Did Jesus Exclude Gentiles?

[essence]

After beoming an ex-Christian I found this website that covers a lot of ground.

 

http://members.aol.com/JAlw/jesus_and_the_gentiles.html

 

Yes, Jesus excluded Gentiles. He had no choice per his covenant

and laws.

 

Why do Christians not accept the statements Jesus made?

 

Could it be because Peter lied in his "dreamer of dreams" trance?

[essence]

You know what, your question has brought up something very very interesting...

 

1. The only place in the gospels where it says to take the gospel to the world is in Mark 16:9-20 to which, other than KJV only people, other bible scholars say IS NOT found in early manuscripts. hmmmm

 

2. If Peter had a "vision" then why would Paul have to tell Peter as though he was hearing for the first time? hmmmmm

 

Of course we know the reason is because it is all a bunch of hogwash, but this does pose a problem to the bible believer.

 

1. If one is a KJV only then it appears that Peter forgets his mission not once but twice; Acts Vision and then again with Paul. I mean if Mark 16:9-20 is correct, then he already knew first hand from Jesus himself that it was okay to go to the gentiles. In which case, why did he need the Acts vision? Peters vision happens as though a first time experience.

 

2. If one doesn't care which bible they use, it is still a problem because even without Mark 16, the vision is like a "first-hand" knowledge from the Lord. According to Pauline epistles, he makes as though Peter hasn't a clue wtf he is talking about. Even after the Acts vision, during the rest of Acts it appears as though Peter still hasn't got a clue. I wonder if several people wrote Acts and not just one person. Acts 10 is where Peter has the vision to go to the gentiles, but yet in Paul's epistles, he says that HE is the apostle to the gentiles...WTF? Matter of fact he even boasts about NOT letting the other apostles know what he is doing.

 

Good topic, Essence.

 

 

Thank you SerenityNow, and hopefully it may help people realize the bible story is just a story and intended for Jewish people alone.

 

Here are a few other interesting things Christians should consider:

 

1. Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel only. This

should determine no non-Jewish foundation in Christ allowed; for

neither was Jesus sent to Egyptians, Romans, or Syrians, or Greeks.

2. Jesus commanded his student disciples to preach in the cities of Israel only

and not go in the way of the Gentiles.

 

But Peter lied and Christians are forced to deal with the lie and make

excuses against what is stated in OT Ezekiel 13:1-3.

 

Why did Peter lie against already established laws for Jews? Because he was living in the same manner as Gentiles, which indicates Peter was an idol worshipper. Maybe he

worshipped the Great Goddess Diana? Paul exposed the hypocrisy of Peter and then Peter went back to Jerusalem with James and the other apostles. Paul was then given permission to take a letter to the Gentiles informing the Gentiles that no covenant or law of Moses could be found to bind them in those precepts of Judaism.

 

The ten commandments or any other commandments of Moses

were never given as laws to any other people than sons of Jacob

called Israel. None were given to Egyptian, Assyrians, Moabites,

Jebusites, Amonites, or Edomites (Esau).

 

Christians refuse to study these things. Why? What do they fear?

These things prove that Christianity as we have known it is a falsified

religion, a bastardized Judiasm, and a tradition built on (IMO) the

purpose of the church fathers to steal land from the Jews. This yet

remains the purpose as I'm sure you've heard it said by Christians, thata,

"we are Israel now".

 

You noted the corruption in book of Mark which is denied by most Christians I've encountered.

 

I don't think any of the books were written by named source such as Matthew, Mark,

Luke, John. etc. These were supposedly testimonies made on what

had been heard and seen; exampled by Luke in his testimony(treatise) to the

governor of Rome. Luke believes what he has heard and so passes it

on to others as truth. He also figures this in as "eyewitness" to the

truth somehow.

 

Another interesting point is in the parables Jesus gave to the multitudes.

