Adam5 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Having spent years as a Christian I guess I should know this already? But have been thinking "what is God?" Both from a Christian and ex-Christian perspective. What are Christians supposed to think... God the big I AM. Whatever that means? I mean, do these guys actually have a decent answer for what they believe in? Or just meaningless waffle. From an ex-C perspective, I guess God is an imaginary being. An alter-ego. Assign some emotions like love and peace to this self-creation, then pray to our imaginary friend call him Father, or Jesus. When I think about it rationally I have had a crazy few years as a hard core believer. (shakes head) Your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeasabird Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 God is a bowl, but only the idea of a bowl. Once people accept the bowl exists they begin to fill it with what they want to see inside it. Most people fill it with themselves. The more of themselves goes into it, the less likely they are to throw it away. The less someone puts in the bowl, the easier it is to discard when the bowl develops cracks. The more someone puts into it, the harder they work to patch the cracks and save what is in the bowl. If they ever do discard the bowl, the less remains of their former self; you cannot throw away a bowl without also discarding it's contents. Some people look at this as a loss; others treat it as a new beginning, to fill other bowls, or to choose not to fill any. I feel sadness for those whose bowls are full of hatred, and also for those whose bowl is full of goodness. The former is obvious, but for the latter I'm sad they don't recognize the good as simply themselves. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam5 Posted October 8, 2012 Author Share Posted October 8, 2012 The more someone puts into it, the harder they work to patch the cracks and save what is in the bowl. I like the bowl analogy. Its a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Well, I know without a doubt that syntactically "god" is a noun. And I only dimly suspect that semantically, it is a word which points to everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddbird1963 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 God is a projection. There is the symbolic, mythological narrative about a god, gods. These are like the objects written in some programming language. Each individual instantiates that cultural idea about god and alters it slightly to suit their own personal needs and understanding. This instantiated "god" is a projection of peoples fears, hopes and dream onto a external but virtual entity. It's like building your own game character in a computer game and then pleading to that character for food, clothing, a mate, money and inner peace. If a person is imaginative with a sophisicated vocabulary, their god-character-instantiated object is elaborate and in many ways beautiful. If they are less imaginative and more literalistic or linear thinking, the god they construct is less sophisticated and less beautiful. Anyway, God is the result of people's instinctive, primal need to assign agency to effects for which they cannot immediately discern a cause. One of the greatest political and economic struggles has been to control people by directing their construction of a god-character in such a way that they prop up the state , the religious institution or the tribal culture. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 The definition of God tends to be very personal, and it changes over time too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 God is a reflection. mwc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 The real question to begin with, is what isn't god? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev R Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 "Babylon 5: Meditations on the Abyss (#5.14)" (1998) G'Kar: If I take a lamp and shine it toward the wall, a bright spot will appear on the wall. The lamp is our search for truth, for understanding. Too often we assume that the light on the wall is God. But the light is not the goal of the search; it is the result of the search. The more intense the search, the brighter the light on the wall. The brighter the light on the wall, the greater the sense of revelation upon seeing it! Similarly, someone who does not search, who does not bring a lantern with him, sees nothing. What we perceive as God, is the byproduct of our search for God. It may simply be an appreciation of the light, pure and unblemished, not understanding that it comes from us. Sometimes we stand in front of the light and assume that we are the center of the universe. God looks astonishingly like we do! Or we turn to look at our shadow, and assume that all is darkness. If we allow ourselves to get in the way, we defeat the purpose; which is to use the light of our search to illuminate the wall in all its beauty - and in all its flaws. And in so doing better understand the world around us. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Rev, I remember that from the show. Such a great show. And a good quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev R Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Rev, I remember that from the show. Such a great show. And a good quote. Pops in my head every time I hear or read such questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 God is a bowl, but only the idea of a bowl. Once people accept the bowl exists they begin to fill it with what they want to see inside it. Most people fill it with themselves. The more of themselves goes into it, the less likely they are to throw it away. The less someone puts in the bowl, the easier it is to discard when the bowl develops cracks. The more someone puts into it, the harder they work to patch the cracks and save what is in the bowl. If they ever do discard the bowl, the less remains of their former self; you cannot throw away a bowl without also discarding it's contents. Some people look at this as a loss; others treat it as a new beginning, to fill other bowls, or to choose not to fill any. I feel sadness for those whose bowls are full of hatred, and also for those whose bowl is full of goodness. The former is obvious, but for the latter I'm sad they don't recognize the good as simply themselves. Brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlerman Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 God is a bowl, but only the idea of a bowl. Once people accept the bowl exists they begin to fill it with what they want to see inside it. Most people fill it with themselves. The more of themselves goes into it, the less likely they are to throw it away. The less someone puts in the bowl, the easier it is to discard when the bowl develops cracks. The more someone puts into it, the harder they work to patch the cracks and save what is in the bowl. If they ever do discard the bowl, the less remains of their former self; you cannot throw away a bowl without also discarding it's contents. Some people look at this as a loss; others treat it as a new beginning, to fill other bowls, or to choose not to fill any. I feel sadness for those whose bowls are full of hatred, and also for those whose bowl is full of goodness. The former is obvious, but for the latter I'm sad they don't recognize the good as simply themselves. This is very good. But I'll add a layer to it I think may help. God is an experience. Those that have such an experience inspire others, who take that person's experience, make it theirs though a certain spark of inspiration, then fill it as your bowl analogy shows. It is not the direct experience itself however. Soon, it is that bowl that people fill and others adopt because of it's power, and which is then argued as to truth or not-truth, wars and battles fought in its name, believers and non-believers. But when one experiences what that first person did, all these bowls are seen for what they are - religions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunaticheathen Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 From an ex-C perspective, I guess God is an imaginary being. Ex-C theist here. Polytheist. My belief is God is One and Many and wibbly-wobbly. But I'm not sure you really want to know. I'm sure some here think it's "imaginary nonsense", but whatever. Ex-C theists are a rare breed, hence the assumption none of us ever have gods. