Guest sub_zer0 Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Since it is way to much for me to respond to all questions posed by all of these people on this forum, we will literally do ONE VERSE AT A TIME. Isaiah 14:11-14 (New American Standard Bible)11'Your pomp and the music of your harps Have been brought down to Sheol; Maggots are spread out as your bed beneath you And worms are your covering.' 12"How you have fallen from heaven, O star of the morning, son of the dawn! You have been cut down to the earth, You who have weakened the nations! 13"But you said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God, And I will sit on the mount of assembly In the recesses of the north. 14'I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.' Obviously the intent in these verses is to display the attitude of men with that of Satan in their view and disregard of God's rightful ownership of the world and subsequently their kingdom as well. Isaiah views the kings as attempting to ascend into heaven by the divine claims that they would make for themselves and their kingdom; the picture is that of them falling from heaven just as certainly Lucifer did through his bold claims of proclaiming kingship in the Kings presence. Therefore, it is not inappropiate to understand the words of verses 13 and 14 as the attitude of Satan himself. The pronoun "I" is used at least 5 times to denote the selfishness of Satan and Satan-empowered men to replace God with themselves at rightful ruler of the world. The name Lucifer is actually the Roman designation for the Morning Star. The Hebrew word (helel) means "the bright one." This reference illustrates the fact that the morning star speedily dissapears before the far greater splendor of the rising sun. Hence, although Satan may appear as an "angel of light" (2 Corinthians 11:14) he shall be banished to outer darkness by the coming of the Son of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 And? So what? Don't care, since I don't want to spend time on interpreting the meaning of a book with made up stories. Lucifer, Satan, Devil, Nevil, Morgana, Darth Vader... no one exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 And? So what? Don't care, since I don't want to spend time on interpreting the meaning of a book with made up stories. Lucifer, Satan, Devil, Nevil, Morgana, Darth Vader... no one exists. Darth Vader does too exist. George Lucas has his relics, his Mask and Cape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ nivek ♦ Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 subby... I don't know that I can make this any plainer: I do n o t give a living livid SHIT about what your fairy tale book of Horrible Wonders and Pissed off GohWdz says.. Get this messge through your thickened skull bubba, for most part we assembled here have heard every single argument you can bring up. Taught, preached, believed, and at one time lived for the *message*. Found out that bullshit is just bullshit. I'll remove your bully pulpit if you care to continue to start threads such as this. k, easy_to_piss_off_mean_old_man, L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sub_zer0 Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 subby... I don't know that I can make this any plainer: I do n o t give a living livid SHIT about what your fairy tale book of Horrible Wonders and Pissed off GohWdz says.. Get this messge through your thickened skull bubba, for most part we assembled here have heard every single argument you can bring up. Taught, preached, believed, and at one time lived for the *message*. Found out that bullshit is just bullshit. I'll remove your bully pulpit if you care to continue to start threads such as this. k, easy_to_piss_off_mean_old_man, L So how is it bullshit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Because it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkepticOfBible