Let's get the facts: Poll for Megistias

[Open_Minded]

Yesterday I challenged Megistias to do a little poll. He seemed to feel we needed more objective information in our discussion the cost of American healthcare and higher education.

 

Since he hasn't taken up the challenge, I thought I'd throw one together.

 

Admittedly this doesn't even begin to cover all the issues around the costs of higher education and health care coverage.

 

Feel free to add your thoughts about these aspects of living in the United States.

 

One side note. I am grateful for America. In this country I have been able to pursue my dreams and have realized many of them. But, every generation has the responsibility to leave the world a better place for following generations. I really question whether our generation is living up to this responsibility - not only in areas of economy and healthcare - but other areas as well.

 

We are not a very compassionate nation right now and this plays out in many ways. Lack of compassion can be seen in our policies regarding:

 

* Healthcare in general - particularly the young and the elderly.

* Limited financial access to post highschool education.

* The environment.

* International relationships and the global economy.

* The increasing divide between rich and poor in this country.

* The increasing diversity of our population - not only racial - but religious and life style diversity as well.

 

I was raised by liberal parents during the 60s and taught from a very early age that patriotism means speaking out when you feel those in power are using government power to hurt rather than help. It is possible to speak out because we love America. If all who feel our nation is heading in the wrong direction spoke out and acted out - in productive ways - than many of our problems could be solved.

 

Getting down of the soapbox now

 

And looking forward to the poll results and corresponding comments.

[Chad3232132]

Yesterday I challenged Megistias to do a little poll. He seemed to feel we needed more objective information in our discussion the cost of American healthcare and higher education.

 

Since he hasn't taken up the challenge, I thought I'd throw one together.

 

Admittedly this doesn't even begin to cover all the issues around the costs of higher education and health care coverage.

 

Feel free to add your thoughts about these aspects of living in the United States.

 

One side note. I am grateful for America. In this country I have been able to pursue my dreams and have realized many of them. But, every generation has the responsibility to leave the world a better place for following generations. I really question whether our generation is living up to this responsibility - not only in areas of economy and healthcare - but other areas as well.

 

We are not a very compassionate nation right now and this plays out in many ways. Lack of compassion can be seen in our policies regarding:

 

* Healthcare in general - particularly the young and the elderly.

* Limited financial access to post highschool education.

* The environment.

* International relationships and the global economy.

* The increasing divide between rich and poor in this country.

* The increasing diversity of our population - not only racial - but religious and life style diversity as well.

 

I was raised by liberal parents during the 60s and taught from a very early age that patriotism means speaking out when you feel those in power are using government power to hurt rather than help. It is possible to speak out because we love America. If all who feel our nation is heading in the wrong direction spoke out and acted out - in productive ways - than many of our problems could be solved.

 

Getting down of the soapbox now

 

And looking forward to the poll results and corresponding comments.

 

 

I don't think he even lives in the same America the rest of us live in, he lives in an alternate reality. I'll call it Megistaworld.

 

And my oll choics by the way were:

 

* College costing more today than 20 years ago- and SIGNIFICANTLY more at that.

* Work fulltime wih no health benefits- although I will have benefits after I finish 3 months on the job which will be soon.

* My debt upon graduaition earlier this year was roughly $13,000. The only reason it was so low was because I had a scholarship paying about half of tuition and worked part-time while going. Also I went to a state university with low tuition.

 

And to my credit I did all this through hard work and didn't get in due to affirmative action (daddy's last name) like President Bush! <Insert self high-5>

 

That being said I still support a national healthcare system despite the fact that I will soon have benefits at a rate reasonable compared to the national average.

[BlueGiant]

You forgot a major insurance option that people take. It is possible to privately hold health insurance coverage, and it does happen. Employers are not the only ones that health insurance is purchaced through.

[Chad3232132]

You forgot a major insurance option that people take. It is possible to privately hold health insurance coverage, and it does happen. Employers are not the only ones that health insurance is purchaced through.

