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Goodbye Jesus

Family Smack Down On Facebook


Vigile

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This is too funny. My cousin Greg is a smart and educated guy, but he is also a fundy, which annuls a large number of his brain cells. His brother, my cousin Cec is a very smart guy, I don't know if he is an atheist, but he is essentially very analytical.

 

So, rather than explain more, I'll just let you guys read how things transpired as the three of us had a little discussion on FB:

 

Cec:

With all studies you really have to know the details of the study, otherwise it's all anecdotal.

Tue at 7:32pm

 

 

Me I agree Cec. Anecdotal evidence is unreliable. Here's a study based on statistical analysis: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/08/060810-evolution.html

 

From the link: "In the U.S., only 14 percent of adults thought that evolution was "definitely true," while about a third firmly rejected the idea.

 

In European countries, including Denmark, Sweden, and France, more than 80 percent of adults surveyed said they accepted the concept of evolution. "

Yesterday at 11:27am · Delete

 

 

Me The only country included in the study where adults were more likely than Americans to reject evolution was Turkey.

Yesterday at 11:42am · Delete

 

 

Greg Europe believes in an unproven scientific theory while abandoning their religious beliefs.....so what else is new?

Yesterday at 11:50am

 

 

Me Surely you are not serious? Cosi e' la vita *shrug*

Yesterday at 11:55am · Delete

 

Cec: Even scarier is the number of people who believe in ghosts, psychics, and all kinds of medical quackery. Some of the later can be deadly. Even worse for me is insurance plans cover some of the quack treatments which means I pay for something that doesn't work and would never use.

9 hours ago

 

 

Cec: Unproven Theory? Time to refresh your memory of theories. They don't get proven. They get tested to see if the theory's predictions are true (and repeatedly tested) If it can't be tested and measured its not a theory. New discoveries can strengthen a theory or kill it. A theory does not have to be 100% complete to be immensely valuable. Atoms ... Read Moreand particles are quite useful to know about even if all the subatomic physics are cloudy. There's a lot of dead theories in that field of study.

 

The theory of evolution went from weak to strong with the discovery of DNA since that allowed more revealing and confirming tests. The current theory of evolution is quite helpful. If evolution doesn't exist why do we have to make a different flu vaccine every year?

 

Since the existence of God or some intelligent designer can't be tested, it can't be part of a theory. The theory we have can be tested, it predicts, we can use to it make things and solve problems.

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"If evolution doesn't exist why do we have to make a different flu vaccine every year?" I'm gonna use that.

:goodpost:

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If evolution doesn't exist why do we have to make a different flu vaccine every year?

 

Obviously it's because when man fell from grace, Adam and Eve brought sin and suffering into the world. The Lord has to allow evil to exist to give us free will because he doesn't want robots to worship him. All will be right again when Christ returns, but if you don't believe, you will be cast into the fires of hell. So, come join my Ponzi scheme, er church!
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If evolution doesn't exist why do we have to make a different flu vaccine every year?

 

Obviously it's because when man fell from grace, Adam and Eve brought sin and suffering into the world. The Lord has to allow evil to exist to give us free will because he doesn't want robots to worship him. All will be right again when Christ returns, but if you don't believe, you will be cast into the fires of hell. So, come join my Ponzi scheme, er church!

 

That's funny 'cause it's true - that they would respond that way, I mean. Either that, or you get the "We believe in micro-evolution - that small adapatations occur within a species for a given environment, but we don't believe in macro-evolution - that species change." They think that sounds intelligent and gives them a way to live with the obvious, but shows no real knowledge of modern biological evolutionary science.

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Yup, he responded with the macro/micro argument. Not to mention the explanation Cec gave him of a theory flew right on past him:

 

Greg

Cece, my thought in all of this is evolution (along the lines of the origin of man) is still a theory but to many it is a fact and has its own devout, and in many cases rabid, followers. Followers, in my observation and opinion, that ridicule anyone who questions or doesn't believe their evolutionary dogma. Furthermore, evolution is being used by... Read More non-Christians to refute the existence of God. That bothers me.

 

I see how adaptation works on a micro scale like the flu, or why animals adapt in their environment to changes, I don't see how it works on a macro scale.

 

All in all it's a great debate. Maybe one I should spend some more time looking into so I don't sound like a close minded eeediot when defending my opinion.

 

Cec responded:

 

almost all scientists accept evolution and many of them believe in a god so it's possible to do both.

 

Proselytizing atheists use the same tactics as some Christians use to convert people which is really ironic. Both are as annoying a band of Hare Krishnas at the airport.

 

it's impossible to prove God exists. It's impossible to prove he doesn't exist.

 

He makes a good point about being annoying. Most don't want to be evangelized by the atheists either.

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But I don't know why Christians think all atheists are using evolution to disprove God. They might use it to disprove certain gods but I don't know any atheist who's ever said that evolution has disproved all gods. Even the Four Horsemen don't ever use this argument and Dawkins has specifically said that the theory of evolution is different than about the origins of the universe. He only uses the theory of evolution to disprove certain arguments in favor of God like the argument from design to point out that evolution is proof that complexity can evolve from simplicity without being created yet he doesn't say that in itself disproves God. I just wish Christians would point to a single example of an atheist that's ever seriously used this argument.

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But I don't know why Christians think all atheists are using evolution to disprove God. They might use it to disprove certain gods but I don't know any atheist who's ever said that evolution has disproved all gods. Even the Four Horsemen don't ever use this argument and Dawkins has specifically said that the theory of evolution is different than about the origins of the universe. He only uses the theory of evolution to disprove certain arguments in favor of God like the argument from design to point out that evolution is proof that complexity can evolve from simplicity without being created yet he doesn't say that in itself disproves God. I just wish Christians would point to a single example of an atheist that's ever seriously used this argument.

Well, when you start to put the pieces together, it does effectively refute a number of theological concepts, or at least make them seem silly. Which species got the first soul? Which species committed original sin? etc.

 

I also read this by a well known proponent of Intelligent design:

 

"To talk of a purposeful or guided evolution is not to talk about evolution at all. That is slow creation. When you understand it that way, you realize that the Darwinian theory of evolution contradicts not just the Book of Genesis, but every word in the Bible from beginning to end. It contradicts the idea that we are here because a creator brought about our existence for a purpose. That is the first thing I realized, and it carries tremendous meaning."
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