Glorified Bodies After Death

[roadrunner]

Jesus said 'Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from the: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire'

This would imply that at death your soul has the same members as your earthly body had.

 

Before you go saying I'm taking it out of context remember that Jesus supposedly had nail prints in his hands after the resurrection.

 

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

[florduh]

Good question that points out the difficulty in making the Bible a coherent work.

 

To answer the question, I suppose Benny Hinn and Ernest Angley had better be in Heaven.

[Denyoz]

It also implies that your hand has a will of its own, perhaps it's own brain.  Bad hand!  Come here, I'll cut you off.  With my other hand.  Now the second hand has committed murder.  Cut that one off too, with my foot.  On and on.  Might as well throw myself into a shredder.  I wonder how that would look in Heaven.

[mwc]

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

     What exactly is going on in this heaven of yours where people are being mutilated?  Yikes.

 

          mwc

[centauri]

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

I'm assuming your asking what happens to the bodies of the mutilated once they get to heaven.

Jesus was supposed to have said he would raise all up on the last day, which implies they would be in their graves (in stasis) and he would wake them at his return (John 5:28-29, John 6:40).

Naturally, this conflicts with those believers that insist dead spirits go to heaven immediately after death, which shows the crazy quilt of doctrine that can be created depending on what one prefers to believe.

Do dead children get raised as adults or do they stay children?

I'm not at all sure about that one.

Do the mutilated stay that way? 

I would think not, for Jesus promised to make all things new (Rev 21:5).

[Joshpantera]

This problem of souls going to heaven at death and the contradiction of a bodily resurrection of the dead @ the second coming is what led to SDA's crafting the apologetic doctrine of "soul sleep." The idea is that when you die you rest in the ground completely unconscious awaiting the second coming. And of course all other Christians who believe otherwise are to be seen as foolish idiots deceived by the devil. 

 

lol

[roadrunner]

 

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

I'm assuming your asking what happens to the bodies of the mutilated once they get to heaven.

Jesus was supposed to have said he would raise all up on the last day, which implies they would be in their graves (in stasis) and he would wake them at his return (John 5:28-29, John 6:40).

Naturally, this conflicts with those believers that insist dead spirits go to heaven immediately after death, which shows the crazy quilt of doctrine that can be created depending on what one prefers to believe.

Do dead children get raised as adults or do they stay children?

I'm not at all sure about that one.

Do the mutilated stay that way? 

I would think not, for Jesus promised to make all things new (Rev 21:5).

So Jesus will make all things new but can't afford to spackle up the divots in his hands with a glorified body. My point was that if wounds carry over to the afterlife what about when you have more than just a nail print. A scarred up hand has not exactly been made new in my opinion. So we can only speculate what shabby work would be cobbled together for those that were maimed. 

 

Also you've touched on a question I have always wondered. Why did we need bodies when Jesus comes back if we already have a spirit. I see why certain religions preach that you go into the dirt until Jesus comes back since scripture threw itself a paradox.

[centauri]

So Jesus will make all things new but can't afford to spackle up the divots in his hands with a glorified body. My point was that if wounds carry over to the afterlife what about when you have more than just a nail print. A scarred up hand has not exactly been made new in my opinion. So we can only speculate what shabby work would be cobbled together for those that were maimed. 

Do the mutilated stay that way? 

I would think not, for Jesus promised to make all things new (Rev 21:5).

 

Also you've touched on a question I have always wondered. Why did we need bodies when Jesus comes back if we already have a spirit. I see why certain religions preach that you go into the dirt until Jesus comes back since scripture threw itself a paradox.

Jesus had not yet ascended when his wounds were evident after the resurrection.

I suspect an apologist would say that he was fully healed once he had ascended.

[Guest r3alchild]

If I go apologist here, I would say that jesus is saying your better off getting into heaven while maiming yourself to remove sin on earth, not that you would be maimed in heaven.