Did you know Jesus deceived the multitudes? Yes! Jesus purposefully

deceived the multitudes by using parables because he said that only

the disciples were intended to be given the "mysteries" of the Kingdom

of Heaven. So what we see again is how the ministry of Jesus was

specifically directed to Jews and not Gentiles.

 

The "uncircumcised Gentiles" were NEVER approved as "a people" of God.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2. God was God to none but those in covenant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

[Ssel]

As much as I would love to explain this whole story from the perspective of the Hebrew and clear the air, I know that such is a long and complicated story.

 

The Jewry has taken the Hebrew God as a God exclusively belonging to the Jewry alone. The Jewry worships power and selfish gain and uses the Staff of Moses and God for this purpose. Jesus attempted to help correct for their selfish lusting but they denied Him because he would not use the Staff of Moses to defeat the Romans. He offered, instead, a better idea.

 

In the long run, just as was predicted, the Jewry WILL end up being the Master and Pharaoh to the entire world. But also, just as predicted immediately thereafter the world will change.

 

Once the Jewry has used their selfish guile, feigned innocence, and Staff of Moses to amass great riches and military power, the quiet Hebrew, knowing the truth of his God and the true guilt of the Jewry, will stand up saying, “Yes, that is all fine and good, but you have left out this one tiny detail…” And from the Jewish oppressed gentiles will begin something which the Jewry can not fathom nor deal. Their Staff of Moses will have little, if any, affect. They will be brought to their knees to either learn to admit their guilt and be humble to their REAL God, or join in the masses in shoal to be forever forgotten.

 

Explaining exactly WHY all of this has no choice but to occur takes FAR more understanding than the common worshipper or anti-worshipper is prepared to handle.

 

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

[SkepticOfBible]

The "uncircumcised Gentiles" were NEVER approved as "a people" of God.

 

Proof of that is the Jewish Bible

 

According to Bible prophecy, humanity will turn to the Jews for knowledge of God and not to Christians.

 

Zech 8:23

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

 

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

 

What's the difference between a present day hebrew and a present day Jew?

[Ssel]

 

What's the difference between a present day hebrew and a present day Jew?

 

Oooo...Great question...

 

The Jewry takes to themselves and proclaims that all is a gift from God. Much like a thief who doesn't get caught and then proclaims that everything is just fine.

 

The Hebrew, then and NOW, lives by concept. This is much like the Buddhist and Taoist. One doesn't have to be born Chinese or East Indian to be a Buddhist. But the Jewry fights solely for the advance of the genetic line of their families.

 

This is relevant in that Jesus was at very least a Buddhist, but with a little more added. And thus the Christian has never been about any one genetic line of dissent. It is about understanding and following the right "spirit" of the thing.

 

According to Bible prophecy, humanity will turn to the Jews for knowledge of God and not to Christians.

..this is a fact

 

The reason for this taking place is that Christianity is a more complex concept, requiring more understanding, thus man goes through the steps of discovering what works. It isn't until he has discovered what DOESN'T work, that he can clearly see what MUST be accepted and yields the best results.

 

The Satanist is the first thought of what MUST be the ultimate of all true power (Satan = a governing method which keeps people striving in their lusts so as to keep them weak and allowing the government to stay protected from any rebellion)

 

In short, the Jew is an admitted racist (wisely pointing at that OTHER person for being the racist), the Hebrew is NOT. The Jew hides behind the proclamation that all his amassed wealth and military might has been merely a gift from God, and in this isn't entirely wrong, but then again, it isn't the whole story either.

[essence]

The "uncircumcised Gentiles" were NEVER approved as "a people" of God.

 

Proof of that is the Jewish Bible

 

According to Bible prophecy, humanity will turn to the Jews for knowledge of God and not to Christians.

 

Zech 8:23

Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

 

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

 

What's the difference between a present day hebrew and a present day Jew?

 

I don't think there is a difference as "Jew" is Judah (now called Israel) and Hebrew the language of tradition.

[Ssel]

Emmm... so there are no gentiles? Because now they are called Italians. Americans, French,.....

 

The Hebrew language came from the HEBREWS

The Jews were one small cult which gained significance and then claimed all important history as theirown.

Moses was NOT Jewish. But Hebrew by faith.

[essence]

As much as I would love to explain this whole story from the perspective of the Hebrew and clear the air, I know that such is a long and complicated story.

 

The Jewry has taken the Hebrew God as a God exclusively belonging to the Jewry alone. The Jewry worships power and selfish gain and uses the Staff of Moses and God for this purpose. Jesus attempted to help correct for their selfish lusting but they denied Him because he would not use the Staff of Moses to defeat the Romans. He offered, instead, a better idea.

 

In the long run, just as was predicted, the Jewry WILL end up being the Master and Pharaoh to the entire world. But also, just as predicted immediately thereafter the world will change.

 

Once the Jewry has used their selfish guile, feigned innocence, and Staff of Moses to amass great riches and military power, the quiet Hebrew, knowing the truth of his God and the true guilt of the Jewry, will stand up saying, “Yes, that is all fine and good, but you have left out this one tiny detail…” And from the Jewish oppressed gentiles will begin something which the Jewry can not fathom nor deal. Their Staff of Moses will have little, if any, affect. They will be brought to their knees to either learn to admit their guilt and be humble to their REAL God, or join in the masses in shoal to be forever forgotten.

 

Explaining exactly WHY all of this has no choice but to occur takes FAR more understanding than the common worshipper or anti-worshipper is prepared to handle.

 

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

 

 

I'm not so sure that Jesus taught anything different than what was prescribed by law and known within the Jewish priesthood of Levi. However, Jesus opposed their hypocrisy in that the Pharises gave commands but did not obey the commands themselves.

 

Humanity, as non-Jewish people of the world, has nothing to do with Judaism and its God, and "nations" reference the 12 tribes of Israel.

 

Also, there can be no so-called genetic line of dissent as proposed but a mixed consortium of people who joined to the Abrahamic covenant. "Royal" blood is out, adoption process as sons were in. Adoption was a welcomed additive as the Israelites were small in number and needed to expand their name in the land of Canaan land. "Be fruitful and multiple" through obtaining converts which of course screwed up any notion of a pure race in sons of Jacob called Israel.

[essence]

Emmm... so there are no gentiles? Because now they are called Italians. Americans, French,.....

 

The Hebrew language came from the HEBREWS

The Jews were one small cult which gained significance and then claimed all important history as theirown.

Moses was NOT Jewish. But Hebrew by faith.

 

 

If you've studied pagan traditions which existed in those times you know

that the term "Gentiles" derived from "uncircumcised Genitiles".

 

It is reportedly said that Abraham's worship of idols was in honor of the

phallus symbols strone throughout the land of Canaan. Imagine all those huge sexual organs

in honor of fertility worship. This is what circumcision was all about, penis worship.

 

And what of Easter Island??

[SkepticOfBible]

The Jews were one small cult which gained significance and then claimed all important history as theirown

 

On what basis are you saying the Jews were not the hebrews of the OT, and that they were a cult.

 

The Jewry takes to themselves and proclaims that all is a gift from God. Much like a thief who doesn't get caught and then proclaims that everything is just fine.

 

They don't proclaim ownership to everything, but they talk about the promised land. The OT is about is about inheritance and the Genetic Blood lines.

 

The Hebrew, then and NOW, lives by concept. This is much like the Buddhist and Taoist. One doesn't have to be born Chinese or East Indian to be a Buddhist. But the Jewry fights solely for the advance of the genetic line of their families.

 

Well if you consider yourself a hebrew, does the laws of the OT apply to you?

 

This is relevant in that Jesus was at very least a Buddhist, but with a little more added. And thus the Christian has never been about any one genetic line of dissent. It is about understanding and following the right "spirit" of the thing.

 

Christianianity has been around for 2000 years, and the Holy Ghost still hasn't been to guide them to the right and wrong. On the contrary it is splitting away more and more.

