Church Is Creepy.

[monsterfeets]

When I de-converted from Christianity proper, I still had a lot of very close friends in a church I attended regularly. So I went on occasion. But as time went by, I found it progressively more difficult to attend the 'worship' parts of church because it down right creeped me out. I wrote this off as it being too soon, as me being in a transitional state that required healing before I could face something like that again because of bad experiences.

 

But it has been years and still if I go by a worship center or attend anything that involves the act of talking about how we need to be forgiven, I get the heebie jeebies.

 

To me it feels like not only are they not worshiping a loving god, but that church itself, and especially the new wave of youth oriented churches are all like a giant abusive orgy.

 

I remember worship being a process. First you stand around and talk about how much you are screwing everything up in your life, and then you ask forgiveness, plead for it, prostrate yourself at the feet of an image of a suffering god so that he will accept you, and then you get that rush of emotion. Wash, rinse, repeat next week.

 

I want to ask them. Why do you keep hurting yourself. Do you think it makes him happy? What kind of God is this?

 

It is spiritually reprehensible to me, that people can do this. This is obviously the reason that even so many years later, I get physically ill when I enter a worship service.

To me, Christianity could be a beautiful religion. But people are too happy abusing themselves and others to become truly happy and allow themselves to be loved by god or anyone else without doing huge impossible mental gymnastics because they think they are worthless.

 

Maybe this is just an American thing or something. When I went to New Zealand I spelunked with an Anglican minister who was one of the most awesome, most genuinely happy persons I've ever met.

 

Oh and for the record I adore creepy things. But Church is the wrong sort of creepy :'(

[Puddinhead]

I agree, it is creepy. And one of the oddest things for me is, they can't see these bits of self-abuse. If it were any other topic, other than god, and people went around talking about how horrible they were and how they deserved punishment, you'd insist they get counselling. At church tho, perfectly fine. My mom died earlier this month. At her funeral, the songs mentioned hell, the "wrath of god" and fear. I found this disturbing to the point of being cruel. How could this possibly comfort grieving people? Nobody else batted an eye. They are somehow immune to it.

[BrotherJosh]

It's creepy because they are forced to transition between I am a filthy sinner and I am chosen by gawd and am very special. This contradiction makes most xtians lack confidence since they are constantly worried about a celestial being who at the same time loathes yet adores them. Imagine being in a real relationship with someone like that! They'd be unpredictable, which the biblical god is. Aside from that, the emotional manipulation and churchy facade is just downright disgusting.

[Deva]

Yes, the older I get, the more creepy I think church is. It hit me with full force about 8 years ago during a Christmas service of "Lessons and Carols" the juxtiposition of the prayers with the light hearted music (for the most part) really struck me the wrong way. I don't think I have been back for a service since. I told my Christian friend I did not care for the prayers and she got really upset with me. Almost lost that friendship that evening. Many of the old Christimas carols I used to like I do not anymore because of the message.

 

All this "I'm a rotten sinner and deserve hell" stuff is simply WRONG. If you have been raised in it from childhood you don't even see that.

[XcaliburGirl]

+1 to all the above posts.

 

The strange thing is how to reconcile the fact that we are supposedly fallen beings lower than worms, yet we are a glorious creation that shows a perfect design. Huh? On one hand you have to "die to self", on the other, Christianity supposedly brings joy. You can't be joyful when you are overcome by guilt and thinking everything bad in your life is a test or punishment. I took it very seriously and it drove me into a depression. It took a while after I lost my faith for me to learn how to like myself again.

 

I always thought congregational responses/readings were creepy, it sounded like the Borg from Star Trek. Now, it's definitely the self-mortification.

 

That's how it persists, though. If you believe you are weak and unworthy, you become enslaved by a myth that makes you feel protected and forgiven, but that myth also drills into you that you are weak and unworthy, pushing you deeper in. The more you believe it, the more you need it. A song I used to like goes, "Hold me Jesus, I'm shaking like a leaf", but I was shaking inside only because my religion said I was powerless and depraved just because I was human.

[JadedAtheist]

I don't find it creepy but I do find it weird. You have a whole bunch of sinful people half-heartedly singing about how rotten they are but how awesome God is, and this is meant to glorify God? After people have passed that they then switch off to the sermon that's about to start. The sermon in a nutshell is "Stop doing wrong and start doing right". The pastor's responsibility is to find a different way to say that every Sunday.

