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Goodbye Jesus

Current Discussion With Christians


John09

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I am currently involved in a discussion with some christians on another forum. I joined this bible forum when I was still a christian. I confessed to them that I had deconverted. As you can imagine, they began to argue with me over my new views.

 

If you have any comments or opinions, I would enjoy hearing them. Or, if you just want some entertainment, read the thread.

 

Here is the link:

http://bibleforums.org/forum/showthread.php?t=188215

 

Thanks,

 

John

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The same arguements over and over again..."you didn't have a real relationship"; "it can't be explained, must be taken on faith" blah, blah, blah. Just goes to show that they have to keep falling back to the same pat lines and never really do address the real questions like where evil came from if their god is so perfect and holy...

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You may find arguing cathartic for a while and that's good. Do it for YOU because your words and efforts are entirely wasted on them.

 

When you get tired of it, stop. Whatever reasons you left the faith for are good reasons because they're important to you. You don't need to justify nor prove them to anyone else.

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The same arguements over and over again..."you didn't have a real relationship"; "it can't be explained, must be taken on faith" blah, blah, blah. Just goes to show that they have to keep falling back to the same pat lines and never really do address the real questions like where evil came from if their god is so perfect and holy...

I'm glad someone else sees this and not just me. Thanks.

 

 

You may find arguing cathartic for a while and that's good. Do it for YOU because your words and efforts are entirely wasted on them.

 

When you get tired of it, stop. Whatever reasons you left the faith for are good reasons because they're important to you. You don't need to justify nor prove them to anyone else.

 

Actually, I originally made the first post in response to someone on another thread. Then a moderator moved it and made it a new thread.

 

I really don't mind telling them why I left christianity. It's just that now, I keep hearing the same, stupid arguments over and over. I'm thinking you are right about my words being wasted on them. But, perhaps not. My own reading of reasons others had for rejecting christianity helped reawaken my own questions and doubts.

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I love the lengths to which they all go to find every possible excuse as to why you really weren't a Xian to begin with. They seem desperate and judgmental to me. Pity none of them have the grace to simply wish you well.

 

Interesting to watch the faithful turn on one of their own when s/he goes apostate, ain't it.

 

Good on you for holding your own. I hope you find greener pastures in your apostasy. Welcome to Ex-C, btw.

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I love the lengths to which they all go to find every possible excuse as to why you really weren't a Xian to begin with. They seem desperate and judgmental to me. Pity none of them have the grace to simply wish you well.

 

Interesting to watch the faithful turn on one of their own when s/he goes apostate, ain't it.

 

Good on you for holding your own. I hope you find greener pastures in your apostasy. Welcome to Ex-C, btw.

 

 

That is something I just can't grasp, other than the fact that they are soooo afraid of losing their own faith, that admitting that a "true" christian could lose their's would make it possible for them to also lose it.

 

Funny thing is, once it's gone, you really don't miss it!

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Funny thing is, once it's gone, you really don't miss it!

 

AMEN! ;)

 

------------------

 

I deal with a lot of the same; in fact, I get it from gay Christians too. (There's nothing funnier than listening to a lesbian preach to me about how much she loves Jesus, particularly when her words speak of bridegrooms and being in his arms... "Um, isn't Jesus a man?" I ask. "Aren't I the one who is supposed to love men...?" They don't like that!)

 

One thing that has helped me is the small number of non-judgmental Christians I have found: They tend to agree with me on most things and are usually very open to science and not being programmed by rote ideas. I admit that I sometimes wonder why they still believe, but it is good to have people who are not atheists agree with many of my ideas.l

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I love the lengths to which they all go to find every possible excuse as to why you really weren't a Xian to begin with. They seem desperate and judgmental to me. Pity none of them have the grace to simply wish you well.

 

Interesting to watch the faithful turn on one of their own when s/he goes apostate, ain't it.

 

Good on you for holding your own. I hope you find greener pastures in your apostasy. Welcome to Ex-C, btw.

 

They were like pack of wolves. What really did surprise me was the fact that so many of them made huge assumptions about who I was and who I am. I guess they felt they had some paranormal knowledge I had not given them.

 

Thank you for the welcome.

 

 

 

 

 

That is something I just can't grasp, other than the fact that they are soooo afraid of losing their own faith, that admitting that a "true" christian could lose their's would make it possible for them to also lose it.

 

Funny thing is, once it's gone, you really don't miss it!

 

Fear of losing your faith is a huge source of torment for many christians. I have to be honest and say I miss it about as much as I miss diarrhea.

 

 

 

One thing that has helped me is the small number of non-judgmental Christians I have found: They tend to agree with me on most things and are usually very open to science and not being programmed by rote ideas. I admit that I sometimes wonder why they still believe, but it is good to have people who are not atheists agree with many of my ideas.l

 

I am certainly not opposed to having christian friends now. In fact, my closest friend is still a christian and he is not threatened by my deconversion. I can't say that for many others, though.