 

The reason for this taking place is that Christianity is a more complex concept, requiring more understanding, thus man goes through the steps of discovering what works. It isn't until he has discovered what DOESN'T work, that he can clearly see what MUST be accepted and yields the best results.

 

It is funny that you say that Judaism is cult, whereas it is christianity that is the cult which revolves around a Human Sacrifice, because it contradict the OT at so many times. On the contrary Judaism does align more with OT than Christianity.

 

Jesus attempted to help correct for their selfish lusting but they denied Him because he would not use the Staff of Moses to defeat the Romans..He offered, instead, a better idea

 

Are you saying that Jesus was the valid messiah?

The reason why he was denied was not because he did not use the staff of moses to defeat the romans, it was because he didn't have the correct credentials of being the messiah. Primarily being the descendent of david/Solomon/Asa. He did none of the stuff that the valid messiah was supposed to do.

 

The Position of Messiah Is Still Vacant

 

One of the thing that the Old Testament states that an expected messiah would usher in an era of great compliance with the law.

 

The Old Testament stipulation does not say that an expected king Messiah would offer a better idea. The ideas were already declared perfect in the OT. There was nothing for Jesus to fix

 

Ezek 37:24

And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.

 

Jesus did not usher in an era of great compliance with the law. He actually undermined it.by

1)Lying

2)Telling people not to observe dietary restricting imposed by the OT

3)Practicing heathen rituals such as baptism

4)Working on a sabbath

5)Introduce bizarre blood drinking and cannabislistic rituals which are prohibited by the OT

6)letting a adulteress women go without the punishment as stated by the OT

7)By asking people to worship him, even though God explicitly told his people that God is not a man

 

In the long run, just as was predicted, the Jewry WILL end up being the Master and Pharaoh to the entire world. But also, just as predicted immediately thereafter the world will change.

 

Where does it say in the OT that Jewish People would end up being the master and Pharoah of the world, and then it will change right after that?

 

In short, the Jew is an admitted racist (wisely pointing at that OTHER person for being the racist), the Hebrew is NOT. The Jew hides behind the proclamation that all his amassed wealth and military might has been merely a gift from God, and in this isn't entirely wrong, but then again, it isn't the whole story either.

 

The jews feel that they are chosen ones of God because God choose their ancestors over others. It is they who would show the true nature of god. In that respect Christians are also racist because they feel that they are the chosen elite.

[Ssel]

As much as I would love to explain this whole story from the perspective of the Hebrew and clear the air, I know that such is a long and complicated story.

 

I’m not going to take up the defensive arguments available, it’s just too much to clear up.

 

pritish,

From your posts, you seem intelligent. But no amount of intelligence helps if a person begins with a bad premise. You are operating and laboriously constructing elite arguments based on the same erroneous premise as the Santa Claus Christian. When you find out, assuming you held to it that long, the error in premise and the correction for it, then you will see how much of a grand waste all of the arguments have been. The people that you have been arguing with didn’t realize the error either. Everything so carefully constructed to rebut the other guy, served nothing but to occupy your time and perhaps to gain enough information such that it could all come together one day. - “enlightenment”

 

But I’m not the one to take you through all of that. The entire thing is just too long to straighten out in this way. The only thing I will say is that it will help if you look toward the metaphorical Christian and be even better at it than he. But to do that, you have to stop arguing with such passion long enough to carefully, very carefully feel your way through the errors (that they TOO are making) to find what the REAL truth was about.

[scotter]

If I could humbly participate as the mediator between Ssel and PritishD, despite what I have been adding and updating with the Colosseum long thread "A discussion on Jesus as the Messiah", I do not reject Christianity and Christian acknowledgement that Jesus as the Messiah. Whether as dogmatic indoctrination or private spiritual experience with Jesus like Open_Mind's, it is fine.

