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Neanderthals


lostman42
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I heard recently that neanderthal skeletons have been found on different continents, is this true? And if it is how did they all travel so far from each other? Sorry I really don't know much about them and am wanting to learn more.

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Neanderthals existed for quite some time, longer than Homo Sapiens. During that time, they radiated out from Northern Africa into North-West Asia and Southern Europe. I haven't heard they reached to any other continents.

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There was a fascinating documentary on the BBC here in the UK about the cultural collision of Homo Erectus and Homo Sapiens in India. I didn't even know H.E. were around at the same time. This week there is a second part about our interation with the Neanderthals.

How do Christians cope with the existence of other human species? Are they included in the scheme of salvation through Christ? They must have got pretty fed up of waiting (in prison) for him to arrive.

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How do Christians cope with the existence of other human species? Are they included in the scheme of salvation through Christ?

Many of them argue that they're not a different human species, but a human species just like us. And their explanation to the differences in the skeleton is that the people lived until 900 years of age back then, so their skeletons would look different. :rolleyes:

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what about Homo Fiorensis (hobbits :) ) or are they just 900 year old pygmies? I'm still at the stage where I have some residual feeling that there may be some truth in Christianity, so these documentaries are both shocking and delightful.

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what about Homo Fiorensis (hobbits :) ) or are they just 900 year old pygmies? I'm still at the stage where I have some residual feeling that there may be some truth in Christianity, so these documentaries are both shocking and delightful.

 

 

There are grains of truth in any religion. It's just that they have been usurped by those in power and twisted to fit those in power's needs.

 

I would not be looking to religion to explain anthropology.

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what about Homo Fiorensis (hobbits :) ) or are they just 900 year old pygmies? I'm still at the stage where I have some residual feeling that there may be some truth in Christianity, so these documentaries are both shocking and delightful.

 

 

Or how about Ardipithecus Ramidus?

 

Skeleton-of-Ardi-18ys8gi.jpg

 

 

Who would have thought that aging 900 years would give you opposable toes for climbing through trees and hands that came down to your knees. :grin:

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is it just me or does Christianity not seem to make any sense :)

 

Seriously though, there are non-fundy (but yet evangelical Christians) who believe in evolution. I wander how they rationalize this.

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I didn't believe in Neanderthals. I believed they were skeletons of old men with arthritis, no kidding.

 

 

Wasn't the first neanderthal found to be an old man neanderthal with arithirtis?

 

Or did I just completely miss the point.

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I didn't believe in Neanderthals. I believed they were skeletons of old men with arthritis, no kidding.

 

 

Wasn't the first neanderthal found to be an old man neanderthal with arithirtis?

 

Or did I just completely miss the point.

I think he was kidding (even though he said he wasn't). :)

 

We studied some osteology in the last anthropology class. There are many ways to tell age, disease, arthritis, etc from the bones. The whole idea of early hominids being deformed or very old homo sapiens is just a joke in my book. Neanderthals have different dental arcades and formula. The skull is different. Not all of them have arthritis. You can tell age from the epiphyseal fusion, sutures, pelvis, and much more. And arthritis shows in wear and tear in a different way. Besides, they have found many neanderthal fossils, even some children.

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  • 3 weeks later...

is it just me or does Christianity not seem to make any sense :)

 

Seriously though, there are non-fundy (but yet evangelical Christians) who believe in evolution. I wander how they rationalize this.

 

 

some belive in evolution becuase their doing what religions have done for centuries and adapted to changing societies. same with the idea the world was flat, christians refused to let go of that belief even though obviously the world is square. today evry one knows its round becuase we have so much proof of it, as we get more and more proof for evolution more and more religions will simply come to adapt the belief to their relgion in the face of evidence.

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At one time in the past, homo sapiens shared this planet with at least 3 to 5 different types of humanoids, all of who have gone extinct except homo sapiens (I believe HS exterminated the others). I have heard Christians try to explain away the extinctions as the day of the flood of Noah, they were all killed off by god except homo sapiens.

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I have heard Christians try to explain away the extinctions as the day of the flood of Noah, they were all killed off by god except homo sapiens.

 

That Flood story is really abused. I saw one poster say this, but have any of you ever seen a person alive today that resembles Neandertal? You know, similar facial characteristics and longish limbs?

I have, went to college with him, had close, very inset beady eyes, large jaw, heavy brow, and from the side he looked like on even more! It was fascinating!

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Turns out we may be more closely related to Neanderthals than we think...

 

http://news.discovery.com/human/genetics-neanderthal-110718.html

 

If your heritage is non-African, you are part Neanderthal, according to a new study in the July issue of Molecular Biology and Evolution. Discovery News has been reporting on human/Neanderthal interbreeding for some time now, so this latest research confirms earlier findings.

 

Damian Labuda of the University of Montreal's Department of Pediatrics and the CHU Sainte-Justine Research Center conducted the study with his colleagues. They determined some of the human X chromosome originates from Neanderthals, but only in people of non-African heritage.

 

"This confirms recent findings suggesting that the two populations interbred," Labuda was quoted as saying in a press release. His team believes most, if not all, of the interbreeding took place in the Middle East, while modern humans were migrating out of Africa and spreading to other regions.

 

The ancestors of Neanderthals left Africa about 400,000 to 800,000 years ago. They evolved over the millennia mostly in what are now France, Spain, Germany and Russia. They went extinct, or were simply absorbed into the modern human population, about 30,000 years ago.

 

Neanderthals possessed the gene for language and had sophisticated music, art and tool craftsmanship skills, so they must have not been all that unattractive to modern humans at the time.

 

"In addition, because our methods were totally independent of Neanderthal material, we can also conclude that previous results were not influenced by contaminating artifacts," Labuda said.

 

This work goes back to nearly a decade ago, when Labuda and his colleagues identified a piece of DNA, called a haplotype, in the human X chromosome that seemed different. They questioned its origins.

 

Fast forward to 2010, when the Neanderthal genome was sequenced. The researchers could then compare the haplotype to the Neanderthal genome as well as to the DNA of existing humans. The scientists found that the sequence was present in people across all continents, except for sub-Saharan Africa, and including Australia.

 

"There is little doubt that this haplotype is present because of mating with our ancestors and Neanderthals," said Nick Patterson of the Broad Institute of MIT and Harvard University. Patterson did not participate in the latest research. He added, "This is a very nice result, and further analysis may help determine more details."

 

David Reich, a Harvard Medical School geneticist, added, "Dr. Labuda and his colleagues were the first to identify a genetic variation in non-Africans that was likely to have come from an archaic population. This was done entirely without the Neanderthal genome sequence, but in light of the Neanderthal sequence, it is now clear that they were absolutely right!"

 

The modern human/Neanderthal combo likely benefitted our species, enabling it to survive in harsh, cold regions that Neanderthals previously had adapted to.

 

"Variability is very important for long-term survival of a species," Labuda concluded. "Every addition to the genome can be enriching."

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