greasemonkey Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 So I was reading on another thread about hell, and somebody made a comment about how you'd probably get used to the pain after a thousand years of it. My two remaining brain cells started to rub together and the resulting friction formed an idea for a new thread: Who wants to live forever?! Instead of looking at hell, I want to look at the idea of heaven (or even the concept of "eternal life"). Eternal life and bliss!!! That sounds kinda cool; I can think of a ton of historical figures I'd like to talk to! Spend some time with the big guy himself ("what the hell was up with all those dinosaur bones, anyway?!"), party with all of my dead friends & family! ...Oh yeah, heaven is perfect and overindulgence is a sin, so there probably won't be much by way of booze. But boy, we could laugh a lot and have a good time! Well, maybe for a while anyway, those old "back when I was alive" jokes might kinda start getting stale after a hundered years or so. Gosh, since everybody is perfect and nobody does anything wrong, there's not a whole lot to make fun of or joke about anymore. Wow, since most jokes are about stupid crap people do, there isn't a whole lot of laughter up here, and if somebody tells another "knock knock" joke, I think I'm going to strangle them; oops! ...can't do that, I'm perfect, and he can't die anyway. But dang, all the things to do ...after a thousand years maybe mountain climbing might be fun! Man, but there sure isn't much of an adreneline rush when I make it to the top though, I'm immortal now and there isn't any element of danger anymore. I've already learned to play every musical instrument, and sung every song that had no sin in it so many times I'm sick of all of them! After a million years, all these perfect people are starting to REALLY get on my nerves, there's nothing left to do that I haven't done umpteen times, sheesh, hell is starting to look pretty dang good!!! So what are some of the things that make us human in this life? How we handle our mistakes, how we deal with adversity, how we relate to our own mortality and life and death. How do we make friends? Personally, I define a friend by how they stick with me through the good and bad; how they put up with me, even when I do stupid crap and vice-versa. We grow and learn more by our mistakes than by doing things right. We find out how good our friends are by the bad times probably more than the good. So much of this is what makes us HUMAN in the first place! It would seem to me that in order to endure ANY kind of eternal life, you would have to lose almost every attribute that makes us human in the first place! What sort of "reward" is eternal life when you aren't even the same person you once were when you were human?! I remember when I was a kid in church, I heard a guy say he was going to spend the first thousand years just gazing on the face of Jesus. When I was a kid, that actually scared me a little bit; I figured Jesus might think that was a little creepy (I sure would!)! Now pushing forty, I recognize the utter ABSURDITY of the remark!!! I can't even watch the freakin TV for an hour without getting distracted! That isn't heaven, THAT is a LOBOTOMY! How many people have really pondered what eternity really is? It's a long god-damned time is what it is! I don't think anyone could bear living a million years and retain an ounce of thier former humanity. Personally, I much prefer the "dust to dust," but I'd like to hear some other people's thoughts on the matter. Who wants to live forever, and why?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Heaven for Kevin Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I was just thinking about this as I was writing in another thread. The whole concept of eternal pain or happiness is completely flawed. One is totally meaningless without the other. If you were totally happy for the rest of eternity, you would get desensitized to it very quickly and it wouldn't mean anything without some sort of pain to compare it to. And there you are stuck for eternity with the same ole shit over and over again. If we do get turned into some sort of creature that can only feel pleasure or pain, we'll not be anything like we are now, we'll be more like robots. So, a totally loving god, created a bunch of self-aware "smart" monkeys, put them on a space rock to test them through trial and tribulation, so he could then use their evelasting souls to either stoke the fires of hell or build a heavenly army of mindless sycophants to constantly tell him how good he is. Ok, now it's starting to make sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I honestly can't say if I would like to live forever, but I sure know that the life I have now is going to be way, way, way too short. I don't want to live in the xtian's concept of heaven or Dante's concept of hell, but if I could extend the life I have now much longer I would sure find a lot of joy in it. I would use the magic of compound interest to ensure that my financial situation is secure in perpetuity, then I would travel, travel, travel. Then I would learn, learn, learn. I would get a PhD in every subject that captured my latest whim. I would then study and explore. I would learn to master instruments, skills, arts. I would spend a lifetime getting stoned and I would spend a lifetime teaching others. I would spend a lifetime just contemplating the meaning of things and I would spend a lifetime experiencing sex and sport and madness and love and hate. At some point when I am unable to contemplate that anything new would or could possibly bring me another ounce of joy, then I might consider laying it all down and going the way of dust, but I think that would be many, many lifetimes later. I don't enjoy the fact that I have at max 40-50 more years here and probably less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasemonkey Posted December 22, 2005 Author Share Posted December 22, 2005 I don't enjoy the fact that I have at max 40-50 more years here and probably less. ...nobody does, I think that's probably one of the reasons we came up with religion in the first place. I'm a voracious reader, love learning & studying things ...I'm sure I could come up with enough to cover quite a few lifetimes. The thought of eternity just gives me the willies though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I don't know... let's say heaven is like the best drugs you've ever taken, but there's no bad side effects, no one pukes, and there's never a hangover. I could deal with that. Throw on some bad ass music, gimme a dance floor, a good lighting show, and I'm good for, hell... I don't know... a couple of millenia at least. After that, I'm going to need a serious 1,000 year backrub and then let's do it all over again. Also, heaven can't be heaven without boobs. Lots and lots of jiggling, bouncing, wonderful boobs just waiting to be caressed and squeezed while we dance and rub and stroke and dance and squeeze and play... That's heaven... it would probably be a couple of million years before I got bored enough to go look for God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnosis of Disbelief Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I remember when I was a kid in church, I heard a guy say he was going to spend the first thousand years just gazing on the face of Jesus. When I was a kid, that actually scared me a little bit; I figured Jesus might think that was a little creepy (I sure would!)