 

 

Possible... but very tough to get unless you are a wealthy retired millionaire.

 

It's also possible to get healthcare insurance while in college. Most college offer plans, though almost no college students can afford it. Just bare-bones coverage at my college was about $3,000 per year.

[Open_Minded]

You forgot a major insurance option that people take. It is possible to privately hold health insurance coverage, and it does happen. Employers are not the only ones that health insurance is purchaced through.

 

You are right, BlueGiant.

 

Sorry, I completely forgot about this option. Truth be told, I probably forgot about a lot of other options as well. So, I'll apologize in advance for leaving out other ways of obtaining healthcare - or obtaining a post highschool education.

 

Feel free to add anything I neglected - it's good to get the information and learn

[Lizard]

I had some college, but not related to the field I'm in now. It was community college, no debt, pell grants covered it all.

 

Health insurance through employer, spouse covered, children are not, though at this time we don't "fully" have dependants to add. Probably couldn't afford it anyway. Currently pay around $300 a month, but I don't work every month so its for about 9 months. HMO coverage, and its a pretty good plan except for the need for those referrals to specialists which can be a pain in the ass and take a while.

 

They did fully cover the angioplasty my spouse needed..and the 5 stints, at a cost of $63,000. I can't imagine having to pay that! I know most people who have no insurance here where I am, go through the county system and generally just don't pay. Of course, you have to be really desperate to go that route. I've heard nightmare stories of people spending days in the waiting room of the ER. They actually bring you sandwiches and drinks after 12 hours.

 

We do live in an area where the cost of living is pretty low. We also have no credit card debt (well..no credit cards) and no car payments. We drive old cars, ranging in age from 10 to 31 years old. Of course, the only way we can maintain that is that my husband is a mechanic and can keep them running. Had he been a professional businessman or something like that, we'd have had to buy new vehicles long ago.

 

We don't do without, but we do live simply. Vacations usually consist of travelling in a minimotor home. (Gained by barter, for mechanical work on a truck)

 

I see how others live though, week to week never getting ahead. It does take hard work, but sometimes that's just not enough.

 

Another thing to consider too, is that not everyone can be a rich business type person. Can you imagine? No one to work at the store where you buy your stuff, no one to wait on you when you stop for your morning coffee and donut at the gas station? No one at the fast food restaurant that you stop at to pick up dinner on your hurried way home?

 

And those people who work at those places..they cannot hope to "get ahead" by working there. Its a catch 22..

[Amethyst]

Hey, where's the option for those who went to college but don't have kids yet, but it wasn't that recently, but wasn't 20 years ago either? I graduated from my 4-year university in 1998 but am single so I don't have kids. I suppose I shall have to choose "none of the above."

[Open_Minded]

Hey, where's the option for those who went to college but don't have kids yet, but it wasn't that recently, but wasn't 20 years ago either? I graduated from my 4-year university in 1998 but am single so I don't have kids. I suppose I shall have to choose "none of the above."

 

Sorry, Amethyst, and everyone else. I'm a newbie and this is my first poll... so I messed up a lot.

 

For instance, I didn't know that someone filling it out would have to answer every question for it to "take". So, for instance, I'm not qualified to answer any of the questions about college debt, but I had to answer or it wouldn't take. So, I answered for my daughter, less than $20,000.

 

I also didn't know that you could only choose one answer for each question, therefore the questions about whether you or your spouse feels tied to a particular job because of health insurance - isn't really an option to click...

 

And this is a real and valid hidden cost on our economy. If people are not moving to jobs where they can be more productive - because they don't want to loose health care - it has a real impact on the economy as a whole, to say nothing of the impact on a person's overall life.

 

I am sorry, as I said, I've never put a poll together before and made mistakes. I guess that all has to be taken into consideration

 

Oh Well ... live and learn...

[Amethyst]

That's okay, nobody's perfect. Most polls are unscientific anyway. I think what you really are looking for is census data. We are only a small sample of the population.