 

Sri Ramakrishna (don’t take that I am a Hindu though) said even one sees divinity in the ordinary, and he sees God. As a myth or a historical person or the Messiah to the Christians – Jesus is no ordinary. Can one not see divinity in Jesus then? Can one not see divinity in Christianity then?

 

I was planning to write this message in the ".....Jesus as Messiah" thread, this is an appropriate place and time also.

[SkepticOfBible]

[

From your posts, you seem intelligent. But no amount of intelligence helps if a person begins with a bad premise.

 

 

Ahhhh Excuse me, I was only responding to your assertions that's all, namely

The Jews were one small cult which gained significance and then claimed all important history as their own

.....

Jesus attempted to help correct for their selfish lusting but they denied Him because he would not use the Staff of Moses to defeat the Romans..He offered, instead, a better idea

 

...

In the long run, just as was predicted, the Jewry WILL end up being the Master and Pharaoh to the entire world. But also, just as predicted immediately thereafter the world will change

 

....

 

In short, the Jew is an admitted racist (wisely pointing at that OTHER person for being the racist), the Hebrew is NOT.

....

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

 

In most of them I asked you for biblical evidence for your assertions

 

You do realise I do not believe in christ.

 

 

same erroneous premise as the Santa Claus Christian

 

Ok my mistake, I am not really sure what "hebrew" viewpoint are you supporting? I mean what is your standing as far as the "Jesus being God and Messiah of the Jews" issue goes?

[Ssel]

same erroneous premise as the Santa Claus Christian

 

Ok my mistake, I am not really sure what "hebrew" viewpoint are you supporting? I mean what is your standing as far as the "Jesus being God and Messiah of the Jews" issue goes?

 

What I meant by "erroneous premise" was that the bible can NOT be read literally.

It is written in serious, yet consistent metaphor for reasons.

Until you understand the exact metaphors being used, the scriptures make very little sense to any rational person.

 

BUT, once you actually see them and put it all together, THEN it becomes VERY consistent and more importantly it becomes HIGHLY relevant to the obvious intention and purpose of its writing.

 

You can only know when you have it right, when all of the pieces finally and really fit together into a truly rational, and relevant story. Then you can see WHY things were said, and you can discuss the real strategies and concepts being fought over. You can even begin to see how they play into a predictable pattern.

 

Once you understand it, you see VERY clearly that it is ALL about strategies and concepts. It is about creating nations and destroying them. It is about creating the worst of the worst and surviving the worst of the worst. It is about creating unity and creating dissention. And if you climb high enough on that mountain of understanding, you see that it, and all else that man must deal with is merely about the simple mental affect known as "lust of the mind" (not sexual, more like "luster" which blinds him from seeing reality).

 

NOTHING in the Bible is about superstition, voodoo, magic, hocus pocus and such BS.

 

You can not judge if Jesus said anything relevant, because you don't know what any of them were really talking about yet.

 

The Jew worships the scriptures and family linage.

The Hebrew worships the understanding those scriptures were written to convey to people with minds to see past the clouds. --- ANY people from ANY family linage.

 

"..tell them "IT IS what IT IS" and they will know that you have addressed their 'God'"

[SkepticOfBible]

quote name='Ssel' date='Nov 19 2005, 09:15 PM' post='108932']

 

What I meant by "erroneous premise" was that the bible can NOT be read literally.

It is written in serious, yet consistent metaphor for reasons.

Until you understand the exact metaphors being used, the scriptures make very little sense to any rational person.

 

And who gets to decide what part of the bible is metaphor and which is not.

 

 

BUT, once you actually see them and put it all together, THEN it becomes VERY consistent and more importantly it becomes HIGHLY relevant to the obvious intention and purpose of its writing.

 

You can only know when you have it right, when all of the pieces finally and really fit together into a truly rational, and relevant story. Then you can see WHY things were said, and you can discuss the real strategies and concepts being fought over.

 

Yes, that the fact that christianity is nothing more than a cult of Judaism. It took away bits and pieces of an already present theology and molded something new out of it.