! Now pushing forty, I recognize the utter ABSURDITY of the remark!!! I can't even watch the freakin TV for an hour without getting distracted! That isn't heaven, THAT is a LOBOTOMY! Only a fundy would think of heaven as a staring contest with Jesus! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasemonkey Posted December 22, 2005 Author Share Posted December 22, 2005 And now you see the appeal, whether fiction or truth...of reincarnation...every new life is a new story to live. well said! For some reason, reincarnation has always made more "sense" than any other kind of "afterlife" belief structure to me at least. I guess that is why I have always had so much respect for Buhhdaism over most of the others. At least thier focus tends to be a lot more centered on this life rather than the next. Of course, I have heard of Buhhdists monks immolating themselves in protest (maybe someone can give me some more info on this... was it Vietnam?); I'm not really sure, but the Tibetian Buhhdists went into exile more over ethnicity than religion if I'm correct. I've always wanted to talk to the Dhali Lama. He just seems cool beyond words to me.... his people sure got a raw deal from China, but he keeps on seldom ever saying anything negative about anyone. Some of our Christian evangelists could stand to take a few lesons from that guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white_raven23 Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I want to live forever. "I don't want to miss a thing"- Aerosmith I want to know where we will go, what we will do, who we will become. "We" as in humanity itself. Even if I'm non-corporeal when my life is over......I want to be able to observe and learn forever after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 i want to live forever i want to see my uncle, grandma and dad who died again. i would like a paradise were me, my freinds and family live. were the whole world lives forever together. why would someone not want to live forever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dianka Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 I wish I could live forever, of course only if everyone I love could live forever. I think that is why I had a hard time letting go of God entirely. I dropped the religion shit pretty quick though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qadeshet Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 Who wants to live forever, and why?! Perhaps death is like going to sleep and not waking up. Would that really be so bad? To be honest, I just don't worry about it one way or another. I choose to believe in reincarnation because it makes more sense than one life followed by Heaven or Hell. I plan to be a space pioneer in my next life. Without the Xian fear of Hell, life is good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 I think I'd only want to live forever if time travel were possible. That, and long distance space travel. I'd love to have time enough to explore the whole damn universe, pop in and out of time just to see what life was like in the past... maybe meet my ancestors when they're young. Otherwise screw it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 I think I'd only want to live forever if time travel were possible. That, and long distance space travel. I'd love to have time enough to explore the whole damn universe, pop in and out of time just to see what life was like in the past... maybe meet my ancestors when they're young. Otherwise screw it. You just described my concept of heaven I held when I was an xtian. I went through a fairly serious grieving process when I realized that it would never come to pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skankboy Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 People who say they want to live forever, have no real feeling for how long forever would really be. The universe doesn't even live forever, why should we be any different? Would I like to be able to see what the future will hold? Certainly! I am an avid fan of science fiction and would love to see some of the things I've imagined come to fruition. But an "afterlife"? What purpose would it have? In christian theology, the reward isn't really eternal life (that's a side effect), it's being allowed to exist in the presence of god that you're supposed to seek. While I'm certainly curious as to whether or not a 'god' exists, there's nothing I can do in this life to confirm an afterlife, so it's not worth worrying about. One thing Ssel and I agree on, your legacy is alot more than "someone remembering your name". EVERYTHING you do affects EVERYONE else whether you know it or not. Your actions will have a part in the future of our species. If that isn't enough, then I'm not sure there's much more I could tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saxyroze Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 Who wants to live forever, and why?! I want to live forever as a vampire...living on human blood...caged in the embrace of the night....aww yeah, a vampire's life.... ..... ok, I've read a few too many anne rice novels..