[Guest Babylonian Dream]

I find it creepy, weird, and part of what disturbs me is the similarities between worshipping God and what goes on in North Korea, with the worship of Kim Jon Il and Kim Il Song.

[OpheliaGinger]

It's left over brain washing tactics that church leaders liked because it keeps the people coming back.

[oddbird1963]

The description of that worship service reminds me of Charles Finney's creation of the "anxious seats" during the second great awakening . He is considered the father of modern American revivalism.

 

I think the original intent was to provide a format where people who were anxious about their sinful condition could publicly renounce their sinful lives and publicly confess Jesus as their savior.

 

It's like today's churches create a situation where the participants are so addicted and dependent on the euphoria of forgiveness that they have to recapitulate and symbolically repeat the pattern of guilt, repentance and forgiveness over and over and over. And , as with drugs, it takes more guilt and browbeating to elicit the same level of euphoria and release.

 

Of course the ultimate desire, I think, is to feel a connection with the divine. But I think these churches breed a vaporously weak form of spirituality that does not engender other avenues of connecting to that divine.

 

I'm not saying there is a divine being with which to connect. But of the spiritual disciplines available within the Christian traditions, many evangelical churches seem to keep their followers stuck in the most immature and gratuitous level of practice.

[Eemaan]

Sad... Is it a sin just because you are human in Christianity?

[Vomit Comet]

Sad... Is it a sin just because you are human in Christianity?

 

Don't act like your shitty religion doesn't headfuck those who take it seriously.

[JadedAtheist]

Sad... Is it a sin just because you are human in Christianity?

 

lol, considering you are thought of as a sub-human in Islam I am surprised you even commented.

[Eemaan]

I realize the way i had constructed my question is poor and also might hurt Christians, I apologize for asking in that way. I mean how can it be a sin to be human?? What I had read was that in Christianity that Jesus carries the sins of everybody. What I want to ask is are humans born sinful in Christianity?

 

In Islam, a human can be lower than an animal but also he can be higher than the angels in status. This depends on his deeds and righteousness, so if he would choose a life of sins and destructiveness then he can be lower than animals, otherwise if he would lead a righteous life he can be higher than the angels.

 

Status of Human Beings in Islam

Prime Creation: Human being is the prime creation of God. He says, "We have indeed honored the children of Adam; spread them in the land and the sea, provided them with good things; and preferred them in esteem over many things that We have created." (Qur'an: chp. 17, verse 70)

 

Born Sinless: Islam teaches that every human being is born sinless; no child carries the burden of his or her ancestors' sins. God says, "No carrier shall carry the burden of others." (Qur'an; chp. 35, verse 18). Each human being is born with a pure conscience which can absorb and accept the true message of God. It is only the social and familial influences which take a person away from God's message.

 

Accountability: Islam also emphasizes on the issue of responsibility and accountability of human beings--each person is responsible for his or her own actions. Although Islam teaches that God has predetermined the span of our life and the time of our death, it does not mean that even our actions are predetermined by Him. We surely are free in our actions and are, therefore, accountable for them. God only provides guidance for us to know what is good and what is bad. He says, "We created man of a water-drop...Surely We guided him to the right way--now whether he (follows it and) be grateful or (goes astray and) be ungrateful is up to him." (Qur'an: chp. 76, verse 3).

 

http://www.al-islam.org/begin/intro/rizvi.html#4

 

ohhh why can't i post in some of the sections?

[Freedom from Guilt]

I don't find it creepy but I do find it weird. You have a whole bunch of sinful people half-heartedly singing about how rotten they are but how awesome God is, and this is meant to glorify God? After people have passed that they then switch off to the sermon that's about to start. The sermon in a nutshell is "Stop doing wrong and start doing right". The pastor's responsibility is to find a different way to say that every Sunday.

 

 

I'm not doing enough, I'm not doing it right and I'm not taking "it" seriously. This is my summation of sermons!!!

 

 

At the last church I attended, the music minister was the WORST about all the self-loathing. He was constantly berating the congregation for not loving God, worshipping God, giving their all to God. It took me a LONG time to realize that he was wallowing in self-loathing. Between him and the pastor, I felt completely beaten up EVERY week.