 

Off course, to sell the valid claim, it had to show that the old system is obsolete and useless, just like you would sell a new model of car.

 

You can even begin to see how they play into a predictable pattern.

 

Once you understand it, you see VERY clearly that it is ALL about strategies and concepts. It is about creating nations and destroying them. It is about creating the worst of the worst and surviving the worst of the worst. It is about creating unity and creating dissention. And if you climb high enough on that mountain of understanding, you see that it, and all else that man must deal with is merely about the simple mental affect known as "lust of the mind" (not sexual, more like "luster" which blinds him from seeing reality).

 

Off I get, we are just a cosmic antfarm of Jesus

 

Wow that makes perfect sense.

 

You can not judge if Jesus said anything relevant, because you don't know what any of them were really talking about yet.

 

And you do?

 

All I know is that according the OT/Hebrew Bible Jesus was the false messiah. I don't regard him any higher than I would regard Krishna or Buddha or Joseph Smith

 

The Jew worships the scriptures and family linage.

 

And christians don't . The reason why family lineage is important in for the Jewish people because it is very important for the god of the OT. And they don't worship family lineage. Don't assert anything without evidence. Assertion without evidence is pure speculation.

 

They worship their god just as you do.

 

The Hebrew worships the understanding those scriptures were written to convey to people with minds to see past the clouds. --- ANY people from ANY family linage.

 

I was always under the impression that Jews and the Hebrews are synanamous.

 

And till this date you still haven't answered my main questions

 

1)what is your standing as far as the "Jesus being God and Messiah of the Jews" issue goes?

2)Do u practice all the laws given in the OT?

[essence]

As much as I would love to explain this whole story from the perspective of the Hebrew and clear the air, I know that such is a long and complicated story.

 

The Jewry has taken the Hebrew God as a God exclusively belonging to the Jewry alone. The Jewry worships power and selfish gain and uses the Staff of Moses and God for this purpose. Jesus attempted to help correct for their selfish lusting but they denied Him because he would not use the Staff of Moses to defeat the Romans. He offered, instead, a better idea.

 

In the long run, just as was predicted, the Jewry WILL end up being the Master and Pharaoh to the entire world. But also, just as predicted immediately thereafter the world will change.

 

Once the Jewry has used their selfish guile, feigned innocence, and Staff of Moses to amass great riches and military power, the quiet Hebrew, knowing the truth of his God and the true guilt of the Jewry, will stand up saying, “Yes, that is all fine and good, but you have left out this one tiny detail…” And from the Jewish oppressed gentiles will begin something which the Jewry can not fathom nor deal. Their Staff of Moses will have little, if any, affect. They will be brought to their knees to either learn to admit their guilt and be humble to their REAL God, or join in the masses in shoal to be forever forgotten.

 

Explaining exactly WHY all of this has no choice but to occur takes FAR more understanding than the common worshipper or anti-worshipper is prepared to handle.

 

“Is-ra-eel” is a concept which is different than the nation of Israel. And if it belongs to ANY one (which it really doesn’t), then it would belong to the Hebrew, not the selfish Jewry.

 

 

Getting back to your first statement: "As much as I would love to explain this whole story from the perspective of the Hebrew and clear the air, I know that such is a long and complicated story".

 

Not really. Jesus was rejected as the Messiah by some Jews while other Jews believed he was the one which had been predicted to come. The Jesus followers upset the existing system oin Judaism, but why? Scripture relates that some of the Jews, Pharisees, Sadducees and Elders were in fear of losing their name and place. What does this tell us? Were they in fear of having their names eliminated from the book of life in Israel? Names were recorded as to who were justified and who were not, according to laws established.

 

"And behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan who say they are Jews and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee." (Rev. 2:9)

 

Were the Pharisees "who sat in Moses seat", authorized (annointed) to that position as priests?

 

Was Jesus reinforcing the rules of law for citizenship in Israel and name under one of the 12 tribal sons of Jacob?

