Jose Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 and in the eight or so years that we've known each other (married six months), my atheism and her moderate christianity haven't really been an issue. However, now that she's struggling through this, I feel like I'm qualified to help her, but she thinks I have an ulterior motive in making sure she stays deconverted. Mind you that I honestly don't care what she believes because we don't really discuss it at home, but I'm not going to make a hard situation worse by inserting myself where I'm not wanted. I'm not sure where to point her since she won't come here (again, suspicion of an ulterior motive from me), so does anyone know of other resources for someone going through a deconversion? I suggested that she read the bible herself and talk to her pastor about her doubts and the reasons she's having them (hehehe... because THAT will work, lol). As an aside, her doubts started when she began tapping me as a bible resource since I know it better than most of her christian friends. She never really read the bible and had no idea what was in it. There's nothing like finding out that you accidentally skipped to the bottom of the Terms of Service and clicked, "I AGREE" without reading it... only to find out that you just signed on for a divisive, misogynistic, hate-filled program that you not only don't need, but wouldn't take for free... much less for the terribly steep cost of a religious life. Any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 2, 2012 Share Posted October 2, 2012 Do like my husband (an atheist) did when I went through my deconversion: just let her come to her own conclusions in her own time. He didn't point me to any resources - I sought them out myself (library/internet). Of course, having never been religious, my husband wouldn't have known of any resources anyway. Must be nice to have a mind that has never been troubled by religion *sigh* Be patient with her! Deconversion is a messy, drawn out process for most of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted October 2, 2012 Super Moderator Share Posted October 2, 2012 "Honey, Dearest, Sweetest, should any questions arise, perhaps I could get you a helpful book on the subject. This is YOUR journey, after all." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator TrueFreedom Posted October 2, 2012 Moderator Share Posted October 2, 2012 http://www.freeratio.org/ http://www.infidels.org/library/ http://www.youtube.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I would just encourage her to seek out her own resources, pointing out that it is a good idea to get opinions and ideas from all sides and not just from an atheist site or Christian site. Maybe you could buy her a book or two, but she might take that as a personal attack. She seems to be at a very precarious point in deconversion, the stage where one goes back and forth as each new idea is either synthesized into her world view or rejected. It will take time, as it did for most of us, to make that final leap. Sounds like you've done an awesome job already of being supportive, so apart from emphasizing not to expect too much too early in the process, continue on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenstar Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Just tell her you will support her no matter what, and you are there for her. (she won't feel you are judging her but are a loving support and you accept her as she is even if she remains a believer). Encourage free thought... if the opportunity comes up (she mentions something) tell her you know she can figure it out (show you have confidence in her ability to think for herself) and that there are plenty of resources available. (google is your friend) Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 Interesting sidenote to this... She's having minor surgery this morning, but still being put under general anaesthesia. She's never been knocked out before and asked me what it's like. Here is our conversation pretty much verbatim... "So, what's it like being under?" "It's like a whole bunch of nothing and then you're cold when you wake up." "What do you mean 'nothing'? It feels like sleeping?" "No. When you sleep, you still have a fleeting sense of time passing. General anaesthetic is like being dead." "Being dead?" "Yeah, you're basically dead. The only shitty part is coming out of it." "So, I should pay attention to what it's like being under?" "You won't be able to. Your conscious mind won't be working at all. You can't pay attention or remember anything without consciousness." "But I'll still be alive." "Right, but you'll have no consciousness so you'll be unable to 'experience' anything about being unconscious." "That's weird. So you think that's what happens when you die?" "Yep." "Except you don't wake up?" "Right." "I don't know whether to keep being scared or to start getting excited." "Whatever. You want some of these carrots before I eat them all?" "I'm having a breakthrough on my fear of death here and you're offering me carrots?" "Yeah." "You dick." "Yeah." I'm so empathic. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeasabird Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Sounds like this is happening pretty quick for her. Either she's had a lot of stuff pent up for a while or she's just really good at easily letting go. Either way, it's nice she seems to be dealing very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 Well, she's gotten to hear me debate hundred of fundies and sit there calmly while they were reduced to spittle-flinging condemnations, so there's not many arguments for or against christianity that she hasn't heard several dozen times. I think she's pretty much lost her faith in biblegod at this point, but is still looking for validation that what she is feeling is correct. I can understand wanting to know that other people have gone through the same thing you're going through. She was a moderate, sort of wishy-washy, feel-good christian in the first place, I think the major problem she has with letting go completely is the notion of an afterlife and some of her "I'm special and Jesus loves me!" feelings. I understand the fear of non-existence pretty well... the "somebody loves me and is watching over me" thing never really appealed to me in the first place. I kept thinking they were watching me poop. With any luck, she'll take it upon herself to explore, research, and find like-minded people. After reading the posts on this thread and thinking about it overnight, it's probably for the best that I just stay out of it unless she wants to talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryper Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Suggest the Prplfx, and Evid3nc3 on youtube. Prplfx is a member here too. It might help to understand what others went through. From what I remember at one point in his deconversion Prplfx was close to suicide. As long as she is not going that route, you're best bet seems to be answer the questions as they come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 Part of my "support" for her is letting her take the Xanax I had left over from when I decided, "THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE ADDICTION... AND IT'S SMOKING!" several months ago. I found "exit bags" in her browser history a few weeks back. I didn't confront her, just let her know, "Sometimes numb is good if you're going through some badness. Here's a couple of xanax." I was doling them out as needed, but she stopped asking for them a couple of days ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 What are exit bags? Can I have some Xanax? Just kidding. Too much numbness is a bad thing, and life is easier to cope with in the long run when one confronts mental issues and anxieties head on. Things get resolved rather than just pushed off to a later date, only to come up later and more traumatically from all the repression. That has been my experience, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 K... just looked up exit bag, and it means what I thought i did. I suggest you encourage her to see a therapist. Suicidal feelings are no joke, and they might be able to help her resolve the feelings she is dealing with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryper Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Exit bags. Bags packed with the essentials so that a quick exit can be made from a situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I read up on them a little... seems they often fail as a method of suicide. I had no idea there was a whole internet subculture devoted to suicide methods. I am very disturbed now, and a little depressed. I have a plan if I ever get some non-curable cancer or other chronic disease, but I digress. I hope the OP and his wife get through this difficult season unscathed. I really feel for her as I recall being somewhat suicidal when I lost my sense of purpose too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akheia Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Jose, please mention her potential suicidal ideation to her doctor and get her some help. With that added info about her search, her conversation about not knowing if she should feel scared or excited takes on a new urgency. It can be really hard to have doubts about something like one's entire metaphysical outlook and I'm concerned for her. FWIW, I'd also say let her find stuff on her own and just offer to be there as a sounding-board if she needs it. If you get too involved, later on she may end up resenting you or feeling like she made a bad decision. Hopefully her surgery went great and she's at home resting up now with a wonderful husband to take care of her Good luck to you both. (BTW: you look exactly like a guy I used to game online with like 10 years ago, if that's you in the profile pic.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted October 5, 2012 Author Share Posted October 5, 2012 Yes, that is me. Were you on Players of Darkness, Akheia? RE: the Wife and her exit bags - I emailed her doctor on the sly and let him know what she's been Googling. I'm not sure what her feelings were based on, but I got an email from him letting me know that he broached the subject and spoke with her a bit about it. He recommended a good therapist and she's made an appointment already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akheia Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 No, it was a text mud I'm really glad to hear she's getting some help. Seeing that on a loved one's search window would have scared the pee-water out of me. Thank you for taking steps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foolish girl Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I didn't even tell anyone when it was happening to me. I didn't want to be pushed or pulled. Just wanted to know that I had thought it through, read it through and had an honest experience. She can do it, just be there for her and occassionally share stuff with her. Once a week or so, throw a non-stam collector her way, or something. Btw. *Jealous* I wish more than anything that my husband would change his mind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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