Regarding Cindy Sheehan and Freedom of Speech

[Amethyst]

Since when has it become "inappropriate" for American citizens to ask questions of their government? We< have a right to know what is going on. We have a right to know why George W. Bush is afraid to answer the questions of one American mother who lost her son in a terrible war.

 

Since when has it become anti-American to want to know the truth? We are now living in the Orwellian era of 1984, complete with its "war is peace" slogan and doublethink. How long until the English language becomes Orwellian, too, so that we can't ask questions and demand the truth?

 

This is supposed to be a democracy, not a tyranny or even a monarchy with King George at the head of it, no matter how much he might want that to be the case. I am really getting fed up with the assertations that American citizens don't have the right to question the government.

 

We do. And I'm asking, why?

 

I am tired of living in a country where people are afraid to express their opinions for fear of retribution, of losing their jobs, their friends, or their family's love. This is not true freedom of speech.

 

But we have become a nation where so many people are afraid to write their thoughts down and say what they think. We have become a nation where people are afraid to question the powers that be. Nobody wants to question anymore. And you know, when you stop questioning, when you just accept whatever happens, you invite bad things to happen like the holocaust and dicatorships and other stuff. So if you're wondering why I question, that's why.

 

I don't want to see my nation become like WWII Germany. I don't want it to become a place like 1984 where we are spied upon in our own homes and can't even keep journals for fear of what the govt. might do to us. I don't ever want to lose my freedom to write and to be who I am. Freedom of speech is one of the things that make America great, but sadly, we are losing it because nobody seems to care.

 

That is why I ask questions. That is why I want to know the truth. I hope that others will, too.

[nightflight]

Lets not forget that it goes both way. When the right doesn't like what you have to say, they call it anti-Americanism. When the left doesn't like it, they call it "hate-speech".

[Checkmate]

I was going to comment and agree with you, Amethyst, but then I changed my mind.

 

I'm afraid of getting in trouble for speaking my mind.

 

If anyone needs me, I'll be burning my books, notes and wiping my computer memory of any incriminating evidence.

[♦ nivek ♦]

I admire Mrs. Sheehan for her tenacity and ability to at least protest what she sees as a horrible wrong.

 

Polls show that this little mis-adventure is not popularly supported by a majority of those polled ( I wasn't called or asked to particpate tho!).

 

We've spent our Treasury dry, we're bleeding our Armed Forces of its vitality. Domestic problems are ignored and under funded.

 

so far few DARE speak out against this unConstitutional impeachable set of acts which are killing us as a Nation.

 

Save one "Crazy Woman".

 

It may be steaming piles of bullshit to some, her protests. However she has the guts to publicly decry and fight against the machine...

 

How many of you have that and do so for your causes?

 

Cindy has {i]"counted the costs"[/i] and does as she believes needs done.

 

 

 

kL

[nightflight]

I don't know Nivek.......many people may share her view but just don't have the resources to take time off from work to do what she is doing.

[Vixentrox]

I listened to her bitching about why Bush didn't send his daughters. Here's one...if her son wouldn't have joined the military, her son wouldn't have been there just like the Bush girls aren't. He wasn't drafted, he knew the risks.

[Amethyst]

I don't know Nivek.......many people may share her view but just don't have the resources to take time off from work to do what she is doing.

 

I don't share ALL of it. I don't think, for example, that we should pull out immediately without considering the consequences. But I do admire her for standing up. And I do write about the things I care about in my live journal, precisely because I can't afford to take time off to go protest or something.

[♦ nivek ♦]

C'mon Vixen...

 

Serviuce life is "good for kids".

 

Young adults like the Bush girls are prime material for recruiters. Smart, should be healthy enough for rigours of mil_army_life.

 

*Everyone* knows that joining the mil_system makes better citizens.

 

G-daddy and Dad Bush did their time. Where are they following the family traditions?

 

If war is good enough for my kid, it is more than good enough for the chidren of the more financially privilidged. Imagine the boot to recruitment if the Bush girl(s) joined up for a hitch?

 

Until I see the KONgress kritters and our Proctors kids lining up to join up and help the war effort, I will remain sceptical and unconvinced that this set of current events is a worthwhile endeavor.

 

kL

[Vixentrox]

Service life was good for me. Steady paycheck, world travel, learn skills, educational benifits, health care.

[Pariah]

How long until the English language becomes Orwellian, too, so that we can't ask questions and demand the truth?

It seems to me that language is already being manipulated in the U.S. for the purposes of political and religious control (maybe not in an Orwellian way, though, I haven't read 1984 yet). Patriotism now means blindly and unquestioningly following what the current administration says. Freedom of speech is being allowed to say whatever you want as long as it doesn't offend the majority. Terrorists are now any enemy of the United States. Anyone who has strong political views is deemed a radical nut or a conspiracy theorist. Being homophobic is renamed being pro-"family values". Etc.

[Amethyst]

Agreed, Pariah.

 

I saw an article somewhere about how netspeak is similar to Orwellian newspeak.

[♦ nivek ♦]

Service life was good for me.  Steady paycheck, world travel, learn skills, educational benifits, health care.

 

Vixen..

 

Were folks trying to kill you when stationed overseas?

 

I know it takes a ton of support people for every doggie out in field, not everyone in Service is a Shooter.

 

It is the Shooters taking the brunt of these missions as usual, the kids up front getting blown to ratfuck and shot to rags.

