TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 From anyone as to WHY God created mankind. What was his need for us to be made? Why does he need our worship and praise? If it was HIS idea to make mankind to begin with, then why must man earn the right to Heaven? Why does God NEED anything? Naturally, I have found ZERO reasons WHY. Only the HOW of the deal. Not that even that is believable. I understand this being supposedly made man in his image. Doesn't say WHY he did so. Doesn't even say WHY he decided to create the cosmos. Still doesn't explain anywhere his purpose for ever making life in the first place. Let alone justify why such a powerful being would fight for our immortal souls to only have us come up to Heaven and permanently reside there acting like little praise machines for his ego. I think all these questions are avoided overall. They can't fill that part in with anything except ,"God has a divine plan for us." Or "God works in mysterious ways." I think they ought to cut the bullshit and just acknowledge this huge gaping hole in their belief system. Even other cultures do a better job of explaining why mankind was even desired to be created in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 The best I can tell, from what I have learned about the bible and just basically logical deduction. All a christian could really say is, he didn't need to create us, but wanted too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrotherJosh Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 It's a good question. Why would an omniscient being bring into existence a world of untold suffering and death? How someone could claim this being is benevolent is beyond me. Even without an understanding of evolution and basic history, one would wonder, "why do innocent people starve every day?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 I think if a God like YHWH did exist he would of created us as a need to extend himself almost and to acheive what he cannot based on his nature. If God by nature cannot commit sin yet we can this means we have more free will than God does, we would be a extension of his own desires. maby that is why he throws so many tantrums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wester Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Isn't why that old canard: "To have dominion or "rule over'" the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground. (like snails and Chevy Tahoe drivers)" ?? Or in other words: To alienate humans from nature and give the human monkeys the delusion that they are somehow beings separate from their living environment. Dominion means use up, waste, destroy, the natural world, enslave animals, fill them with GMOs butcher them and eat em and flush the waste. 98% of old growth forests are gone. 99% of prairies are gone, 90% of large fish in the oceans are gone, there is a giant pile of plastic floating in the pacific, as big as the country of Congo, 4 Japanese nuke plants are on critical life support, the ocean is being acidified with our carbon, the polar ice cap is nearly melted and temperatures are rising everywhere. That's one hell of a no holds barred "rule over" success story, eh? I'm bored. Can we go to the mall? What's on TV tonight? Will you drive up to the store and get me some beer? Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 The best I can tell, from what I have learned about the bible and just basically logical deduction. All a christian could really say is, he didn't need to create us, but wanted too. See, for me it still doesn't give a motive. Everyone wants something, 98% for an underlying reason. But it is one of those questions that will never be answered. Just another subjective opinion prompt lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 Isn't why that old canard: "To have dominion or "rule over'" the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground. (like snails and Chevy Tahoe drivers)" ?? Or in other words: To alienate humans from nature and give the human monkeys the delusion that they are somehow beings separate from their living environment. Dominion means use up, waste, destroy, the natural world, enslave animals, fill them with GMOs butcher them and eat em and flush the waste. 98% of old growth forests are gone. 99% of prairies are gone, 90% of large fish in the oceans are gone, there is a giant pile of plastic floating in the pacific, as big as the country of Congo, 4 Japanese nuke plants are on critical life support, the ocean is being acidified with our carbon, the polar ice cap is nearly melted and temperatures are rising everywhere. That's one hell of a no holds barred "rule over" success story, eh? I'm bored. Can we go to the mall? What's on TV tonight? Will you drive up to the store and get me some beer? Have a nice day. Still doesn't say WHY, motivation for such action. If religious folks had to actually figure ou the why behind it, I think they would find themselves empty handed. If they would actually get their head out of their asses and look at the scope of our little planet and souls compared to the cosmos, I would think their answer they have now would seem insignificant to the big picture of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted June 5, 2012 Super Moderator Share Posted June 5, 2012 We were told he needed ways to express his love. Whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 It's a good question. Why would an omniscient being bring into existence a world of untold suffering and death? How someone could claim this being is benevolent is beyond me. Even without an understanding of evolution and basic history, one would wonder, "why do innocent people starve every day?" What a frightening feeling it must be for them to imagine a god that doesn't care about them personally. The only explanation for their God if judging by how our world is today would be that we were created and left to fend for ourselves. That this "god" created us and walked away, and all the doctrine is just fairy tale to get people to follow certain agendas. That this "god" ultimately, is only given the title simply because it created our planet. Meaning, this " god" could simply be floating around seeding planets and is in no way even remotely intelligent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 We were told he needed ways to express his love. Whatever. That's hilarious! He was so repressed in the vastness of what they suppose was nothingness, for who knows how long, he finally burst with desire and made a planet with creatures to show love to, but to get his love, we had to show love first....sounds like they have a big hole in that line of thought too. He wouldn't need love from us first if he was bursting to just express it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 I think if a God like YHWH did exist he would of created us as a need to extend himself almost and to acheive what he cannot based on his nature. If God by nature cannot commit sin yet we can this means we have more free will than God does, we would be a extension of his own desires. maby that is why he throws so many tantrums. So he is living his desires vicariously through us, his children. Selfish, jealous, and vindictive type of behavior. You know, that fits with what is written about his behavior in the bible. The only problem is that he could and did extend himself to achieve what he couldn't based on his nature. Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam5 Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 This is what the websites gotquestions and catholic answers are for! To answer all the q's that the bible doesnt answer! Of course why the word of God NEEDS all these apologetics.. hmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VacuumFlux Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Isn't why that old canard: "To have dominion or "rule over'" the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground. (like snails and Chevy Tahoe drivers)" ?? Or in other words: To alienate humans from nature and give the human monkeys the delusion that they are somehow beings separate from their living environment. Dominion means use up, waste, destroy, the natural world, enslave animals, fill them with GMOs butcher them and eat em and flush the waste. 98% of old growth forests are gone. 99% of prairies are gone, 90% of large fish in the oceans are gone, there is a giant pile of plastic floating in the pacific, as big as the country of Congo, 4 Japanese nuke plants are on critical life support, the ocean is being acidified with our carbon, the polar ice cap is nearly melted and temperatures are rising everywhere. That's one hell of a no holds barred "rule over" success story, eh? I'm bored. Can we go to the mall? What's on TV tonight? Will you drive up to the store and get me some beer? Have a nice day. Still doesn't say WHY, motivation for such action. If religious folks had to actually figure ou the why behind it, I think they would find themselves empty handed. If they would actually get their head out of their asses and look at the scope of our little planet and souls compared to the cosmos, I would think their answer they have now would seem insignificant to the big picture of things. Well, god made angels, too, to do spiritual stuff and keep heaven running smoothly. He's just like a human king; can't run the kingdom without setting up a bureaucracy. So it's not that we're the crowning glory of god's creation centering on earth; we're made to be petty bureaucrats keeping the earth system functioning. It was never explained that way to me as a christian, but when I started reading some other Canaanite myths I was struck at some point by how it's very similar, yet polytheistic. After growing up with monotheism, I couldn't figure out how the concept of deity could work in the plural. Then I noticed that they're quite hierarchical and each job has a particular function. Deities then, are managers with specific jobs, and then they've got a higher level of deity to organize them... even the gods can't escape from attending committee meetings! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 This is what the websites gotquestions and catholic answers are for! To answer all the q's that the bible doesnt answer! Of course why the word of God NEEDS all these apologetics.. hmmm http://www.gotquestions.org/why-did-God-create-us.html So I went straight to the page and looked at their answer. They say "for God's pleasure." But there isn't nary a scripture remotely even implying that. Again, no one can give a straight answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ThereIsNoGod Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 God is without sin, because people WANT him to be without sin. They want there to be a perfect guardian of the Universe who they can count on for everything, provided they follow a set of rules. Even a God who is almost perfect would be totally disatisfactory for some. If God makes say one mistake per 100 years, what if the unlucky victim of his mistake this century is ME? Or someone I care about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 The bible DOES explain this quite explicitly: Genesis 2 5 In the day when the Lord God made earth and heaven there were no plants of the field on the earth, and no grass had come up: for the Lord God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no man to do work on the land. 6 But a mist went up from the earth, watering all the face of the land. 7 And the Lord God made man from the dust of the earth, breathing into him the breath of life: and man became a living soul. 8 And the Lord God made a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had made. 9 And out of the earth the Lord made every tree to come, delighting the eye and good for food; and in the middle of the garden, the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. 