 

Consider this: The Pharisees were not a people of Jacob even though they were sons of Abraham. They were not anointed as the "elect" and "chosen people" to be priests in the Kingdom of God (Jerusalem).

 

Also consider this infighting among Jewish leaders as to why Jesus was crucified.

 

So what do these things have to do with Gentiles? Nothing. Gentiles were excluded from the governance of Israeli affairs then and now. The story of Jesus and the Jews is clearly a Jewish story and meant for Jewish investigation and examination.

[Ssel]

You asked for what MY stance was, I explained that it was much to long and complicated to go through but out of polite exchange, I offered a bit of my “view”. I did not come here to preach how one religion is better than the other. I have already posted that from MY view, they each have great wisdoms and at least slight error or short coming.

 

If you prefer to worship the Jew so as to crush the Christian, have at it. I’m not here to stand in your way. I have spoken FAR less against the Jewry than you have all spoken against the Christian. Yet from what I know of each. The Jew merely appears more innocent to you because that is their specialty. If you have accepted that they are the TRUE innocent followers of God, GO FOR IT. It matters not to Me in the long run.

 

There is a way to find the REAL truth if you actually had such a desire. But from what I see, your passion is simply to prove everyone wrong with no real plan in place as to where to go next. Have at it. I’m not here to argue with you. I answer a few questions when they are asked. If you want to discuss with me, fine. But I’m not here to argue, that’s Your game plan, not Mine.

 

To me a “debate” is for the purpose of actually making some progress, not merely keeping everyone from progress. But go with the flow if that’s what floats your boat.

 

My stand and stance is FAR too unique to take on every side when passionate hate is the only point and purpose. I believe that I know something that they have all left out. I didn’t come to that conclusion by naivety, blind faith, nor without finding very many misunderstandings of my own long ago.

 

I don’t get the same big thrill as the others here in burning the SCC (Santa Claus Christians). By doing so, I see a very serious trap. But I’m not here to try to stop your foe from tripping you up either. I’m NOT here to preach. If you don’t want to hear the few things I say, it should be easy enough to ignore them and go on. I don’t SPAM.

 

I can not explain exactly what I would prefer in place of all of this conflict without a long serious and sincere discussion. This isn’t really a place built for such. Thus I don’t attempt such.

 

I apologize for interfering with your stonings and crucifixions. I only intended to add a bit here or there to help those few who might be interested. If you want to destroy all of the SCC, go for it. You REALLY won’t like the results, but you’ll find that out on your own.

[SkepticOfBible]

You asked for what MY stance was, I explained that it was much to long and complicated to go through but out of polite exchange, I offered a bit of my “view”. I did not come here to preach how one religion is better than the other. I have already posted that from MY view, they each have great wisdoms and at least slight error or short coming.

 

Perhaps you have taken my skeptism as some form of christian pounding. We are all offering view. However at times you assert a lot of things like the Jews are evil and want to take over the world, and that at the end time they'll be turned over. All I asked was on what basis are you saying that

 

If you prefer to worship the Jew so as to crush the Christian, have at it. I’m not here to stand in your way.

I don't worship the Jew anymore than I worship a Muslim. You misunderstood my intentions

 

I have spoken FAR less against the Jewry than you have all spoken against the Christian.

 

Hey, I don't hate all christians, but it seem you hate the Jews as whole. Skeptism isn't the same as hatred which I think you have developed. However I am against the idea of fundamentalism

 

Yet from what I know of each. The Jew merely appears more innocent to you because that is their specialty. If you have accepted that they are the TRUE innocent followers of God, GO FOR IT. It matters not to Me in the long run.

 

When did I say they are the true followers of God. They are just as spiritual as more christians are. As you said no religion is better than another. Similarly no group of people is better than another.

 

I am sorry to say, but the terminology and idealogy that you present is very similarly to Nazi Germany

10 Arguements Against The Jews

 

I really hope that is not the case.

 

There is a way to find the REAL truth if you actually had such a desire. But from what I see, your passion is simply to prove everyone wrong with no real plan in place as to where to go next. Have at it. I’m not here to argue with you.

