Did The Rejection Of A Literal Reading Of Genesis Help Lead To Your Deconversion?

[Skepticktok]

Hello everyone I'm Stephen.

 

I'm curious growing up I was raised in a Pentecostal enviroment (Word of Faith/Assemblies of God) despite my interest in Paleontology I remember being taught to actively reject any notion of evolution, especially when it came to a link between apes and humans. Despite that I still found myself believing in an old universe. I had a weird hodgepodge of beliefs in regards to interpretations of Genesis 1-12.

 

In High School I attended a Christian school with lots of books from Answers in Genesis, the ICR and others. Thy even had the magainze Creation Ex-Nihilo shipped to our library every month and I read it quite a bit. Despite the fact that I am now an atheist I became convinced of something during that time that I still believe. The discarding of a literal Genesis chapters 1-12 causes serious problems with Christian theology. I know there are alot of Christian groups acting as if the Bible and evolution can be reconciled (the Catholic church for example) but I don't buy it. If you say that humans are the result of millions of years of evolution and that the Garden of Eden story is simply an allegory or a myth...it fundamentally, and I believe fataly damages the doctrine of original sin. If human beings weren't literally infected with sin do to the actions of Adam and Eve why is there a need for Jesus to die on the cross for the salvation of humanity? How does Paul analogy of the first Adam and the last Adam make any sense? How does the geneology of Jesus make any sense if some of the people mentioned weren't real? And most relative to modern issues of gender how can one justify women submiting to men if 1st Timothy 2:11-17 are not based on actual events?

 

Stepping outside of Genesis for a second, for Christian evolutionist at what point during the evolution of the homonid's does an immortal soul develop?

 

Answers in Genesis and the others are right about one thing...it causes problems for Christianity when Genesis is not read literally. It was key step for me leaving Christianity.

 

 

I'm just curious to see if this was true for many other ex-believers as well.

[Skepticktok]

I'm sorry I should have put a question mark in the title. If someone can edit that I'd be greatful.

[mcdaddy]

It mostly blows it up, but you could still say that our own 'personal' sins are what needs to be erased, not 'original sin' per se. For me its just everything in total. "death by a million paper cuts" as someone on another topic said. Plus, God never told me personally i'm hell bound because of any sin matter, so when another human tells me, im now extremely skeptical. if God wanted me to know that, he should tell me directly, not use some bozo the clown to tell me.

[Positivist]

My husband and I just had this same discussion today! I agree with you--that once you start pulling at that thread much unravels. The allegorical view is indeed a slippery slope.

[JoeCoastie]

It certainly shrinks God and his role in the universe. The most devout typically hold a literal interpretation and your more moderate Christians see it as metaphor.

[mymistake]

During my last year as a Christian I woke up and realized the Bible wasn't the word of God. I still lingered on as a Christian and looking back I call that my liberal phase. Long before that I was still a conservative Christian when I accepted the possibility that the book of Genesis is the word of God but God intended as a metaphor to teach spiritual truths. My changing views on the Bible played their part. Perhaps my belief that the Bible was the world of God prevented me from de-converting. It might have been a prerequisite. But as far as the forces and pressure I felt the Bible was dwarfed by my perception of Christian behavior. Other Christians behaving badly was what weighed most on my mind.

[Positivist]

This question is such a can of worms. I was discussing this with my husband this afternoon (I mentioned this earlier, but now I have a keyboard).

 

If the Bible isn't 100% true--say it's only 99% true, with 1% being allegorical or myth--the whole thing falls apart. The 1% that is allegorical (Adam and Eve), or worse, lies, makes me wonder which 1% is allegorical. Can the goal posts be shifted here for the sake of theological convenience? Maybe on one day Adam and Eve are allegorical, but another day the goal posts shift and the resurrection takes the hit (and is allegorical). It's crazy making.

 

Of course, I am in favor of moving the Bible to the "historical fiction" section of the library. But in discussing with my ex-fundy husband (not my "fundy ex-husband"...lol) it made for good pot-stirring.

[Zephie]

I always get amazed when I read about ex-Christians who could think for themselves about topics like this. I've only begun questioning since I pretty much ignored science due to my religious upbringing (Baptist and AoG). What turned me away were little things like God being different in various parts of the Bible and my perpetual singleness whilst waiting for the "prophesied" man of God to be brought into my life. Would that I had the amazing critical thinking skills of many who post.