 

I don't decry the folks *not on the front lines*, nor ever knock on your service.

 

The big however is that it is my opinion that whatever this current aspect of the Bush Occupation of Iraq is doing, it is not in our Nations best interest to continue doing whatever it is.

 

The Shooters are getting whacked for what? The slight promise of benefits and care are scant compared to the mess we are involved in?

 

Dunno Vixen, this has no easy answer, and again those who protest it are painted with a thick heavy brush of tar, making them *not 'merrikans*.

 

kL

[nightflight]

Just because people don't like Saint Cindy does not mean they question her right to free speech. I don't like the woman because of the baggage she brings, saying stupid things like "if Israel would leave Palestine there wouldn't be terrorism" or her attendence at a rally to support Lynne Stewart, the lawyer who smuggled material from Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman (the one who masterminded the first bombing of the World Trade Center) to his associates.

 

Who is trying to restrict her speech rights? Certainly not Bush, she's still camped out in Crawford. So some people call her anti-American. So what! Its just speech, and there is nothing new here, people have been tossing that rhetoric forever! Btw, I wonder what would happen if this was 1864? Bet ol Abe would have had her locked up, seeing as how he suspended habeas corpus during the war.

 

peace out

[Pariah]

nightflight: The issue, at least as I understand it, is not that freedom of speech is being governmentally restricted but that, as Amethyst said, it has "become "inappropriate" for American citizens to ask questions of their government."

[nightflight]

nightflight: The issue, at least as I understand it, is not that freedom of speech is being governmentally restricted but that, as Amethyst said, it has "become "inappropriate" for American citizens to ask questions of their government."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

But is this anything new?

[Amethyst]

Who is trying to restrict her speech rights? Certainly not Bush, she's still camped out in Crawford. So some people call her anti-American. So what! Its just speech, and there is nothing new here, people have been tossing that rhetoric forever! Btw, I wonder what would happen if this was 1864? Bet ol Abe would have had her locked up, seeing as how he suspended habeas corpus during the war.

 

TV station refuses to air anti-war ad days before Bush visit

 

Yes, I probably should have included that in my initial post. My fault.

[Vixentrox]

Vixen..

 

Were folks trying to kill you when stationed overseas?

 

I know it takes a ton of support people for every doggie out in field, not everyone in Service is a Shooter.

 

It is the Shooters taking the brunt of these missions as usual, the kids up front getting blown to ratfuck and shot to rags.

 

I don't decry the folks *not on the front lines*, nor ever knock on your service.

 

The big however is that it is my opinion that whatever this current aspect of the Bush Occupation of Iraq is doing, it is not in our Nations best interest to continue doing whatever it is.

 

The Shooters are getting whacked for what? The slight promise of benefits and care are scant compared to the mess we are involved in?

 

Dunno Vixen, this has no easy answer, and again those who protest it are painted with a thick heavy brush of tar, making them *not 'merrikans*.

 

kL

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

They take thier chances and the support folks getting wacked over there too. As an Army friend of mine said, better to be in a combat unit there. At least they know how to fight back better than a support unit. Still, the bottom line is, her son volunteered. Rolled the dice and they came up wrong, just like the cops getting shot in the states or the football player who just dropped dead at practice.

[nightflight]

TV station refuses to air anti-war ad days before Bush visit

 

Yes, I probably should have included that in my initial post.  My fault.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

A private tv station has the right to determine its content. I'm sure they're decision was in part a business one: SLC is a conservative town with conservative viewers. Money talks. Anyway, I'm sure the station's newscasts have told of the Sheehan saga.

 

Besides, the other local station will run the ad.

 

Again, nothing new here.

[Amethyst]

But that's just like the stations that refused to air the UCC's ads because they were too controversial. A TV station should be in the business of encouraging freedom of speech, not restricting it, IMHO.

[nightflight]

But that's just like the stations that refused to air the UCC's ads because they were too controversial.  A TV station should be in the business of encouraging freedom of speech, not restricting it, IMHO.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

However, in a free market a station has the right to watch its bottom line and do what it feels is financially feasible. This is an ad we're talking about. Would you feel the same if the Aryan Nations wanted to put up an ad and a station refused?

[Amethyst]

That's hardly the same thing, IMHO. Cindy Sheehan's views aren't hate speech, at least from what I have seen so far.

[nightflight]

That's hardly the same thing, IMHO.  Cindy Sheehan's views aren't hate speech, at least from what I have seen so far.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But shouldn't hate speech be given the same protection as other speech? Isn't that what the First Amendment is for?

 

Why is it ok for a tv station to refuse to run an ad by Aryan Nations but it is not ok for them to refuse another ad?

[Amethyst]

If they want to run it, that's their perogative. I think it might actually be a good thing in the long run because it would encourage debate on the subject and get people to talk about it. Some people might even change their long-held prejudiced views because of it.

 

Don't you think it's a little suspicious that they refused to air the Sheehan ad when Bush was coming to their town? I think there's more to it than a purely business decision. Did you even read the article?

[nightflight]

Don't you think it's a little suspicious that they refused to air the Sheehan ad when Bush was coming to their town? I think there's more to it than a purely business decision. Did you even read the article?

 

I read the article. Are you suggesting that Bush somehow pressured the station? If so, then you must ask why the other station is running the ad.

[Amethyst]

Not Bush himself. It just sounded like they gave in to political pressure in general. But then, how do we know one of Bush's cronies didn't call them?