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam5 Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 But I'm not sure you really want to know. I'm sure some here think it's "imaginary nonsense", but whatever. Ex-C theists are a rare breed, hence the assumption none of us ever have gods. No its good to see diverse opinions here. It would be boring if we all belived in the same stuff. Out of interest, what evidence do we have for the existence of gods outside of our minds. Have you had a supernatural experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunaticheathen Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 If a "supernatural" experience is what you call evidence, yes, I've had a lot. Lots of personal experiences, several shared ones. But it's kind of normal for me, since I've seen dead relatives since I was a child. Don't expect empirical evidence out of me, and I won't play that game. Mostly because I don't care what others believe, and I can't be fucked to dissect my beliefs for those who would just call me crazy. I've had that happen, and it's tiring. I have many beliefs from my own experience, some shared with the systems of Kemetic Orthodoxy and Vodou (because they either make sense, or experience proved them to me). Like ancestor veneration makes sense because of the dead relatives hanging about. For example, I communicate with my ancestors slightly more than the gods because they're accessible AND they've actually been human, so are more "on the ground" than a deity would be, who wouldn't have personal experience. Mine in particular also don't play that riddle game like some gods - my family has always been blunt, well, like me. Particulars about so-called "supernatural" would cause me to write a book, and I have to see the doctor tomorrow. So, another time, if this isn't enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam5 Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 But it's kind of normal for me, since I've seen dead relatives since I was a child. Personally I'd say thats not normal. If I may talk about one of my own supernatural experiences. I once thought I saw a ghost. At the time I really believed I was seeing the ghost. I was at the point of waking up in the middle of the night, when I had this vision. Now looking back, I think this was a hallucination between dreaming and waking. How do we know if we see a spirit, angel, or ghost? Is this physically real or simply our imagination. Seeing and hearing things that dont really exist. People claimed in the past to have had visions of God and angels and to have received revelations either through hearing voices or having the knowledge directly imparted into their brains. Today we would say these people are delusional and probably suffering from forms of illness. That to me seems likely. Do you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunaticheathen Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 No, not necessarily. I don't think visions always = delusions. That's simple-minded, imo. It reduces a huge portion of varied human experience to schizophrenia. That's the opposite end, the other narrow viewpoint opposite from "goddidit." No better than the goddidit crowd, really. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Visions aren't necessarily hallucinations, they can be visual in another sense. So its not necessarily a sign of schizophrenia, it all depends on whether you literally are seeing you're dead relatives walking around in broad daylight. If so, something is wrong. I don't think that's what LunaticHeathen is talking about. LunaticHeathen, I've had interesting experiences as a pagan. I remember not quite being asleep when I realized I couldn't move, and then I felt a hand rubbing with her finger the top of my left hand (because of the side of the room she was on, this is descriptive not symbolic), and slowly I got up and stared her in the eye. The woman had on a veil (it was niqablike, and blue, and had green flowery/leafy designs on it). She had striking eyes that made me feel filled with energy. I remember her saying something to me, and later that her name was ninmesara. Guess what I later learned about when I was searching for a new path? about 1-2 years later, I was learning about Babylonian paganism, and I took a particular interest in Ishtar. What's weird about Ishtar, is that one of her names is Ninmesarra, which is Lady of all the Divine Power, basically. Also, alot of her symbolism had followed me in dreams since I was a small small child. Lions (they were more like protectors, but probably had more to do with the LionKing and my first sad dream I remember, than it does Ishtar), Owls, and the symbol of the scorpion. There was also the great bright star in our sky, the moon (more a symbol of her father than her). It's weird, its a spiritual experience I had when I was younger I still can't explain. I was having those "I'm awake but I can't move" moments alot at the time though, as a drug reaction to Abilify. It was weird, how such an unfamiliar name, could've appeared in my dream? Just to learn about it later. Makes me wonder still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wester Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 God is the vacuum created by quantum fluctuation. Or maybe God is the cute Korean girl who smiled at me when I was crossing the street. Or maybe God is simply the word that stands for "All the gank we aint done figured out yet" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 God is the Higgs field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 God is the vacuum created by quantum fluctuation. Or maybe God is the cute Korean girl who smiled at me when I was crossing the street. Or maybe God is simply the word that stands for "All the gank we aint done figured out yet" Or maybe God is the sumtotal of existence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilith666 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 God is the big guy in the sky who created the world, but forgot about us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 God is dog spelled backwards. Nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I believe in God now guys... Switch me to True Believer status! He's this really hot guy I just saw. I'd love for him to come save me! XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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