.org/gsps-english.html

 

Yes, it is called "God's Simple Plan of Salvation". It is a bit insulting because I have seen it since I was five and they are still hammering me with it 45 years later.

 

Its not Christians in general that's a big problem, Phanta, its just the type of Christianity that says we must go out and do "soul winning" because to these types of Christians any other type of living is worse than being on the streets or a drug addict, like Ephymeris said.

[FiddlingAround]

I also have not chosen to tell my parents, however, I am curious for those who have also chosen "not to tell" for the time being, how do you deal with comments and conversations regarding religion that seem to be inevitable with our Christian families. That has been the most difficult part of my choosing not to tell - when they make comments like "praise God" or "God must have a plan" I have trouble responding. Thus far I tend to stick with a non-commital uh-uh or say nothing at all and move on with the conversation. However, it drives me nuts to have them sit there and not make their own decisions because they're so busy waiting on their non-existant god, yet they complain to me constantly about all their problems! If an opportunity arises I try to find a way to provide "real" advice, but my non commitment to god in my answers has my mom questioning my belief - which is true, but I KNOW she doesn't want to hear the real answer (unfortunatly I know her far too well to think I'm interpretting it wrong).

 

Theological debates I can generally hold my own, but even then I still sometimes have to be careful not to let my knowledge come out too much...the contradictions I see I have trouble not bringing up if they pertain to the subject matter, and since I cannot just go with pat answers, my mom knows something is up, even though we live across the country, I can't stand lying all the time, and it's got her questioning me on a regular basis.

 

So how do you guys deal with that end of it?

 

My family all lives close to me and I see them often, so it isn't easy. It's worst with my aunt who has become increasingly fundie over the last year. With her, I make non-replies like "Hmmm.." or "Wow" whenever possible. When she gets really bad, I look away and don't reply at all until she runs out of steam, then change the subject.

 

Ironically, the least bothersome Xtian in my family is the one I worry most about telling. My mother has pretty much cut out religious talk with me - I think she realizes it makes me uncomfortable. But I also know that she would be very upset to find out I'm not Xtian at all. So I don't tell my aunt whose Xtianity annoys me because she would tell my mother whose Xtianity doesn't so much (except that she's indoctrinating my little sisters). And if you could've seen my mom's face when I said I wasn't going to church just for the summer while choir was out. Of course, that was as good as admitting that I only go for choir, which was the whole point of mentioning it. Small steps, get her used to the idea in phases.

 

I don't really care if they pray for me, just so long as they don't witness to me.