BLACKGRAVITY Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 who was the eye witness to the creation of the world?...there's a christain record of it (bible) so who was there to see and write the fist few vs. of the bible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 who was the eye witness to the creation of the world?...there's a christain record of it (bible) so who was there to see and write the fist few vs. of the bible? Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 who was the eye witness to the creation of the world? ...there's a christain record of it (bible) so who was there to see and write the fist few vs. of the bible? Nobody was actually there. You see, when Moses penned Genisis, he was writing while under the inspiration of The Holy Spirit. So, the creation account is simply God speaking through Moses' words. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Nobody, unless you're one of those who think that Wisdom was a separate person and a goddess. There were references to that in books that the church threw out of the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 You see, when Moses penned Genisis, he was writing while under the inspiration of The Holy Spirit. Another way of saying that someone pulled it out of their ass. Just like Jesus' anguish in the Garden of Gethsemane, Jesus' prayer for all believers, Jesus' discussion with Pilate, Jesus' discussion with the Samaritan woman, Jesus' temptation in the desert. No one there to hear it or record it. Yet Christians hang on every word, like it's straight from the LORD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Another way of saying that someone pulled it out of their ass. I can't remember the website that I was on but it was Jewish. The webisite Rabbi said that the reason the OT is true is because unlike the other religions, god was witnessed on Mt. Sinai by an entire group of people and not just one person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheron Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Of course, the whole thing was made up. There had to be some "beginning" to their story so that's the best they could come up with, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACKGRAVITY Posted November 21, 2005 Author Share Posted November 21, 2005 i was just trying to get an idea of how and when the first book was writen,i know its bullshit,i want to know what other xtaians think,and would say.so... in other words,moses is responsable for all this crap?.. the orgin of this book is suppose to be from him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Even moderately conservative Christians will admit that there appear to be four authors to the Torah... I am too lazy to go find the scholarly work that has been done on the topic, but except for crazy inerrantists and such, most Christians accept that the Genesis is a compilation of things written by 2-4 authors. As for when it was penned? Hmm... I don't remember what the scholarly consensus on that is... I dont recall going over it in my Bible History class... perhaps it is still debated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 We tried to have this discussion over in the Colosseum, located here, but no Christian has been willing or able to handle this subject. Their silence is deafening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotBlinded Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 I think the Jews got their religion from Egypt and the Christians got their religion from the Egyptians and the Jews. That is why within the themes of the stories can be seen very similiar symbols such as the number 7, the cross and resurrection stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryten Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Only a complete MORON would believe that Moses wrote the last part of Deuteronomy, which recorded his own death and what happened afterward. Unfortunately, there are lots of Christians who do believe that, because someone told them so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueheron Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 i was just trying to get an idea of how and when the first book was writen,i know its bullshit,i want to know what other xtaians think,and would say.so... in other words,moses is responsable for all this crap?.. the orgin of this book is suppose to be from him? Oops! If I see posts about literal bible stuff, I get the wrong idea, I guess. Sorry Here is a link to some info on the authors of Genesis. http://www.religioustolerance.org/jepd_gen.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanda Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 who was the eye witness to the creation of the world?...there's a christain record of it (bible) so who was there to see and write the fist few vs. of the bible? Hello Black Gravity... Of course, I believe no one was a witness to the origins of the world! However, I've found it very interesting that it seems to me that the Bible supports evolution more than most presume. I'd be very interested in others opinions of this. It talks of a certain stage in evolution when something can no longer evolve into something else. As there is a point when an animal can not become another kind of animal, referring to reproducing "after its kind". "Kind" being defined as this: http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew...327&version=kjv I thought it quite interesting in Genesis 1:20And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven. that the creatures that the water brought forth were found in the definition of creatures found here: http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew...318&version=kjv And even more interesting is that they even speak of the time dinosaurs were here before man! Genesis 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good Where whales are defined as this: http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew...577&version=kjv Thanks to many of the convincing sane minds on this site, I have come to change my mind on many of my prior illusions on the Bible, yet with the understanding that this was written after the last ice-age, and near the beginning of stable civilizations from nomadic life... it seems their chronology of evolutionary events may not be too far off? I, in no way purpose the earth to be only 6,000 years old, nor Adam the first man on earth... Maybe the Bible