If Sin Nature Is Not Our Fault, And Like A Disease, How Do We Deserve Hell?

[Guest Valk0010]

I am going to write this out in a outline form. What I am going to say only applies to adam and eve's offspring assuming adam and eve existed.

 

1.Assuming Adam and Eve existed, before they ate the apple they were sinless.

 

2. Sin nature(the ability to sin) is something we can't control, we are born sinful.

 

3. Sin removed from life, its hated.

 

4. ill people sometimes do things they wouldn't do because they are ill.

 

Conclusion: If like a illness, since we can't control it and its passed on. Wouldn't only as far as giving us the ability to be like ill people and do things that we wouldn't do since we are ill, then the people who gave us the disease be responsible. Not us people who don't act of our own accord.

 

Put in a different way, what if a women got pregnant, and had a kid, but the women had aids and therefore the kid got aids. If this version of aids, makes us do things we can't control that are wrong. Are we then guilty of wrong or is our parent if they causes themselves to have this illness.

[LivingLife]

Well valk, you will find two doctrines in the OT. One infers that god will curse a number of generations because of the transgressions of the father and elsewhere there is the doctrine that the son is not responsible for the sins of the father and visa versa. The latter is more in line with our modern culture in that a dad cannot take the place of the son if he were convicted of a crime and serve his sentence in stead.

 

One can point out that the influence of parents does affect the outcome of the child in later years and for this the biblical doctrine of chastening and sound teaching is encouraged. All of this would make sense in a a Utopian world but sadly we do not have that consistency. Some kids come out of horrible homes and adjust and the same can be said of those coming from loving homes that turn out to be tards.

 

This is probably the million dollar question, parents often ask themselves, "where did I go wrong?" Others will judge the parents parenting and draw their own conclusions. How often have we heard theists infer that gays come from abusive childhoods where they were molested? I was molested and turned out OK and never once molested a child.

 

Parents are answerable for their children's behavior to a point until they become adults. Even the so called age of accountability the xians espouse, assume that a kid of 14 really thinks rationally about all things and thus now magically inherit Adam's sin.

 

So if a kid is to blame for the parents mistakes, we as parents should all be in prison.

 

Of course with the xian faith there is the easy out, just accept jeebus into your heart and all is good, you can continue to be a fucktard w/o consequences, baby jeebus will fix it all up when he returns.

 

In the case of the aids example, the mother is responsible but then one has to be regressive to the original cause and that person is responsible aka Adam or Eve or the snake then ultimately a schitzo god that created them in the first place. Humans tend to not take responsibility for their actions and decisions, it is always someone else's fault.

 

The way I view the xian doctrine is the inverse of the "power of positive thinking" There is so much negativity espoused that you are left to identify with a collective that believe they are not even worthy to live.

 

Sorry for rambling.

[TMJ]

Number one is actually even worse. Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil so I assume that they were like small children, not fully responsible for their own actions. Yet, god allowed a tempter to wonder around their garden and then punished the couple when they listened to him. That is a bit like a parent letting someone who wants to hurt his child spend alone time with his offspring and then punishing the child for what happens. We would all say that parent was abusive, yet the biblical god gets a pass for doing the same thing.

 

 

[JasperST4]

I don't get it, sorry. The Christian answer is the belief in Jesus as the only salvation no matter how good or bad you are. I always had a problem with it but accepted it with the caveat that God decides, not the church or doctrine.

 

That said, I don't believe in a sin nature anymore but humans being intelligent creatures can and do plot to do wrong. Sometimes for spite, sometimes for pleasure, there's any number of reasons. Then you come down to who defines right or wrong? Societies make the laws but aren't always based on morality so I'd say it comes down to doing onto others as you'd have them do to you. A basic biblical principle, but one grounded on common sense and reason, most religions share similar views. I've even heard of moral atheists.

[hereticzero]

We are not born with a 'sinful nature', otherwise Adam and Eve would have been sinning before the produce went bad and Eve was seduced by a talking snake. We learn what is right and wrong from our parents who were taught by theirs and so on .... What I am taught as being 'good' may be a 'sin' in another culture or visa versa, like breast-feeding a hungry infant--in third-world countries, societies do not faint at the sight of a bare-breasted woman like they do in America. We learn what is good and bad as we grow older and gain experience and wisdom. A person makes choices constantly, to do good or evil, one takes as much determination as the other. Because we do evil to others and ourselves we can also do good and show mercy and love and compassion. Nothing we do requires the presence of a god or a religion. We choose. Humans have no more of a sinful nature than a lion that kills a zebra for food or occasion, just kill it for the thrill of it. Humans make those choices too. What humans do is natural for humans to do.