[par4dcourse]

, so if he would choose a life of sins and destructiveness then he can be lower than animals, otherwise if he would lead a righteous life he can be higher than the angels.

 

ohhh why can't i post in some of the sections?

 

... and the cow jumped over the moon. Just repeating the mantra "we are nothing without god". Fuck that. Look around you. Listen to the telly if your handlers will allow. Do you sincerely think anyone is in control?

 

As for your question: The board wisely forbids religious drivel in some sections.

 

 

 

[OpheliaGinger]

Sad... Is it a sin just because you are human in Christianity?

 

Simply put, if you are human being and breathing, you are sinning.

[Vomit Comet]

Simply put, if you are human being and breathing, you are sinning.

 

Don't retarded people get a pass?

[LFAuthenticity]

Simply put, if you are human being and breathing, you are sinning.

 

Don't retarded people get a pass?

 

Didn't the physically and mentally challenged get exorcised? or burned? I remember reading somewhere that they got blamed for their condition as it being "god's will" that they suffer...

[OpheliaGinger]

Simply put, if you are human being and breathing, you are sinning.

 

Don't retarded people get a pass?

 

Didn't the physically and mentally challenged get exorcised? or burned? I remember reading somewhere that they got blamed for their condition as it being "god's will" that they suffer...

 

Anybody who was mentally or physically challenged was barred from entering the temple in the old testament.

[Guest Babylonian Dream]

Anybody who was mentally or physically challenged was barred from entering the temple in the old testament.

That's not necessarily true. The prophets were allowed in the temple.

[OpheliaGinger]

Anybody who was mentally or physically challenged was barred from entering the temple in the old testament.

That's not necessarily true. The prophets were allowed in the temple.

 

Ok, I stand corrected.

[DayLight]

When I de-converted from Christianity proper, I still had a lot of very close friends in a church I attended regularly. So I went on occasion. But as time went by, I found it progressively more difficult to attend the 'worship' parts of church because it down right creeped me out. I wrote this off as it being too soon, as me being in a transitional state that required healing before I could face something like that again because of bad experiences.

 

But it has been years and still if I go by a worship center or attend anything that involves the act of talking about how we need to be forgiven, I get the heebie jeebies.

 

To me it feels like not only are they not worshiping a loving god, but that church itself, and especially the new wave of youth oriented churches are all like a giant abusive orgy.

 

I remember worship being a process. First you stand around and talk about how much you are screwing everything up in your life, and then you ask forgiveness, plead for it, prostrate yourself at the feet of an image of a suffering god so that he will accept you, and then you get that rush of emotion. Wash, rinse, repeat next week.

 

I want to ask them. Why do you keep hurting yourself. Do you think it makes him happy? What kind of God is this?

 

It is spiritually reprehensible to me, that people can do this. This is obviously the reason that even so many years later, I get physically ill when I enter a worship service.

To me, Christianity could be a beautiful religion. But people are too happy abusing themselves and others to become truly happy and allow themselves to be loved by god or anyone else without doing huge impossible mental gymnastics because they think they are worthless.

 

Maybe this is just an American thing or something. When I went to New Zealand I spelunked with an Anglican minister who was one of the most awesome, most genuinely happy persons I've ever met.

 

Oh and for the record I adore creepy things. But Church is the wrong sort of creepy :'(

 

I like the way he summarized it: "It's creepy because they are forced to transition between I am a filthy sinner and I am chosen by gawd and am very special. This contradiction makes most xtians lack confidence since they are constantly worried about a celestial being who at the same time loathes yet adores them."

 

God adores us and loathes us, an interesting combination.

 

I was just thinking of this issue yesterday. I was reading about a Christian who was saying: God, I am so unworthy...... And I just realized that Christians confuse "humility" before God with "feeling insecure about self and feeling worthless". There is a verse in the Bible: "Humble yourself before the Lord" and Christians assume it means: count yourself as a lowlife before the the Lord. But it's not true. They are just confused. They are just missing the point of their own Bible. To humble yourself means: while you feel valued and special, you need to submit under God's authority. A person who feels good about himself can humble himself (in other words, lower himself to God's authority). But it didn't mean that they have to count themselves worthless.... Too bad they misinterpreted this verse. Christianity could have been a little better without the "humiliate yourself before God" aspect.

 

The wrong understanding of things can sure make people miserable.