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I went and read through enough of it to get nauseated. I admire your even tone with them. I think that as you spend more time here, you'll eventually see many reiterations of every sad little gimmick they pulled out for you there, as well as a good number of others. You got a face full of what I think is the very most common one, "You were never a true Christian."

 

Frankly, I've never understood why this site doesn't have a running betting pool going in some pinned thread.

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I went and read through enough of it to get nauseated. I admire your even tone with them. I think that as you spend more time here, you'll eventually see many reiterations of every sad little gimmick they pulled out for you there, as well as a good number of others. You got a face full of what I think is the very most common one, "You were never a true Christian."

 

Frankly, I've never understood why this site doesn't have a running betting pool going in some pinned thread.

 

Well, I finally got fed up with the discussion. I was getting angry at them, so I quit the thread. Since I received a few warnings from moderators because I was proving the bible wrong, I'll probably get kicked off the site. lol

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Well, I finally got fed up with the discussion. I was getting angry at them, so I quit the thread. Since I received a few warnings from moderators because I was proving the bible wrong, I'll probably get kicked off the site. lol

 

 

Was that seriously the reason they gave? If so, that's just downright hilarious!

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Well, I finally got fed up with the discussion. I was getting angry at them, so I quit the thread. Since I received a few warnings from moderators because I was proving the bible wrong, I'll probably get kicked off the site. lol

 

 

Was that seriously the reason they gave? If so, that's just downright hilarious!

 

Well, you are not permitted to directly criticize the bible or attack christianity or god. I was listing scriptures and explaining why they were wrong. I also attacked god's morality. The rules are a little strict there.

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That is something I just can't grasp, other than the fact that they are soooo afraid of losing their own faith, that admitting that a "true" christian could lose their's would make it possible for them to also lose it.

 

People are different, and some probably do have such fears. Others, though, such as I was when I was a Christian, believe that the Holy Spirit really irreversibly changes people, and therefore one who turns away never really had the Holy Spirit. As such, I used to accuse those who left the faith of having never really been true believers, but I didn't fear losing my faith in least, because I didn't believe it could happen. I was just expressing what I perceived to be reality. Having later left the faith myself, of course, I have to admit to being ashamed of the false accusations I previously made, but at the time I did make them in good faith.

 

Funny thing is, once it's gone, you really don't miss it!

 

AMEN!

 

In fact, I'll raise you one. Not only do I not miss my past faith, I now find such blind faith to be utterly despicable.

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That is something I just can't grasp, other than the fact that they are soooo afraid of losing their own faith, that admitting that a "true" christian could lose their's would make it possible for them to also lose it.

 

People are different, and some probably do have such fears. Others, though, such as I was when I was a Christian, believe that the Holy Spirit really irreversibly changes people, and therefore one who turns away never really had the Holy Spirit. As such, I used to accuse those who left the faith of having never really been true believers, but I didn't fear losing my faith in least, because I didn't believe it could happen. I was just expressing what I perceived to be reality. Having later left the faith myself, of course, I have to admit to being ashamed of the false accusations I previously made, but at the time I did make them in good faith.

 

Yup, I felt the same way when I was a christian - heck, I would have never thought I could lose my faith, but looking back, it was crumbling since the day I was "saved." I just kept forcing myself to believe it for waaay to long.

Funny thing is, once it's gone, you really don't miss it!

 

AMEN!

 

In fact, I'll raise you one. Not only do I not miss my past faith, I now find such blind faith to be utterly despicable.

 

Yes, definitely!

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Sometimes it's not a good idea to keep arguing with people who are disturbed, both in and outside of their faith.

 

 

I made the mistake of getting into a big debate with a fundie last week. He was an idiot. I kept telling myself, "this is a mistake, Franko, the guy's a typical Christian lunatic" but I just found it fascinating at the time, like as if I could somehow get this freak to think about things at all on a rational level. The discussion proved fruitless in the end, since no matter how convincing some of my points were, "they're all really clever devices of Satan".... and although we parted company on "no hard feelings" grounds, I went away from that feeling a little frustrated, a little silly, and a little depressed. Not for long, but still....

 

Sometimes it's unhealthy to rehash stuff you've left behind with the freaks that are still there. Sometimes it's fun, but sometimes it can be a drag. Just my opinion from a psycho-logical standpoint.

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Sometimes it's not a good idea to keep arguing with people who are disturbed, both in and outside of their faith.

 

Proverbs 23:9

"Speak not in the ears of a fool: for he will despise the wisdom of thy words."

 

Well, at least the Bible isn't all wrong. ;)

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