First Contact

[Overcame Faith]

But I do believe there is good, solid evidence that there are UFOs seen here on Earth which are not necessarily from outer space or piloted by alien beings (though that could be the case) and which defy our known physics and are beyond what we know to be our technological abilities which were probably manufactured by intelligent beings from somewhere. Who are the intelligent beings who made them? Who knows.

 

I disagree with you on this part. All these so called UFO's are, in reality, Misidentified Flying Objects (MFO's), like the "L.A. missile launch". All are quite ordinary things that get misidentified and for some reason (probably just human nature) people immediately jump to the extraordinary conclusions.

 

How do I know that UFO's aren't real aliens;

 

I see only two reasons for an alien race to come to Earth. One is to study us for scientific reasons/exploration and the second is to make first contact. Of the two the first is orders of magnitude more likely. If a race is here to study us then it would make sense for them to not interfere with our societies which would necessitate that they remain undetected to us. Any civilization that can cross the vastness of space would easily have the capability to do this. Hell, for all we know they can make their probes/ships out of "dark matter", or mirror its properties, that is completely invisible to all forms of EM and can pass though solid objects at will. They wouldn't be flying around for all to see and letting people take pictures of them with their cellphones.

 

If they wanted to make first contact then they would broadcast some sort of signal from a distance that would be obvious to everyone to anounce their arrival then land on the White House lawn for all to see.

 

I understand what you're saying. My statement that some UFOs were manufactured by intelligent beings includes the possibility (maybe probability) that those intelligent beings were humans and not aliens. If they were manufactured by humans, then someone has some highly advanced technology that needs to be disclosed to the public so we can harness it for the good of all humankind. I haven't seen sufficient evidence to buy into the intelligent alien hypothesis, though I leave that open as a "possibility" though less likely than the hypothesis that humans manufactured these craft. But I have seen sufficient evidence that convinces me that something is going on and that there are craft flying about which are highly advanced beyond what anyone in the know is disclosing to us.

[florduh]

The point is not that we are an important player in the universe, but rather that we are an emerging player.

I'm not inclined to think there are any "players" at all. The universe is unimaginably vast, and other life would be isolated as we are. There is probably no Federation of Planets for us to join once we are worthy. It's great science fiction stuff, though.

[Legion]

The universe is unimaginably vast, and other life would be isolated as we are.

Yes, it's vast. The nearest star to the sun is about 4 light-years away and there are apparently about 200 stars within a distance of 25 light-years. However we can't know what is or is not technologically possible with regard to traversing these distances.

 

Here's a cool animation showing the nearest 150 stars. The sun is in the middle...

 

[JadedAtheist]

Life probably exists elsewhere but there could be billions of civilizations out there at the same approximate technological level as us but we'll never know. If there is alien life out there advanced enough to come to Earth I fear for our safety. Whenever humans moved to new territory the did so to conquer it. I think we should shut off any attempts to contact alien life and live on the down low.

[Legion]

I think we should shut off any attempts to contact alien life and live on the down low.

It's too late for that I think. We've been transmitting radio for about 100 years. There are roughly 500 G type stars within 100 light-years.

[JadedAtheist]

True, but better end it now than to keep it going.

[Legion]

I voted that 2012 is when it gets weird.

 

Kosmic Kindergarten

 

Until then feast your ears on some Bassnectar...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNSogBHwEQg

[Deva]

I voted archeological evidence. If we can explore Mars one day where all that water used to be, maybe we will find something interesting. Also we may one day explore under the ice of Europa or under the atmosphere of Titan and find something interesting. I don't see little green men, or anything like that, coming to visit. I agree with JadedAtheist that it would also not necessarily be a good thing. After all, we are top of the food chain on this planet and due to technology do not have to worry constantly about any predators eating us. That may change if a life form advanced enough to get here happens to like the taste of us. We have no reason to believe they would be benevolent towards us. Yes, it could well be like the old Twilight Zone episode "To Serve Man."

[Galien]

Surely any self respecting alien would take one look at this planet, say WTF!!!???, slam her into reverse and head home.

[Legion]

I voted archeological evidence. If we can explore Mars one day where all that water used to be, maybe we will find something interesting. Also we may one day explore under the ice of Europa or under the atmosphere of Titan and find something interesting. I don't see little green men, or anything like that, coming to visit. I agree with JadedAtheist that it would also not necessarily be a good thing. After all, we are top of the food chain on this planet and due to technology do not have to worry constantly about any predators eating us. That may change if a life form advanced enough to get here happens to like the taste of us. We have no reason to believe they would be benevolent towards us. Yes, it could well be like the old Twilight Zone episode "To Serve Man."

Interesting choice Deva. So you think we might still find life or evidence of past life right here in our own solar system. That would be dope.

 

I doubt that an extremely advanced species would have an interest in us as a food source. We'll make great pets.

 

Surely any self respecting alien would take one look at this planet, say WTF!!!???, slam her into reverse and head home.

Why? Surely they will have their ever curious researchers amongst them. Does anyone doubt that if we found even some repugnant little organism on another world that our scientists would jump at the opportunity to study every facet of its behavior?

[skepticalme]

But I do believe there is good, solid evidence that there are UFOs seen here on Earth which are not necessarily from outer space or piloted by alien beings (though that could be the case) and which defy our known physics and are beyond what we know to be our technological abilities which were probably manufactured by intelligent beings from somewhere. Who are the intelligent beings who made them? Who knows.

 

I disagree with you on this part. All these so called UFO's are, in reality, Misidentified Flying Objects (MFO's), like the "L.A. missile launch". All are quite ordinary things that get misidentified and for some reason (probably just human nature) people immediately jump to the extraordinary conclusions.