 

Here is a good place to start: http://www.census.gov/main/www/cen2000.html

 

I just found an earnings report by occupation. It has college statistics as well.

 

http://www.census.gov/prod/2004pubs/censr-15.pdf

 

 

 

Also here is a link to a study that shows that only 60% of employers offered health insurance coverage in 2005.

 

http://www.californiahealthline.org/index....hangedID=114713

[Vixentrox]

I only took some college classes. Never bothered to finish a degree becuase it seemed such a scam. Had I completed a degree I doubt I'd have very little or any debt becuase of GI Bill, VA and other grants. I learned a trade from the military, and though i don't have kids, that avenue is open for them if I did. I have full health coverage as a military retiree for me and my family [if I had family] for a modest yearly fee.

[Amethyst]

Interesting tidbit from the study I posted above:

 

Premiums in 2005 increased an average of 9.2%, compared with 11.2% in 2004, marking the second consecutive year of a slower rise in premiums, according to the survey (Higgins, Washington Times, 9/15). The 2005 premium increase also ended four consecutive years of double-digit increases (Fuhrmans, Wall Street Journal, 9/15).

 

However, the increase still is more than three times that of workers' wage growth (2.7%), and 2.5 times the rate of inflation (3.5%), the survey found (Washington Times, 9/15). Premiums have increased 73% since 2000, while wages have increased by 15%, the Los Angeles Times reports (Vrana, Los Angeles Times, 9/15).

 

On average, health insurance premiums for family coverage in 2005 were $10,880, with the employer paying $8,167 and the worker paying $2,713, the study found. For single worker coverage, the average premium cost $4,024, with $3,413 paid by the employer and $610 paid by the employee, according to the report (Washington Post, 9/15).

[Open_Minded]

That's okay, nobody's perfect. Most polls are unscientific anyway. I think what you really are looking for is census data. We are only a small sample of the population.

 

Here is a good place to start: http://www.census.gov/main/www/cen2000.html

 

I just found an earnings report by occupation. It has college statistics as well.

 

http://www.census.gov/prod/2004pubs/censr-15.pdf ...

 

Thanks Amethyst. The above links are great.

 

In addition to the statistics - one reason I did the poll is to hear the personal stories. I knew people would answer the poll and then elaborate in their posts. To me the statistics are empty without the stories.

 

Your contribution of further data adds much to the discussion and I look forward to others contributions.

 

Thanks again.

[BigToe]

I graduated a year and a half ago and have no debt. I also have insurance, but not by one of the means listed in the poll.

[Chad3232132]

Interesting tidbit from the study I posted above:

 

Premiums in 2005 increased an average of 9.2%, compared with 11.2% in 2004, marking the second consecutive year of a slower rise in premiums, according to the survey (Higgins, Washington Times, 9/15). The 2005 premium increase also ended four consecutive years of double-digit increases (Fuhrmans, Wall Street Journal, 9/15).

 

However, the increase still is more than three times that of workers' wage growth (2.7%), and 2.5 times the rate of inflation (3.5%), the survey found (Washington Times, 9/15). Premiums have increased 73% since 2000, while wages have increased by 15%, the Los Angeles Times reports (Vrana, Los Angeles Times, 9/15).

 

On average, health insurance premiums for family coverage in 2005 were $10,880, with the employer paying $8,167 and the worker paying $2,713, the study found. For single worker coverage, the average premium cost $4,024, with $3,413 paid by the employer and $610 paid by the employee, according to the report (Washington Post, 9/15).

 

Ya that's about what I figured. Quite interesting how our good friend and staunch defender of insurance corporations and their lobbyists Megistias has disappeared all of a sudden...

[Joyous1]

hmmm, interesting.

 

I went to college, I paid off my debt long ago.

 

I am now sending my son to college and paying cash for his tuition, which is signifcantly less than the tuition I paid for his prep school so I'm not complaining.

 

I am self employed and buy my own insurance.