[bornagainathiest]

 

So Jesus will make all things new but can't afford to spackle up the divots in his hands with a glorified body. My point was that if wounds carry over to the afterlife what about when you have more than just a nail print. A scarred up hand has not exactly been made new in my opinion. So we can only speculate what shabby work would be cobbled together for those that were maimed. 

Do the mutilated stay that way? 

I would think not, for Jesus promised to make all things new (Rev 21:5).

 

Also you've touched on a question I have always wondered. Why did we need bodies when Jesus comes back if we already have a spirit. I see why certain religions preach that you go into the dirt until Jesus comes back since scripture threw itself a paradox.

Jesus had not yet ascended when his wounds were evident after the resurrection.

I suspect an apologist would say that he was fully healed once he had ascended.

 

And the healing process also endowed him (her?) with breasts, as in Revelation 1:13...?

 

http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/56123-is-jesus-the-anti-christ/page-4

 

See # 45 & # 65.

[HymenaeusAlexander]

Jesus said 'Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from the: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire'

This would imply that at death your soul has the same members as your earthly body had.

 

Not necessarily. Perhaps you enter into life maimed, but you don’t stay that way. I enter into Six Flags without a headache and without being stinky, sweaty and miserable. I don’t stay that way upon entry.

 

Before you go saying I'm taking it out of context remember that Jesus supposedly had nail prints in his hands after the resurrection.

 

[preacher voice] His scars are the only ones and stand as an eternal reminder of the price he paid for the redeemed. Hallelujah! [/preacher voice].

 

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

 

God doesn't heal amputees on earth, so maybe he's saving that one for the grand finale?

 

How about this question: What happens to embryos who never even had a conscious existence, much less a fully functioning body?

[Thackerie]

It also implies that your hand has a will of its own, perhaps it's own brain.  Bad hand!  Come here, I'll cut you off.  With my other hand.  Now the second hand has committed murder.  Cut that one off too, with my foot.  On and on.  Might as well throw myself into a shredder.  I wonder how that would look in Heaven.

 

Actually, there is such a thing.

 

Alien hand syndrome, sometimes used synonymously with anarchic hand or Dr Strangelove syndrome, is a neurological disorder in which the afflicted person's hand appears to take on a mind of its own.

 

Read more on Wiki.

[Geezer]

And what happens to an aborted fetus? What kind of body will they have.......or to someone whose body was completely destroyed by fire or an explosion? Will the redeemed have youthful looking bodies or bodies of the aged? They, of course, will all have spiritual bodies or possibly a disembodied spiritual presence.....or more likely when we die we simply cease to exist and our body disintegrates and we only continue to exist in the minds of those who once knew and loved us and eventually all memory of our existence ceases.

[Deva]

All this trouble about bodies shows that Christianity is hopelessly tied into materialism, whether Christians like it or not.

 

Its very hard to imagine what a disembodied spirit would look like.

 

If its necessary to have a body of some type, wouldn't reincarnation make more sense?

[centauri]

And the healing process also endowed him (her?) with breasts, as in Revelation 1:13...?

 

http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/56123-is-jesus-the-anti-christ/page-4

 

See # 45 & # 65.

Well, with God all things are supposed to be possible, so Jesus could be a shape shifter.

[roadrunner]

Actually, there is such a thing.

 

Alien hand syndrome, sometimes used synonymously with anarchic hand or Dr Strangelove syndrome, is a neurological disorder in which the afflicted person's hand appears to take on a mind of its own.

 

Read more on Wiki.

Theres the proof we needed to prove that the primitive societies were speaking from god. that syndrome wasn't a diagnosis until the 20th century. TAKE THAT ATHEISTS

 

 

How about this question: What happens to embryos who never even had a conscious existence, much less a fully functioning body?

or what about the hundreds of thousands of eggs in a womans body that were never fertilized? 

[boftx]

or what about the hundreds of thousands of eggs in a womans body that were never fertilized? 

 

Caviar anyone?

[duderonomy]

 

So Jesus will make all things new but can't afford to spackle up the divots in his hands with a glorified body. My point was that if wounds carry over to the afterlife what about when you have more than just a nail print. A scarred up hand has not exactly been made new in my opinion. So we can only speculate what shabby work would be cobbled together for those that were maimed. 

Do the mutilated stay that way? 

I would think not, for Jesus promised to make all things new (Rev 21:5).

 

Also you've touched on a question I have always wondered. Why did we need bodies when Jesus comes back if we already have a spirit. I see why certain religions preach that you go into the dirt until Jesus comes back since scripture threw itself a paradox.

Jesus had not yet ascended when his wounds were evident after the resurrection.

I suspect an apologist would say that he was fully healed once he had ascended.

 

centauri, Jesus must have ascended between his resurrection, when he wouldn't let (whichever) Mary touch him because he hadn't yet ascended to his Father, and when he appeared later and let, or better invited, Thomas to touch his wounds.

 

Just throwing in my two cents.

[centauri]

centauri, Jesus must have ascended between his resurrection, when he wouldn't let (whichever) Mary touch him because he hadn't yet ascended to his Father, and when he appeared later and let, or better invited, Thomas to touch his wounds.

 

Just throwing in my two cents.

Well, that's certainly a vaild point, and if correct (that Jesus ascended prior to Thomas seeing him) it creates a conflict with Acts 1:1-3, which states that Jesus appeared to the disciples for a period of 40 days and was then taken up to heaven.

Then it (Acts 1:9-11) says that Jesus was taken up to heaven in front of the disciples and they were told he would return in the same manner (on clouds).

So it comes down to the question if Jesus had multiple ascensions, going back and forth between heaven and earth.

I've heard apologists argue both ways, they can't agree.

I tend the support the argument that he did not ascend and descend multiple times but only once as Acts seems to indicate.

The apologetic can also be given that Thomas did not actually touch Jesus but only put his finger in the hole(s).

[Joshpantera]

But of course Acts was obviously created to try and blend the Gospels into the Epistles. So I'd wonder why the writer took the angle that he did. Why would the author of Acts decide to take that direction unless there was possibly some conflict about multiple ascensions?

 

I'm not exactly sure why, but in my mind I seem to remember being told that Jesus descended and then ascended to the father all around the same short time,  after which he appeared to the disciples and stayed around for a while, and then went up to heaven until the second coming, which he will then go away again for 1,000 years and then return, again, and then send death, the grave, the Dragon, Beast, and False Prophet into the lake of burning sulfur and then send down the New Jerusalem and existence goes on eternally.

 

I may have to look back at scripture to see why I remember being taught that way as a child. But then again that was a long time ago and I may be remembering it wrong, or some of it wrong. Was any one else taught something along these lines? 

[centauri]

I think Acts 1 was an example of more information being tacked on to increase the selling value of the story presented in Luke, which has Jesus departing for heaven in short order, not sticking around for 40 days.

Acts then adds those extra days, thereby adding more "proof" for the reader.

 

Acts 1:1-3

The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach,

Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:

 

Interestingly, Acts also stipulates that Jesus never appeared to the public but only to cult members (Acts 10:40-41).

That's rather convenient because nobody outside the cult can validate any of the story of Jesus appearing after he was dead.

 

I don't see much evidence for multiple ascension, but only one ascension after he rose from the dead.

I remember being taught that Jesus descended to hell while in the grave, but that's not ascension, it's a detour.

If I remember correctly, Catholic doctrine also teaches this via the Athanasian Creed:

 

 ...Who suffered for our salvation, descended into hell, rose again the third day from the dead; 

 He ascended into heaven, He sits on the right hand of the Father, God, Almighty;

  

[roadrunner]

also he swung by the USA on the way up....

 

I never thought it would be this much fun debate about something that never happened. LOL

[duderonomy]

Jesus said 'Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from the: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire'

This would imply that at death your soul has the same members as your earthly body had.

 

Before you go saying I'm taking it out of context remember that Jesus supposedly had nail prints in his hands after the resurrection.

 

QUESTION: So what happens to crippled people, amputees, or people whose bodies have been mutilated in heaven?  

 

Wait, what?  Of course no one's bodies have been mutilated in heaven.