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Gods Fail Posted December 24, 2005 Share Posted December 24, 2005 As for me, I think eternity would be boring unless you could do stuff like time travel and visit other planets like gwenmead said. Could you imagine being stuck in one place forever, never able to leave? Even if it was a mansion in a heavenly kingdom? What would that be like after 12 billion years? Or 45 trillion years? Not even death would end it - you'd just keep existing in the same place, doing the same thing, never ending. On the other hand, pop my brain in a cyborg body and give me maybe a few hundred extra years, or even a thousand, and I'd be happy to eventually call it quits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssel Posted December 24, 2005 Share Posted December 24, 2005 Who wants to live forever?!Don't knock it if you haven tried it. Think of it this way, what you like or dislike is largely up to learning. If you choose to learn to like whatever you would be stuck doing. Then wouldn't you wind up being eternally tickled? If you learn to easily adapt what it is that you like, then if things kept changing, you would enjoy it. No matter what they changed to, you would enjoy it. Why would you choose to not enjoy any of it? If things didn't change at all, you would enjoy it. No matter what it changed to (within limits) when would it make sense to stop trying to have fun with it? But then, why wait for eternity? ========================================== Btw, MERRY CHRISTMAS ....(you faithless, hell bound heathens) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted December 24, 2005 Share Posted December 24, 2005 I would like to live forever as long as there was change. I kinda like the idea of reincarnation because it still leaves the hope for something better while maintaining the possibility of something worse. I think that's what makes life interesting is not what we're doing right now, but the not knowing what will happen in 5 minutes or a day or a year, and the hope for something better. If we lived forever in heaven just spending each and every day telling Biblegod how great he was, there is nothing better. But what kind of life is that? I think there will be lots of white padded rooms in heaven for those who finally lose their marbles at the thought of that being all there is with no hope for change... EVER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taphophilia Posted December 24, 2005 Share Posted December 24, 2005 The idea of an afterlife or a Heaven means we would want to be there. Have any of you read the book "The Five People You Meet In Heaven?" If you haven't I'll give you a brief synopsis. Eddie is an old man who works in an amusement park repairing rides. He doesn't think he's made much of a life for himself but takes pride in the work he does. He has sorrow and regret for what could have been and at the same time there are parts of his life he wouldn't change. He dies by attempting to save a little girl from one of the rides that broke down. He goes to five different peoples heavens to experience an understanding of the lessons in life and then given the purpose of the life he lived. At the end, he gets to enjoy for eternity his own heaven with the people he loved while on Earth. Everyone's heaven is different. Even though they are together, each ones perspective of what their heaven is like is different. Taph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MQTA Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 I want to live forever. "I don't want to miss a thing"- Aerosmith I want to know where we will go, what we will do, who we will become. "We" as in humanity itself. Even if I'm non-corporeal when my life is over......I want to be able to observe and learn forever after. Yep. The curiosity of post-death, how things turn out for those left behind. At least a good 10 years beyond death.. after that, everyone's on their own anyway Even though they are together, each ones perspective of what their heaven is like is different. Taph well, that doesn't sound very different than NOW. There's 4 people in my home, and 4 totally different viewpoints. There was 5 in my home growing up, and 5 wildly different perspectives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ssel Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 Does anybody understand that you have the power to change what it is that you like and dislike (within limits)? Heaven is defined to be whatever it is that you like. But that is only because you have learned to actually like what is required to cause eternalness. Thus by doing what you learned to enjoy, you cause the eternalness of your joy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 how do you do that? id like to be a millionaire with a buetiful wife and children how do i get it? Does anybody understand that you have the power to change what it is that you like and dislike (within limits)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Does anybody understand that you have the power to change what it is that you like and dislike (within limits)? Heaven is defined to be whatever it is that you like. But that is only because you have learned to actually like what is required to cause eternalness. Thus by doing what you learned to enjoy, you cause the eternalness of your joy. You can pie-in-the-sky all you want. Go ahead and throw out all these goofy theories that make people think you know something. As far as I'm concerned, it's all a crock. All the wishing and imagining and hoping and dreaming and faith and biblical promises and last minute desperation cannot make a person's consciousness survive their death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poonis Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 I remember when I was a kid in church, I heard a guy say he was going to spend the first thousand years just gazing on the face of Jesus. A quote comes to mind (although I do not know who it is from): "Simple things amaze simple minds." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poonis Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Does anybody understand that you have the power to change what it is that you like and dislike (within limits)? Heaven is defined to be whatever it is that you like. But that is only because you have learned to actually like what is required to cause eternalness. Thus by doing what you learned to enjoy, you cause the eternalness of your joy. Ha ha hahahaha! I have to hand it to you, I didn't think anyone could unfurl such a mountain of steaming taurus feces in a single post! I almost sneezed eggnog out my nose this time! hahaha! Alright... Ssel's definition of 'Heaven': "Heaven is defined to be whatever it is that you (ie, Poonis) like." Problem: 'whatever' is undefined, specifically allowing for my personal definition. I choose 'Heaven' to be defined as 'Hell'; something that I do not like. The problem then arises that your definition of Heaven is rendered ambiguous and without meaning when I am allowed to say that Heaven is Hell. I guess I am humored because Amanda used this same religious-logic with me in the Arena some months ago. I am still no closer to understanding that which I once believed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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