 

When did I take the say that the position or the worldview that I am holding is inerrant or infallible

 

I answer a few questions when they are asked. If you want to discuss with me, fine. But I’m not here to argue, that’s Your game plan, not Mine.

It's fine if you want to hold the opinion that all Jews are bad. But if you want to prove that into a fact you have to back it up with Evidence.

 

I am pretty sure when you are skeptical about other people's view you would also react in a similar way

To me a “debate” is for the purpose of actually making some progress, not merely keeping everyone from progress. But go with the flow if that’s what floats your boat.

My stand and stance is FAR too unique to take on every side when passionate hate is the only point and purpose. I believe that I know something that they have all left out. I didn’t come to that conclusion by naivety, blind faith, nor without finding very many misunderstandings of my own long ago.

 

I don't passionately hate christians. I am just against the fundamentalist absolute idea that bible is the errant word of god.

 

I apologize for interfering with your stonings and crucifixions. I only intended to add a bit here or there to help those few who might be interested.

 

I am interested in your views. I am just asking where is the foundation of your views. That's all.

[NotBlinded]

My stand and stance is FAR too unique to take on every side when passionate hate is the only point and purpose. I believe that I know something that they have all left out. I didn’t come to that conclusion by naivety, blind faith, nor without finding very many misunderstandings of my own long ago.

Ssel,

 

You have so much to offer, yet your approach turns people away. That is really a shame.

 

I just wanted to post an excerpt from The Power of Now:

 

A beggar had been sitting by the side of a road for over thirty years. One day a stranger walked by. "Spare some change?" mumbled the beggar, mechanically holding out his old baseball cap. "I have nothing to give you," said the stranger. Then he asked: "What's that you are sitting on?" "Nothing," replied the beggar. "Just an old box. I have been sitting on it for as long as I can remember." "Ever looked inside?" asked the stranger. "No," said the beggar. "What's the point? There's nothing in there." "Have a look inside," insisted the stranger. The beggar managed to pry open the lid. With astonishment, disbelief, and elation, he saw that the box was filled with gold.

 

I am that stranger who has nothing to give you and who is telling you to look inside. Not inside any box, as in the parable, but somewhere even closer: inside yourself.

 

In some posts that I read by you, I sense a little conceit. I don't know if this comes from the journey that you had to take to reach your understanding or if it just comes from being proud that you are where you are at. But to truly be there, one must be able to point without 'throwing their coins in the cap'.

[Ouroboros]

If you've studied pagan traditions which existed in those times you know

that the term "Gentiles" derived from "uncircumcised Genitiles".

Eh, no, I don't think that's correct.

 

The English word "gentiles" is from Middle English "gentil", and that is from from Late Latin "gentlis", which means "of the same clan".

 

It is reportedly said that Abraham's worship of idols was in honor of the

phallus symbols strone throughout the land of Canaan. Imagine all those huge sexual organs

in honor of fertility worship. This is what circumcision was all about, penis worship.

That could be true. Circumcision part of a pagan ritual for fertility etc...

[essence]

If you've studied pagan traditions which existed in those times you know

that the term "Gentiles" derived from "uncircumcised Genitiles".

Eh, no, I don't think that's correct.

 

The English word "gentiles" is from Middle English "gentil", and that is from from Late Latin "gentlis", which means "of the same clan".

 

It is reportedly said that Abraham's worship of idols was in honor of the

phallus symbols strone throughout the land of Canaan. Imagine all those huge sexual organs

in honor of fertility worship. This is what circumcision was all about, penis worship.

That could be true. Circumcision part of a pagan ritual for fertility etc...

 

 

Agreed. You've correctly noted the case in point indicating "genitals" which were of the same "clan".

 

Circumcision symbolized the cutting-off of other peoples from the house of Abraham. Circumcision and law are the two witnesses that identified Israel as an independent nation with her own god then and now.