Bayard Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Hello everyone, I'm a former Protestant who converted to Eastern Orthodox Christianity (specifically, the Russian branch in America) and recently decided to leave under very unique circumstances. A deep interest in rationalism and philosophy (especially the Stoics, Kant, and Schopenhauer) made this transition easier. I'd really like to share more of my story but only privately: if your background also includes Orthodoxy, or if you were a convert to one of the more conservative Christian denominations and then left, please send me a PM if you're interested! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I was Orthodox for a couple of years. Welcome to the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggie Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I delved into Orthodoxy fairly deeply but never made the plunge... Welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellinas Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I researched Orthodoxy and attended a few services and a local Russian Orthodox Church. I thought it was very interesting and very aesthetically pleasing, but elected not to continue. I am familiar with the writings of Schopenhauer and I have read "The World as Will and Representation." It has influenced my thought quite a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 2, 2014 Author Share Posted June 2, 2014 Thanks all! Though I don't agree with him on everything, Schopenhauer truly had a great mind and was ahead of his time not only philosophically but also in his views on the role of sexual impulse in humanity's psychological development. I thought his "Essays and Aphorisms," published by Penguin, was mind-blowing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 2, 2014 Author Share Posted June 2, 2014 *He also makes the concept of death less scary from an atheistic perspective [is there a way to edit posts?]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst7 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 I was married to an Orthodox pastor for 16 years, after having been disilusioned by every other form of Christianity. There are few of us here, but we are here. I'll send you a link to my extimony. Welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst7 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 http://new.exchristian.net/2014/05/the-most-bass-ackward-path-from.html My extimony from Orthodoxy (and religion itself). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 I knew a good number of people who were E. Orthodox, some who converted from Protestantism. I flirted with it myself before going over to Rome. I can't see becoming Orthodox now. Lots of reasons. I also spent two weeks reading Schopenhauer's On the Fourfold Principle of Sufficient Reason, which he wrote as his dissertation and revised it more than once. Pretty cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 3, 2014 Author Share Posted June 3, 2014 http://new.exchristian.net/2014/05/the-most-bass-ackward-path-from.html My extimony from Orthodoxy (and religion itself). Thanks for sharing, Amethyst, though I can't possibly relate: my deconversion story certainly seems frivolous by comparison to yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llwellyn Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 As I was leaving Christianity, I stopped for a while and investigated Eastern Orthodox Christianity. I thought it might offer a form of Christianity that removes the things that I find most awful about the religion -- penal substitutionary atonement, penal hell, justification by faith. There are certain Orthodox teachers who advertise it as being a "kinder gentler" form of Christianity where hell is the same "River of Fire" of God's love. But upon examination, I saw that EO is not in any way a humanistic religion, that the Bible does teach the obnoxious doctrines I hate, and that EO quickly shifts between one paradigm and another on a regular basis. Most of all, I realized that there is no reason to believe in a God at all, or a "goodness." Even if there was a God, his love or hatred toward others would be relevant only to himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadedAtheist Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 I was raised in a sort of Serbian Orthodox home. Never really took anything on board, my later conversion was into fundamentalist baptist church rather than Orthodoxism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadedAtheist Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 The 5 hour (slight exaggeration) Sunday Services didn't help win me over either, so it makes me even more amazed someone not from that culture standing in services completely not in their language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 3, 2014 Author Share Posted June 3, 2014 As I was leaving Christianity, I stopped for a while and investigated Eastern Orthodox Christianity. I thought it might offer a form of Christianity that removes the things that I find most awful about the religion -- penal substitutionary atonement, penal hell, justification by faith. There are certain Orthodox teachers who advertise it as being a "kinder gentler" form of Christianity where hell is the same "River of Fire" of God's love. But upon examination, I saw that EO is not in any way a humanistic religion, that the Bible does teach the obnoxious doctrines I hate, and that EO quickly shifts between one paradigm and another on a regular basis. Most of all, I realized that there is no reason to believe in a God at all, or a "goodness." Even if there was a God, his love or hatred toward others would be relevant only to himself. Good post and highlights a couple of the problems I eventually found insurmountable. I can no longer accept, for example, that anyone could possibly deserve an eternity of suffering-- even if that eternal suffering is brought on by their own volition, as the Orthodox like to claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 3, 2014 Author Share Posted June 3, 2014 The 5 hour (slight exaggeration) Sunday Services didn't help win me over either, so it makes me even more amazed someone not from that culture standing in services completely not in their language. A decade or two down the road I'm hoping I'll look back on it as nothing more than a strange phase in my life. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst7 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 http://new.exchristian.net/2014/05/the-most-bass-ackward-path-from.html My extimony from Orthodoxy (and religion itself). Thanks for sharing, Amethyst, though I can't possibly relate: my deconversion story certainly seems frivolous by comparison to yours. But all deconversions are painful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llwellyn Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 Good post and highlights a couple of the problems I eventually found insurmountable. I can no longer accept, for example, that anyone could possibly deserve an eternity of suffering-- even if that eternal suffering is brought on by their own volition, as the Orthodox like to claim. I'm pretty sure that suffering is an inherent part of any existence. As long as we have consciousness, we will be experiencing suffering more or less. It's impossible to imagine a "heaven" without suffering. But I agree that never-ending existence -- even in heaven -- is an unbearable thought. A person who never made a choice to exist should not be compelled to exist forever. I mean, maybe eternity is in the cards for us, but if so we'll experience it one damn day after another -- just as we do this life. But it is too much to think about in a given moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 14, 2014 Author Share Posted June 14, 2014 Good post and highlights a couple of the problems I eventually found insurmountable. I can no longer accept, for example, that anyone could possibly deserve an eternity of suffering-- even if that eternal suffering is brought on by their own volition, as the Orthodox like to claim. I'm pretty sure that suffering is an inherent part of any existence. As long as we have consciousness, we will be experiencing suffering more or less. It's impossible to imagine a "heaven" without suffering. But I agree that never-ending existence -- even in heaven -- is an unbearable thought. A person who never made a choice to exist should not be compelled to exist forever. I mean, maybe eternity is in the cards for us, but if so we'll experience it one damn day after another -- just as we do this life. But it is too much to think about in a given moment. Sorry for the late response, I've been busy with quite a few things lately. I'd more or less agree with you, and the Buddhist mantra, that existence is suffering. Not to sound like a broken record, but that mantra also influenced Schopenhauer, who wrote (I paraphrase) that if we were to stand before God and be condemned for our sins, we could reasonably counter that non-existence would have been far preferable to the life we had, much less one accompanied by an eternity of suffering. The theological proposition of free will seems even more ridiculous when you consider first, that we never chose to be born, and second, that even if we decide to exercise our "free will" by ending our existence voluntarily, we would (according to the traditional Christian understanding) instantly be condemned to an eternity of continued existence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayard Posted June 14, 2014 Author Share Posted June 14, 2014 Good post and highlights a couple of the problems I eventually found insurmountable. I can no longer accept, for example, that anyone could possibly deserve an eternity of suffering-- even if that eternal suffering is brought on by their own volition, as the Orthodox like to claim. I'm pretty sure that suffering is an inherent part of any existence. As long as we have consciousness, we will be experiencing suffering more or less. It's impossible to imagine a "heaven" without suffering. But I agree that never-ending existence -- even in heaven -- is an unbearable thought. A person who never made a choice to exist should not be compelled to exist forever. I mean, maybe eternity is in the cards for us, but if so we'll experience it one damn day after another -- just as we do this life. But it is too much to think about in a given moment. Sorry for the late response, I've been busy with quite a few things lately. I'd more or less agree with you, and the Buddhist mantra, that existence is suffering. Not to sound like a broken record, but that mantra also influenced Schopenhauer, who wrote (I paraphrase) that if we were to stand before God and be condemned for our sins, we could reasonably counter that non-existence would have been far preferable to the life we had, much less one accompanied by an eternity of suffering. The theological proposition of free will seems even more ridiculous when you consider first, that we never chose to be born, and second, that even if we decide to exercise our "free will" by ending our existence voluntarily, we would (according to the traditional Christian understanding) instantly be condemned to an eternity of continued existence. As an addendum, I certainly believe there are better ways of coping with our existence than religion or suicide, but I also don't condemn anyone for choosing either of those "solutions." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts