Conflicted...

[4EverFree]

NOT having a good day unfortunately and here is the only place I could think of posting.  It kind of feels sad that I end up posting to unknown people on this site rather than feeling comfortable with sharing with people I know, but here it is.

 

I’ve been so affected and harmed by my upbringing, my parents church and their choices, I sometimes think I will never get to the stage of getting rid of the anger and hurt I have built up inside.  I feel guilty having these thoughts often as my parents loved me in their way and never wanted any harm to come to me but their toxic religion scarred me for life and a lot of the time I’m furious but can’t find any outlet for that.  My parents are now older, late 70’s and I live 6000 miles away.  Not seeing them often has been more healing.  However I don’t think I can live with the guilt of hurting them now, they look so small each time I see them, simply due to older age.  I honestly don’t’ think I can forgive myself for deliberately hurting them now, I am a adult with my own family now independent of them.  Yet, I feel so much anger when thinking back over the years, hurt and betrayal by them.  So much of me wants them to to acknowledge that and simply say they wish they had lived differently.

But I know that will never be.

And I know that any accusations from me will simply feel like my judging their parenting while they tried to do their best in their own way so I know I shouldn’t.

 

Is this normal?  How have others responded to their parents in such circumstances?  I only visit home once a year when I am expected to attend the church I grew up in.  It kills me but I accept reality and do it to seemingly 'respect' them in front of their peers.    At some stage I have to make clear that my children will never go there.  I have not had to bridge that conversation yet, but at some stage I will have to relate the fact that I see it as harmful and toxic for a kid without any defences, yet I fear hurting them with my criticism. This is the core of their existence, their everything……I am a decent person who does not wish to cause unnecessary hurt to people close to me, yet struggle so much to find peace with this.

 

Just needing to rant....

[xliar]

Hi SharonMH, sounds like a pretty crummy day, sorry about that, but I know what you mean. I got some real fucked-up baggage that I reckon they'll bury me with. Both my parents are gone and even though they had a fairly heavy christian hand I have no resentment or bitterness toward them. They were victims of the same godly extortion our culture has approved of for all the ages. I loved them dearly and was actualy deconverting the last few years I had with my widowed mother but chose to spare her feelings and accommodate her faith in the afterlife and her christian friends, who also loved her. I know it's hard not to hold specific people accountable for your pain, but for me I seem to remember more of the fun and love and laughter than the bad shit. They were wonderful parents in so many ways. I should stop rambling about me. I just wanted to say I read your post and I feel your pain. Hope tomorrow is a better day.

[WarriorPoet]

Feel free to rant.  That is what this place is here for.

 

I can relate to your not wanting to cause pain to your family.  If I were to come out to my parents as an atheist, I would likely be disowned.  I could live with that.  I wouldn't be happy, but I'd get by.  What I would have a problem with would be the pain that I would cause them.  I love my parents, and concerning them with the belief of my eternal damnation is not a burden I would force upon them.

 

When you get down to it, as much anger as you feel, you can really not blame them, at least as far as their religion.  They brought you up in the best way that they knew.  Religious indoctrination is strong, and it is only the fortunate few that are able to escape it.  I am sure that they believed that they were doing the right thing by raising you the way they did.

 

Everybody's situation is unique.  You need to determine the best way to live your life with respect to your lack of beliefs and your relationship to your family.

[RenaissanceWoman]

I feel your pain, but I assure you, it will get better. Ranting is good. It helps you get your thoughts together, and can be very cleansing. The anger phase does subside a bit, and eventually you will probably feel pity for them, and eventually acceptance.

 

My mother was the youngest of eight preacher's kids. All of her older brothers and brothers-in-law are/were deacons, elders, what-have-you, one sister is a church organist, and several of her nephews and nieces (my cousins) are preachers, Christian school teachers, elders, etc. Even my sister is a church organist. My mother grew up with that, and that is how she defined herself. She made some dumb parenting arguments based upon "what the people at church would think," but that is how she grew up as preacher's kid -- in a fishbowl, or under a microscope, or whatever you want to call it. This caused me a good deal of angst, especially in my teen years, because I was not free to be me and make mistakes and grow -- it was all about "what if the people at church find out?"

 

I had a great deal of anger at her in my 20s (I'm early 40s now), and now that I am deconverted (for about a year now) I see it for what it was. She was living out her programming. I feel sorry for her that her nonsense caused me to cut off all contact with her through my 20s and part of my 30s (13 years total). Now I blame it on her upbringing, her indoctrination, her fear. Sad. I would never tell her that I think her crazy fundie nonsense was toxic. I have gotten past a lot of the anger, and sort of accept her and her madness.

 

Your parents are dealing with a certain amount of loss, too, with you and your family living so far away. You can use that distance as your space to heal. That can take a long time, I know. Find your place in this world, and grapple with the angst, and be free to grow -- away from them. They probably don't know that you chose to move away from them out of self-preservation; you may not even know that on a conscious level. But there is the chance that if you were blissful in your relationship with them, you would have subconsciously tried to find a way to be closer to them, for more daily/regular interaction. (My sister, for example, had no issues growing up and is still part of the church, and she chooses to live near our now-divorced parents -- which I would never ever consider.) Your inner guide has moved you to make space for you at a safer distance. That's good. Go with it.

 

I would say there is no reason to burden them with your lack of faith. There might be small issues you can bring up, and maybe they can explain themselves and see that they hurt you. That can be helpful for you, if done with kid gloves. For example, I have mentioned to my mother my angst about her coddling my submissive sister and quiet brother, but always finding reasons to suspect, accuse, and punish me for being myself. She didn't realize that this had hurt me, and apologized for only trying to make me into a better (better-behaved, church-worthy) person. She admits now that I am the most interesting and successful of her three kids, and sees why I had to move away and cut off contact to allow myself to become the "amazing" (her word) person that I am now. She even told me a few months ago that I am "beautiful" and my sister is "plain" -- which made a huge impact because I always thought she considered my sister to be pretty and me to be just a pain.

 

I don't know my rambling here about myself is helping you in some small way. I hope so! Just know that parents of that generation did what they thought was best, based on their isolated and indoctrinated world views. Be thankful for the internet, for example, to help you research outside of Christianity and that whole messed up bubble. You have advantages they did not have.

 

It will get better. Just keep mulling it over. Maybe have a little discussion with your mom and/or dad about some thing(s) that happened. Looking back and realizing that it caused you issues, they may have softened a bit and will admit to being too harsh or whatever. Or they might tell you to get over it, like my dad does. (I've come to realize that he is just an emotionally unavailable prick, so I am working on coming to terms with that. He will never give me what I need, so be it. His loss.)

 

Many years ago I used to listen to Dr. Laura. (Can't stand her now!) But she used to tell people that we have two chances for a parent-child relationship; if the one you had with your parents was not right, you have a second chance to make it right with your own children. In other words -- be for your kids the kind of parent you wish you would have had (without spoiling the dickens out of them, lol). That can be very healing and fulfilling. You can't change the past relationship, but you can work on your future relationship for you and your kid(s). I would suggest that you focus on that, and find some peace there. At least you know what NOT to do.

 

Chin up, dear lady! You are aware, and that is going to make all the difference for your child(ren). You are already miles ahead of our peers who are still stuck in the fear and indoctrination of the church. You have the power to set your family on the right track, which it sounds to me like you are doing.

 

And never feel odd about posting here to "strangers". You have to find kindred souls where you can, so just be thankful that this outlet exists and you are not suffering in a disconnected bubble (like our parents did). We here don't know you in person, but based on our similar experiences, we know you better than many of your real life people. We get you. We feel you. And we support you.

 

Peace to you, my dear!

[TheRedneckProfessor]

This, too, shall pass.  It is normal to feel some resentment toward your parents once you realize that you were lied to and betrayed by them.  However, what to do with that anger is the really tricky part.  I've chosen to simply let go of my anger, especially where my parents are concerned.  I don't believe they really did the best they could raising me, although they think they did.  I think, in order to truly do your best raising a child you should always question yourself, your parenting style, your disciplinary actions, everything.  My parents never did that.  At the end of the day, though, this is my life and I don't want to spend it being angry.  I also want to raise my son with a sense of family values, so I try not to show too much of my anger around my parents.

 

As others have said, letting it all out is a good step in the right direction.  Rant to us, because we've been there and understand.  You may not know our real names or what we look like, but that doesn't mean we're strangers, just cyber-friends.

[Deva]

I have also had a very tough time with this issue over the years.  It is a similar situation and it has come close to breaking me at times.   It has helped me a lot to post my thoughts on this site.  The people here have given me some very sound advice.

 

I also live far from my fundamentalist parents. They are both 80 now.  Its extremely difficult to cope with the fact that I cannot have an honest conversation regarding religion with them, ever..

 

Its hard for me to comprehend that my mother still sends me salvation tracts with Birthday/Christmas cards and writes letters to me with her "testimony".

 

I can't even fathom that I was raised in the religion from early childhood and know everything about the so-called plan of salvation down to microscopic detail, and know all about my mother's conversion,  and yet she is still trying to force this rubbish on me even though I am  55 years old.   She thinks she is doing something good, not something that has harmed me for most of my life. She would never be able to comprehend it.  Like you, sharonmhanna, I can't say anything about it, or it will hurt my mother. Every now and then it is so tough that I have to come on here and write about it.  Several times I have come very close to coming out of the closet, but I really can't do that.  Its likely that my mother is not going to live many more years with her health issues and I simply can not tell her. 

[4EverFree]

Hi everyone

Thanks for being so open – it helps so much to know how people have journeyed along this issue with so many struggling with the same challenge.

 

Overall, I’m hoping that I’ll get to the same point of acceptance/forgiveness, due to feeling for the limitations of my parents’ own situations.  They were similarly brainwashed and are unable to take the religion blinkers off, and in so many ways their lives have suffered, even if they don’t realize or acknowledge that.  I guess that once I get to a fuller appreciation of that, it will help me balance/accept my own feelings somewhat.    Given their advanced age and the infrequency of our visits, I really don’t want to bring up anything that would hurt them.  The only stumbling block to that is their expectation that we all attend church with them in the two weeks or so when we visit each year.  My daughter is now getting to the age of understanding where I’m just waiting for them to ask to bring her along, and that’s somewhere I just don’t think I can go.   I don’t want to risk exposing her to preaching on death, hell and punishment.  How young do small kids pick up on these things I wonder?  I remember vividly having nightmares about hell and being left behind at around age 8 but the seeds were planted way before. I guess I need to give more thought as to how to wriggle around that without openly confronting them. 

 

 Thanks for all the support and your kind words.  It is truly great to have found such a warm, generous community of folks like this.  

[mydisplayname]

Hi everyone

Thanks for being so open – it helps so much to know how people have journeyed along this issue with so many struggling with the same challenge.

 

Overall, I’m hoping that I’ll get to the same point of acceptance/forgiveness, due to feeling for the limitations of my parents’ own situations.  They were similarly brainwashed and are unable to take the religion blinkers off, and in so many ways their lives have suffered, even if they don’t realize or acknowledge that.  I guess that once I get to a fuller appreciation of that, it will help me balance/accept my own feelings somewhat.    Given their advanced age and the infrequency of our visits, I really don’t want to bring up anything that would hurt them.  The only stumbling block to that is their expectation that we all attend church with them in the two weeks or so when we visit each year.  My daughter is now getting to the age of understanding where I’m just waiting for them to ask to bring her along, and that’s somewhere I just don’t think I can go.   I don’t want to risk exposing her to preaching on death, hell and punishment.  How young do small kids pick up on these things I wonder?  I remember vividly having nightmares about hell and being left behind at around age 8 but the seeds were planted way before. I guess I need to give more thought as to how to wriggle around that without openly confronting them. 

 

 Thanks for all the support and your kind words.  It is truly great to have found such a warm, generous community of folks like this.  

 

Sharon. My situation is exactly like yours except I live a few kilometers away from my parents and could probably walk to them instead of taking the car if I was so inclined. On the one hand I can see them aging and on the other hand I still see them as the parents they were when I was small. I want to go back to being my ten year old self and I want them to be their forty-year old selves and then I want to tell them to cut it out and that I'm not interested in sharing their delusion.

 

I can't do that though and me telling them now when they're old just doesn't seem right. Too much have changed in my country politically and technologically and they haven't kept up with the times. They're not the same people they were then and although I still feel angry when they start talking religion I just keep my mouth shut. If I we're to tell my mother I don't believe in god anymore she will have an early unhappy death and I will feel responsible.

 

My two year old son however will have to know the truth about what I believe, or rather don't. I don't know how I'm going to approach that yet, but I still have some time.

 

When I really feel angry, like at Christmas when my mother and sister proclaimed they see angels, I come over to the kind people here and rant. Afterwards, especially after reading some of the replies, I feel better than before.

 

Please keep us up to date on what happens and how you decide to approach this problem. I'm going to be in your shoes very soon.

[Blood]

NOT having a good day unfortunately and here is the only place I could think of posting.  It kind of feels sad that I end up posting to unknown people on this site rather than feeling comfortable with sharing with people I know, but here it is.

 

I’ve been so affected and harmed by my upbringing, my parents church and their choices, I sometimes think I will never get to the stage of getting rid of the anger and hurt I have built up inside.  I feel guilty having these thoughts often as my parents loved me in their way and never wanted any harm to come to me but their toxic religion scarred me for life and a lot of the time I’m furious but can’t find any outlet for that.  My parents are now older, late 70’s and I live 6000 miles away.  Not seeing them often has been more healing.  However I don’t think I can live with the guilt of hurting them now, they look so small each time I see them, simply due to older age.  I honestly don’t’ think I can forgive myself for deliberately hurting them now, I am a adult with my own family now independent of them.  Yet, I feel so much anger when thinking back over the years, hurt and betrayal by them.  So much of me wants them to to acknowledge that and simply say they wish they had lived differently.

But I know that will never be.

And I know that any accusations from me will simply feel like my judging their parenting while they tried to do their best in their own way so I know I shouldn’t.

 

Is this normal?  How have others responded to their parents in such circumstances?  I only visit home once a year when I am expected to attend the church I grew up in.  It kills me but I accept reality and do it to seemingly 'respect' them in front of their peers.    At some stage I have to make clear that my children will never go there.  I have not had to bridge that conversation yet, but at some stage I will have to relate the fact that I see it as harmful and toxic for a kid without any defences, yet I fear hurting them with my criticism. This is the core of their existence, their everything……I am a decent person who does not wish to cause unnecessary hurt to people close to me, yet struggle so much to find peace with this.

 

Just needing to rant....

 

Well, if it's their "core of existence," then explaining how you really felt about religion would greatly harm their self-esteem and undoubtedly make them feel like total failures. Do you really want to do that to them at their age?

 

Do they know your kids do not go to church? 

[Margee]

sharon, sorry you have to face some of these issues. They can be difficult to work through. Everyone had given you some wonderful points to think about. I wanted to add something. Back in the late 80's, (a long time ago, lol) it was very 'popular' to confront your parents with issues that had caused you pain when growing up. My sister and I did this to my mom and I have to go to my grave regretting that I once acted this way. I did talk to her before she died, I made all the amends and she accepted that I didn't mean to hurt her -  but it did not ever take away the guilt that I must live with when I remember the hurt look and the tears that rolled down her face. I was young and stupid. I am older now and I understand a lot of things so much better. She did her best. I brought my sisters two children up when my sister died. I did the best I could and I know I could have done even better..... If they came and attacked me today, I would want to die.

 

Think carefully about being so-called 'honest' about everything. Sometimes honesty can devastate a human.

 

Big *hug* as you work your way through this.