[Skepticktok]

Zephie don't get me started on the way Churchianity in America encourages men and particularly women to stay single and just wait for someone to come along and sweep them off their feet.

 

So how much "Scientific Creationism" were you all exposed to during your time in Christianity?

[Zephie]

I don't remember much in the way of scientific creationism...it's just all that was...probably until 9th grade and by then it was all chemistry, physical science, and physics. I think I even dropped an Anthropology class (which I was really interested in by the way) in college because it challenged all I knew about the beginnings of man. I felt so far behind the class hearing about things I've never heard about,etc.

[par4dcourse]

Of course it's a myth. Now if we could just get people to see that the rest of it is too.........

[Birdwatcher]

I always get amazed when I read about ex-Christians who could think for themselves about topics like this. I've only begun questioning since I pretty much ignored science due to my religious upbringing (Baptist and AoG). What turned me away were little things like God being different in various parts of the Bible and my perpetual singleness whilst waiting for the "prophesied" man of God to be brought into my life. Would that I had the amazing critical thinking skills of many who post.

 

Zephie, please don't feel badly about only beginning to question your faith and embracing science and critical thinking. I've been a Christian for 40 years (I went to church and believed in God all of my 58 years, but I formally "accepted Christ" when I was 18). It's only in the last year or so that I've begun questioning my faith. Thank God (or whoever) that you're figuring all of this out while you are still young, and before you're married. I've been married for 28 years, and I love my husband very much. He truly is a good man. But it does complicate things because my husband is still extremely devout, and I'm questioning everything. Also, it's not going to be easy to deprogram 58 years of christian thinking. I'm taking it one day at a time.

 

Zephie, you are young, and you have your whole life ahead of you. You are embarking on an exciting journey. I wish you all the best in your quest for truth.

[Ouroboros]

But... but... Genesis is true! I can feel it in my heart!

[NaturalMary63]

To the original post... Yes, it was problems with reconciling Genesis with science, history, and everything else including theology and the rest of the Bible, that ultimately began me down the road to atheism. I read the Bible for the first time in the late 1990s and it took me several years to unravel all the problems and finally conclude that the whole xian scheme was nonsense. But it all began with "in the beginning..."

[Thought2Much]

Welcome, Stephen!

 

Yes, the Christian view that the Bible (particularly Genesis) must be read literally was one of many things that put me on the path to deconversion. I started to realize that most of the people railing against evolution couldn't even describe what it actually is when asked about it. Also, when I've asked Christians about the age of the earth and radioisotope dating, I've either gotten blank stares or some vague mumbling about carbon dating being inaccurate, because these people don't even realize that carbon dating has never been used to date the age of the earth, but only organic things within a very narrow timeframe, geologically speaking. When I've asked how parts of the observable universe can be confirmed to be millions, even billions of light years away to within a specific margin of error, they would go to their intellectual bunker and mutter something about how God made the universe and the earth with the appearance of being billions of years old, not even realizing that there is no fundamental difference between a universe made to look and function as if it is billions of years old, and one that actually is billions of years old.

 

Watching Christians belittle scientists, nearly every one of whom is likely far smarter than 99% of the Christians I've ever known, was sickening. The same God who granted Solomon great wisdom apparently never saw fit to give any Christians I knew even a small portion of that gift, because when it came to science, they were nearly to a person completely inarticulate. I thought it was a sad statement that I, a graphic designer with nothing but an art degree and what I've read on my own, could point out every flaw and every inaccuracy in every young earth creationist argument, yet so many others kept themselves so insulated from learning about science that they couldn't even understand what I was talking about when I would correct them.

 

For a number of years I tried to convince myself that somehow the scientists were wrong, or only coming to the wrong conclusions based on the evidence they had, evidence which was missing God. I later realized that it was my "God filter" that was screwing up my view of science. Once I could tell myself honestly that Christians were completely off base about one part of the Bible, I really started to question the veracity of the rest of it.

[Foxy Methoxy]

Genesis is clearly a metaphor. It is written in Hebrew and scribes were not allowed to write literally regarding mundane subjects. How anyone can believe talking serpents, forbidden fruit, naughty fruit eaters hiding their bits from God with fig leaf aprons, fallen watchers, giant offspring, and people living 900 years is a literal truth is beyond me.

