Guest artislife Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Hi everybody, I'd like to introduce myself. I am Jewish by birth, from a non-religious family. My parents were from Brooklyn, and my mom often said they were "Jewish by osmosis", because they lived in a neighborhood where practically everybody was Jewish. It was really a cultural, ethnic identity, not very religious. They moved to Northern Virginia when I was 7, and talk about culture shock! I was one of only two Jewish children in my 4th grade. I was enrolled in Hebrew school, but soon rebelled and wouldn't go, because I was aware my dad didn't believe girls should have a bat mitzvah, that it was only for boys. (He was from an old-fashioned, more traditional family than my mom.) Growing up, we would celebrate Hanukkah with presents and candles, but never went to services or seders, or do anything else Jewish except for go out to eat at a Chinese restaurant on Christmas day. But our Jewish identity was important to us, especially in such a southern, Christian-by-default environment. In college in the late seventies, I was searching for something spiritual to believe in. One of my best friends became "born again" over a summer, and I saw a remarkable change in him. From a depressed, shy person, he became happy and outgoing. He started working on me to convert me, and having no real faith of my own, and no ability to reason against him, I succumbed to the siren call of Christianity. From the very beginning, it felt very wrong to me, but I felt I was trapped. I was caught in the fear of being a non-believer and going to hell. I went from being a happy, creative person (I was in art school) to being an anxious, nervous, doubter. I attended a non-denominational church that endorsed prophesy and speaking in tongues, but that never happened to me. I assumed I just didn't have enough faith, and I prayed and prayed, and talked to people, and retreated into myself. I dropped my old friends, sold my rock albums, stopped reading books except for the bible. After college, I moved back home and attended a similar church. I met my future husband there, and somehow he was the one thinking person in that church. He could see how crazy and controlling that environment was, and we both left it and joined a different, less charismatic church. But after our wedding (which was Christian, and I still cringe when I think of my Jewish relatives graciously sitting through that ridiculous sermon), we never darkened a church's door again. We went for years being happily nothing, and had two sons. When our boys were 6 and 1, my mother-in-law (a gracious southern lady) politely asked me what Passover was about, and to my shame, I couldn't tell her. I started feeling bad that I couldn't pass on my Jewish heritage to my boys, and that I knew so little about it myself. I contacted a rabbi, and set up a meeting to reassure myself that my boys were actually Jewish, because I was Jewish (it was an ethnic, cultural identity that I was proud of and wanted to pass on.) But this rabbi was of the thoughtful opinion that it wasn't so easy. Because I had actually been baptized in the Christian church, as an adult and by my own choice, she thought my kids could not inherit Judaism from me. (This is not the Orthodox opinion, by the way, but Reform and most Conservatives think this.) I underwent a mikvah (a ritual bath,) and so did the boys, to "erase" the Christianity, and enrolled them in Hebrew school. My husband began singing in the synagogue choir, and the boys stayed in Hebrew school until their bar mitzvahs. At first, I enjoyed learning about Judaism, and liked going to services, and felt close to God. But over the years, that has faded away as well, and I have been more and more drawn to atheists' testimony (I love Julia Sweeney, Kurt Vonnegut, Carl Sagan.) I began feeling intensely uncomfortable saying the prayers at services, because I really didn't believe in God at all anymore. I started saying to people, "I don't really believe in God, but I think He forgives me for that!" with a smile. Now I'm brave enough to admit to anyone that I don't believe in God anymore, and I really don't. I feel very liberated. I'm reading all kinds of books by non-believers, and feel great resonance with them. My husband is still a Christian, but is so liberal-minded and intelligent that he is not at all threatened by my non-belief. My younger son (now 14) still believes in God, and I don't try to disabuse him of it. My older son (age 19) is not very religious. But they think of themselves as Jewish, as do I. With me, it's just an ethnic identity, membership in a tribe, a family. Today we interred my mom's ashes in a niche in a beautiful cremation garden. My sister, my husband, my two boys, and I said the mourner's kaddish, reading from the English and the transliterated Hebrew, but it was merely speaking pretty words on my part. I am at peace with not believing any longer, and I look forward to learning more about science, the Universe, ethics, and morality without the God delusion's filter. I know this has been a really long post, but I'm just so happy I've found this forum, and I had a lot to get off my chest. Thank you for reading, if you've made it all the way through. I look forward to getting to know you all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OpheliaGinger Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 There is a sect of Christianity that combines Judaism and Christianity--Messianic Judaism. That was what I was before I finally deconverted. Interesting read. I practically rolled my eyes when I read that your mother-in-law didn't know what the Passover was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ Fuego ♦ Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Welcome! It is good to hear that you were able to break away with out too much difficulty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Davka Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Shalom aleikh, artislife, and welcome to the forum. I'm glad you were able to say the kaddish for your mom - I think there's a place for tradition, even if it's just pretty words. I feel connected to 3,000 years of history