was a way of collectively expressing their understandings of science, sociology, psychology, spirituality, and everything else we have come to more accurately define as its own separate disciplines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megistias Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 I think the Jews got their religion from Egypt and the Christians got their religion from the Egyptians and the Jews. That is why within the themes of the stories can be seen very similiar symbols such as the number 7, the cross and resurrection stories. Judaism seems heavily influenced by religions of Egypt and Babylonia. Christianity seems a mixture of messianic Judiasm and Mithraism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karissa Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 It was a story, probably passed down through oral tradition..and we all know what THAT does to a story. Also, it could be mixed with other religions' and cultures' stories as Noah and the flood is- there is the story of Gilgamesh that is exactly the same. Everyone that is interested in history of the Bible, pretty much unbiased and written by someone very smart who did his research, should check out Isaac Asimov's History of the Old and New Testament. It has helped me tremendously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megistias Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 "Kind" being defined as this: Kind, sometimes a species Groups of living organisms belong in the same created "kind" if they have descended from the same ancestral gene pool. This term "Kind" is not meaningful. It is understood that all mammals are descended from the same ancestral gene pool. That would make "Mammals" a kind. But Mammals and Reptiles have a common ancestor too ... so what's the term "Kind" representing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanda Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 This term "Kind" is not meaningful. It is understood that all mammals are descended from the same ancestral gene pool. That would make "Mammals" a kind. But Mammals and Reptiles have a common ancestor too ... so what's the term "Kind" representing ? Hello Megistias... OK, you may be right... although I was under the impression that it is saying that once there had been established a certain division amongst themselves, it had created a 'kind' that could not evolve into something else, nor interbreed. Example, reptiles and mammals have a common background, yet they have reached a division that no longer permits interbreeding. It does not preclude that they may still evolve into something further, yet a 'kind' or species is already established. (Yet, I have read where a fish seems to be mutating into an amphibian!) Whales use to be land mammals, yet became adaptive to just living in water, yet I don't think they are able to mutate into a fish now. This scriptural statement seems to recognize this... as well as a suggested evolution that all things evolved and came out of the water/oceans. Being written 6000 years ago, it seems they weren't that far behind Darwin, and at least ahead of the 'spontaneous generation' mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkepticOfBible Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I think the Jews got their religion from Egypt and the Christians got their religion from the Egyptians and the Jews. That is why within the themes of the stories can be seen very similiar symbols such as the number 7, the cross and resurrection stories. Incidently the number 7 is also considered auspicious under hinduism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanda Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Incidently the number 7 is also considered auspicious under hinduism Pritish, may I ask, what makes a number favorable or not, and why are meanings attached to numbers? Do you know what connotations 7 has been given in Hinduism? Do Egyptiians, Judaism, and Christians give it the same significance, of 'fullness and completion'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotBlinded Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Incidently the number 7 is also considered auspicious under hinduism Pritish, may I ask, what makes a number favorable or not, and why are meanings attached to numbers? Do you know what connotations 7 has been given in Hinduism? Do Egyptiians, Judaism, and Christians give it the same significance, of 'fullness and completion'? If you don't mind, I will interject a little of what I am discovering. The number seven has been discovered by mathematicians (over 100 years ago) to be common amongst all theologies. The mystery language that is at the root of all theologies contains seven dialects which refers to each of the seven mysteries of nature. This is one of the commonalities that exist between all religions (resurrection being another). Eqypt has lost many of the seven keys to the language, the jews only have two, but India is said to retain all seven keys. This language supposedly contains the understanding to the origins of life by explaining the creation through seven different levels. It's very interesting to me. There is a lot more to it, so I have provided the link below if you are interested (just type in 'seven' in find function and it will give many results). The Secret Doctrine Oh...and yes, I do believe they all give it significance, but India more than others being that they retain the knowledge. The Jews (therefore Christianity) has been distored since Moses never had more than two keys (if I understand correctly), therefore, the latter has only been made worse over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 That link looks amazing, sis... thanks for that. "There is no religion higher than Truth." Nice. As for the number Seven, it was also significant in Mithras - that was the numbe of initianion levels in the mystery cult. Great to see ya, hon. Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotBlinded Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 That link looks amazing, sis... thanks for that. "There is no religion higher than Truth." Nice. As for the number Seven, it was also significant in Mithras - that was the numbe of initianion levels in the mystery cult. Great to see ya, hon. Merlin Great to see you too sweetie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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