[oddbird1963]

I think the process of asking questions and searching for answers with a skeptical, critical and rational approach leads to deconversion.

 

I took that approach with questions of the creation story and the great flood in Genesis. I came to the conclusion that those chapters had to be told mythically and understood in terms of the lessons those passages try to teach. I stayed in that position for a number of years before ever dealing with the historicity of the later parts of the Old Testament and, of course, the resurrection of Christ.

 

When things just didin't add up in terms of "New Testament" christianity, I then continued to approach the NT with a critical eye.

 

I don't think there is a set in stone process for deconversion, but I think it is normal for Genesis to go before other passages or sections are dispensed with.

[mymistake]

But... but... Genesis is true! I can feel it in my heart!

 

It must be true. I wouldn't want to live in a world where it wasn't true.

[Positivist]

....something about how God made the universe and the earth with the appearance of being billions of years old, not even realizing that there is no fundamental difference between a universe made to look and function as if it is billions of years old, and one that actually is billions of years old.

God must have had fun sprinkling those fossils around, too! Just to trick us! Or....just to make things interesting. I can't decide which.

 

For a number of years I tried to convince myself that somehow the scientists were wrong, or only coming to the wrong conclusions based on the evidence they had, evidence which was missing God. I later realized that it was my "God filter" that was screwing up my view of science.

I was always told that scientists are purposefully trying to cut God out of the equation. You know, because they're atheists and therefore they are hedonists running from God's Law. Yeah, makes sense. Partiers are always the PhD types, ya know? They just piss around in higher education (all 10+ years of it), piss around getting grants for their research, and at the very top of their daily agenda are the words: "Disprove God!"

 

Yesiree, that's how it works, people.

[Voice]

Well, these guys are right, the Genesis stories are true.

It didn't affect my leaving the church or christianity. None of the text's contradictions did.

For me it was hypocrisy, my own, my friends (associates, prayer partners etc.), of the leaders. It was the vanity. It was people saying they're healed when they weren't. I could go on.

It was insane. I was insane. I should be locked up.

[mymistake]

I was always told that scientists are purposefully trying to cut God out of the equation. You know, because they're atheists and therefore they are hedonists running from God's Law. Yeah, makes sense. Partiers are always the PhD types, ya know? They just piss around in higher education (all 10+ years of it), piss around getting grants for their research, and at the very top of their daily agenda are the words: "Disprove God!"

 

Yesiree, that's how it works, people.

 

It's a conspiracy. Scientists sit around and plan out how to make people believe there is no God because the scientist love to have sex in ways that God does not approve.

 

(You know I actually believed this crap at one point. I'm not making that part of it up. This is memory.)

[Zephie]

Honestly, my view of atheism before I ventured into the waters was of people just wanting an excuse to do whatever they wanted. Now I know that it's not an excuse because people are going to do whatever they want and will back it up with the Bible(since it can be twisted that way). As an ex-xtian, I find that I am more repsonsible with my decisions than I was before if anything I have an excuse to think. So no it wasn't a literal interpretation lol

[lunaticheathen]

I was actually one of those strange ones who never believed in literal biblical creationism. The first time a YECer talked to me, I thought he was joking! I believe in a lot of crazypants things, but that kind of tinfoil-hattery was even beyond me.

What caused me to deconvert was reading Genesis, but not because of "creation." Chapter 3 shows what a complete asshole Abraham's god really is, and that he didn't want his children to learn. That pissed me off, and I decided he simply wasn't worthy of my worship.

[freeasabird]

Absolutely. As I've mentioned before to liberal Christians who astutely point out that evolution doesn't disprove god, I tell them they are absolutely correct, it only disproves Christianity.

[ToonForever]

It was the first domino to fall for me. I was staunchly YEC. Ken Ham spoke at our church and flogged his books, all of which I bought. Read him, Henry Morris, etc. Had tapes to listen to. Could pretty much parrot all their BS - until I actually got into a discussion with someone who knew a little something and got my ass handed to me.

 

Later on I realized that science really had something to say - they were just following the breadcrumbs, not an agenda - the exact opposite of inerrantist Christians. After that it was only a matter of time before the whole house of cards fell in.