 

How do I know that UFO's aren't real aliens;

 

I see only two reasons for an alien race to come to Earth. One is to study us for scientific reasons/exploration and the second is to make first contact. Of the two the first is orders of magnitude more likely. If a race is here to study us then it would make sense for them to not interfere with our societies which would necessitate that they remain undetected to us. Any civilization that can cross the vastness of space would easily have the capability to do this. Hell, for all we know they can make their probes/ships out of "dark matter", or mirror its properties, that is completely invisible to all forms of EM and can pass though solid objects at will. They wouldn't be flying around for all to see and letting people take pictures of them with their cellphones.

 

If they wanted to make first contact then they would broadcast some sort of signal from a distance that would be obvious to everyone to anounce their arrival then land on the White House lawn for all to see.

 

I understand what you're saying. My statement that some UFOs were manufactured by intelligent beings includes the possibility (maybe probability) that those intelligent beings were humans and not aliens. If they were manufactured by humans, then someone has some highly advanced technology that needs to be disclosed to the public so we can harness it for the good of all humankind. I haven't seen sufficient evidence to buy into the intelligent alien hypothesis, though I leave that open as a "possibility" though less likely than the hypothesis that humans manufactured these craft. But I have seen sufficient evidence that convinces me that something is going on and that there are craft flying about which are highly advanced beyond what anyone in the know is disclosing to us.

 

While I have no doubt that the military has advanced tech we haven'y seen yet, we don't have anything near what you are thinking of. I'm assuming that you are refering to man-made flying saucer type craft that travel at insanely high speeds, hover silently and make instant direction changes, etc. I can assure you we don't have anything like that (maybe in a few hundred years). Even if such craft were technologically possible they would be impossible to keep secret due to the shear scale of the program. You would be dealing with an R&D/manufacturing program that would dwarf both the Manhattan Project and the Apollo program. Both of those programs used known science and were decades ahead of thier time and cost a significant percentage of the GDP. Lets say that these imaginary craft run on anti-matter. It would require multiple LHC's running 24/7 in complete secrecy for decades, costing trillions of dollars, to manufacture enough fuel for one craft. And again that is using known science. In reality you are talking about a program that would be exploiting fields of science that aren't even known yet. Not only would these people have licked quantum mechanics in complete secrecy they would also have licked whatever is beyond quantum mechanics as well and the rest of us don't even know what that is yet. This is the same kind of logic that moon landing conspiracy theorist follow. The shear magnitude of what is proposed when fully thought out exceeds the techological capacity of the entire nation, all in complete secrecy.

 

Even if we had such craft, why? To counter equally advanced craft from other nations? If WW3 broke out it would be orders of magnitude cheaper just to churn out F-22's, Stealth bombers, ABL's and predator drones in bulk. Seriously, the government has drastically cut back on these programs because they were to expensive. Also, if we had such craft the best application for them would be to parade them around as the flagship of the USAF. Demonstrate it at every airshow in full view to the rest of the world and say, "This is what the USA can do, don't F with us!" It would be much more useful as a deterent flaunted to everyone, than an actual weapons system. We already do this with the once classified stealth programs. Not much of a deterent unless you make sure everyone knows what you can do.

 

Apply Occam's razor. Its far more likely that "UFO's" are:

-conventional/slightly more advanced aircraft that are misidentified

-not craft at all, but relatively mundane things misidentified

 

If I hear a story about fighter planes being scrambled to intercept a "UFO" picked up on radar, I think it a far more likely explaination that someone screwed up and sent planes after a flock of birds. Once those disappeared off the screen they saw some other random blip on the opposite side of the screen and concluded that it must be the same object that moved a hundred miles between radar sweeps. Heck, I find it far more likely that someone was testing out a new radar jammer that gives false positives so that planes chase phantoms. The scenarios you could come up with are nearly infinite, but somehow people conclude and fixate on the most fanciful.

[Galien]

How do you know there isn't other intelligent life in our solar system, as in intelligent enough to stay the fuck away from us?

 

Is it just me or I am I the only one who happens to think we suck in every way it is possible to suck?

[SilentLoner]

Reminds me of the Star Trek TNG episode "First Contact." Good ep.

 

As for this topic, I have no idea. I agree avoiding detection might be the best plan.

[SilentLoner]

 

http://www.ceveni.com/2008/03/radioactive-skeletons-found-in-ancient.html

 

Radio Active ruins in ancient India more than 10,000 years old, including human skeletons lying about...kind of like the bodies of the Vesuvius eruption except the skeletons are fused into the surrounding rock and the ground there appears to have been fused into glass in the immediate area. WEIRD...

 

I've heard about that. Sounds crazy but its fascinating. What could have caused it?

[OpheliaGinger]

 

http://www.ceveni.com/2008/03/radioactive-skeletons-found-in-ancient.html

 

Radio Active ruins in ancient India more than 10,000 years old, including human skeletons lying about...kind of like the bodies of the Vesuvius eruption except the skeletons are fused into the surrounding rock and the ground there appears to have been fused into glass in the immediate area. WEIRD...

 

I've heard about that. Sounds crazy but its fascinating. What could have caused it?

 

An impacting asteroid or comet can cause the same effects.

[Legion]

[Ouroboros]

Read at the bottom of the article. Source: beforeus.com.

 

Beforeus.com, run by Jonathan Gray, an archeologist with the strangest claims: http://beforeus.com/

 

I think it's wise to take his claims with a grain of salt. If I remember right, he's one of the "finders" of Noah's ark.

 

--edit--

 

I did a little research on Jonathan Gray, and several of his claims have been proven to be hoaxes. For instance, he reported about a find of a giant skeleton and his source was a website which is like Landover Baptists, a joke site, where they publish hoaxes intentionally for the lulz. He fell for it and reported it as true. That's just one of several stories about his reports...