when we say kiddush over the candles, wine and bread every shabbat. I don't think there's a god listening, but it's a nice feeling anyways. Many wise people struggled hard to understand, that's what it means to me. Our youngest daughter (also 14) still believes in god as well. It's her choice, we don't try to convince her otherwise. Our two older daughters no longer believe, but all three see themselves as Jewish, even though I'm a Gentile - their Israeli mother is more than enough to counter-balance this assimilated goy. So sit, stay a while, have some bacon-cheeseburgers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 There is a sect of Christianity that combines Judaism and Christianity--Messianic Judaism. That was what I was before I finally deconverted. Interesting read. I practically rolled my eyes when I read that your mother-in-law didn't know what the Passover was. I know all about Messianic Judaism. Ugh! It's not Judaism at all, it's Christianity. My sister succumbed to that one, and I has messed her up for most of her life. She's still not out of the delusion yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Shalom aleikh, artislife, and welcome to the forum. I'm glad you were able to say the kaddish for your mom - I think there's a place for tradition, even if it's just pretty words. I feel connected to 3,000 years of history when we say kiddush over the candles, wine and bread every shabbat. I don't think there's a god listening, but it's a nice feeling anyways. Many wise people struggled hard to understand, that's what it means to me. Our youngest daughter (also 14) still believes in god as well. It's her choice, we don't try to convince her otherwise. Our two older daughters no longer believe, but all three see themselves as Jewish, even though I'm a Gentile - their Israeli mother is more than enough to counter-balance this assimilated goy. So sit, stay a while, have some bacon-cheeseburgers. LOL! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShallowByThyGame Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Hey, welcome to the forum! I live in Fairfax, though only for the last 3 years. There are many skeptical groups here, like Beltway Atheists, if you are interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 Hey, welcome to the forum! I live in Fairfax, though only for the last 3 years. There are many skeptical groups here, like Beltway Atheists, if you are interested. Beltway Atheists... sounds interesting. I'll look them up. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HRDWarrior Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 Hello and welcome, I enjoyed reading your testimony, I think it's great that you can stay connected to your heritage that way! That's not a Bengal on your shoulder there, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtbagDan Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 Shalom. I was born and raised Messianic Jewish by a nutcase father, who was also a synagogue cantor. Good to see there are others like us here, and I thought I was one of the only ones here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitchu Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Welcome to the forums, artislife. As an ex-Christian atheist married 22 years to a Sabbath-observant Jew, I know it's possible for people of seemingly quite divergent views to not only co-exist but to do so happily and with love. The "seemingly" part has to do with adherence to certain traditions, beliefs and practices. The "happily and with love" part has to do with having arrived at the same ethical viewpoint, the same sense of what's worthwhile and what's mandatory in living a full and good life. I hope you find this site a companionable place to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Hello and welcome, I enjoyed reading your testimony, I think it's great that you can stay connected to your heritage that way! That's not a Bengal on your shoulder there, is it? No, just an ordinary tabby cat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Shalom. I was born and raised Messianic Jewish by a nutcase father, who was also a synagogue cantor. Good to see there are others like us here, and I thought I was one of the only ones here. funny story: when I became a born-again Christian and tried to witness to my dad, he yelled, "If you have to believe crap, why not believe OUR crap, why do you have to believe THEIR crap?" I really appreciate that now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest artislife Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Welcome to the forums, artislife. As an ex-Christian atheist married 22 years to a Sabbath-observant Jew, I know it's possible for people of seemingly quite divergent views to not only co-exist but to do so happily and with love. The "seemingly" part has to do with adherence to certain traditions, beliefs and practices. The "happily and with love" part has to do with having arrived at the same ethical viewpoint, the same sense of what's worthwhile and what's mandatory in living a full and good life. I hope you find this site a companionable place to be. Thank you very much, well said. I have so far found this site very pleasant and companionable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shyone Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 funny story: when I became a born-again Christian and tried to witness to my dad, he yelled, "If you have to believe crap, why not believe OUR crap, why do you have to believe THEIR crap?" I really appreciate that now. Priceless. Just priceless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenhunter Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 welcome, i like reading on traditions of other nationalities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtbagDan Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 funny story: when I became a born-again Christian and tried to witness to my dad, he yelled, "If you have to believe crap, why not believe OUR crap, why do you have to believe THEIR crap?" I really appreciate that now. Heh, excellent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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