10 And a river went out of Eden giving water to the garden; and from there it was parted and became four streams. 11 The name of the first is Pishon, which goes round about all the land of Havilah where there is gold. 12 And the gold of that land is good: there is bdellium and the onyx stone. 13 And the name of the second river is Gihon: this river goes round all the land of Cush. 14 And the name of the third river is Tigris, which goes to the east of Assyria. And the fourth river is Euphrates. 15 And the Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to do work in it and take care of it. We are gardeners. That's it. mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 The bible DOES explain this quite explicitly: Genesis 2 5 In the day when the Lord God made earth and heaven there were no plants of the field on the earth, and no grass had come up: for the Lord God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no man to do work on the land. 6 But a mist went up from the earth, watering all the face of the land. 7 And the Lord God made man from the dust of the earth, breathing into him the breath of life: and man became a living soul. 8 And the Lord God made a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had made. 9 And out of the earth the Lord made every tree to come, delighting the eye and good for food; and in the middle of the garden, the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. 10 And a river went out of Eden giving water to the garden; and from there it was parted and became four streams. 11 The name of the first is Pishon, which goes round about all the land of Havilah where there is gold. 12 And the gold of that land is good: there is bdellium and the onyx stone. 13 And the name of the second river is Gihon: this river goes round all the land of Cush. 14 And the name of the third river is Tigris, which goes to the east of Assyria. And the fourth river is Euphrates. 15 And the Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to do work in it and take care of it. We are gardeners. That's it. mwc While I can see that line of thought, I have kids and put them outside to pull weeds. That doesn't mean I had kids to yank weeds.... :OP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akheia Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 My understanding is that farm families did at one point have kids to help on the farm. Maybe this is something similar. It's still pretty weird that God "needed" anybody to do anything. If he's the all-powerful omnipotent god, he doesn't need help. The loneliness angle doesn't work either, because he's supposed to be all-complete in and of himself, and causing all this suffering just to get some wubbies from his kiddies is sick. All around he just doesn't sound like a very compassionate or competent god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 My understanding is that farm families did at one point have kids to help on the farm. Maybe this is something similar. It's still pretty weird that God "needed" anybody to do anything. If he's the all-powerful omnipotent god, he doesn't need help. The loneliness angle doesn't work either, because he's supposed to be all-complete in and of himself, and causing all this suffering just to get some wubbies from his kiddies is sick. All around he just doesn't sound like a very compassionate or competent god. Yeah, the big gaping WHY to me, is what makes this house of cards crumble. Even zeus and osirus had reasons for man. There are ZERO reasons for our creation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 While I can see that line of thought, I have kids and put them outside to pull weeds. That doesn't mean I had kids to yank weeds.... :OP You may not have done this but I don't recall you asking why you had kids. Also, we're not god's kids. Man was initially created to tend garden. Who else was going to do it? Lobsters? mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 The best I can tell, from what I have learned about the bible and just basically logical deduction. All a christian could really say is, he didn't need to create us, but wanted too. See, for me it still doesn't give a motive. Everyone wants something, 98% for an underlying reason. But it is one of those questions that will never be answered. Just another subjective opinion prompt lol. Did the best I could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akheia Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 While I can see that line of thought, I have kids and put them outside to pull weeds. That doesn't mean I had kids to yank weeds.... :OP You may not have done this but I don't recall you asking why you had kids. Also, we're not god's kids. Man was initially created to tend garden. Who else was going to do it? Lobsters? mwc HEY. I've heard of Spongebob Squarepants. Don't try to fool me. If there were some logical explanation for why people got made, the religion might actually be tolerable. As it is, it can't even satisfactorily answer the most basic question of human existence. Seriously, most incompetent god ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBluegrassSkeptic Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 While I can see that line of thought, I have kids and put them outside to pull weeds. That doesn't mean I had kids to yank weeds.... :OP You may not have done this but I don't recall you asking why you had kids. Also, we're not god's kids. Man was initially created to tend garden. Who else was going to do it? Lobsters? mwc I had kids because I wanted to keep my family line going. You know, the whole mortal idea of keeping our essence going on the dna level. Bible won't even acknowledge that. :OP But servants we were inteded to be, well yes. Slave labor makes more sense than the bullshit "we are special " propoganda the church community vomits every sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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