 

I have never received a penny of child support from my ex husband, though he left when my son was a toddler.

 

When I was born my parent's home didn't even have indoor plumbing, so please don't acuse me of being born with a silver spoon in my mouth. In those days my mother told us we were lucky to have real toilet paper, as she had to use old Sears catalogs when she was a child during the depression. She is now 85 and living on SS, but she can still afford her own apartment, food, and supplemental health insurance.

 

I think I still live in the same America as the rest of you, but I certainly see it differently. I still see it as a land of opportunity and abundance.

[Amethyst]

Quite interesting how our good friend and staunch defender of insurance corporations and their lobbyists Megistias has disappeared all of a sudden...

 

Maybe he's sleeping in on the weekend. Or off playing golf with Tiger Woods somewhere.

 

 

 

I also have insurance, but not by one of the means listed in the poll.

 

Yeah. I pay out of pocket, but have a large deductible (can't afford much else right now.) It is a good thing I am healthy and don't need much medical care, except for my stupid glasses and the annual trip to the dentist.

[Joyous1]

Yeah. I pay out of pocket, but have a large deductible (can't afford much else right now.) It is a good thing I am healthy and don't need much medical care, except for my stupid glasses and the annual trip to the dentist.

 

Do you have an HSA Amethyst? If you have high deductible health insurance you qualify, and it's a good investment.

Maybe he's sleeping in on the weekend. Or off playing golf with Tiger Woods somewhere.

 

Truthfully I agree with much of what Megistias said, though I don't like the way some of it was said. I think one of the biggest problems in the USA today is our inability to have civil arguments. It is possible to disagree with someone without calling them an idiot, but so often political discussions seem to deteriorate to such name calling.

[Open_Minded]

I think I still live in the same America as the rest of you, but I certainly see it differently. I still see it as a land of opportunity and abundance.

 

 

I think that's the problem, Soul... America can be seen very differently depending on one's perspective.

 

Like you, I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth. I don't have any complaints, either. We've been able to create a pretty decent lives in the 25 years we've been married.

 

But, I'm not so sure the same opportunities are there for our children, as were there for us 25 years ago. And the reality is that I'm not alone in my questioning about this aspect of American life.

 

I seriously question whether a kid entering college the way I did in the mid 1970s, ie (my parents can't afford to help me so I have to work my way through and take out loans) will be able to get through college without taking on more debt load than I would have had to (taking inflation into account).

 

I know health care is not as affordable and available as it was when I was their age.

 

Buying a house is a whole other issue. Our house is triple the value it was when we purchased it 15 years ago (we purchased a basic 3 bedroom ranch built in the 70s). I know wages haven't tripled in the last 15 years, so if a young couple were to move into the same community under the same circumstances we did 15 years ago, would they be able to afford a comparable home?

 

This is where my complaints are. My life is good, I have no complaints about my economic or health care situation. I just think we are not leaving younger people an America that comparable to the America we came of age in. And it makes me sad, not only for my own children, but for America in general.

[Amethyst]

Do you have an HSA Amethyst? If you have high deductible health insurance you qualify, and it's a good investment.

 

No. I barely made enough to get by before last year, anyway. I was going from paycheck to paycheck until I landed the contract job that I have now. My contracting agency does not have much benefits unless you want to pay through the nose. I am setting aside money in a regular savings account but that's all I've got right now. Well, that and the health insurance I have that I pay for out of my pocket.

 

I think one of the biggest problems in the USA today is our inability to have civil arguments. It is possible to disagree with someone without calling them an idiot, but so often political discussions seem to deteriorate to such name calling.

 

 

And that's just it. So many people cannot talk politely about religion or politics. Their way is automatically right and everyone else is a moron. I do my best to avoid convos about religion or politics in polite company. I like debating online because if it starts getting heated, I can just hit the "X" button in the corner of my screen and go away for a day or two. In RL, you can't do that. See, people even automatically think of a debate as an argument these days. But it doesn't have to be that way.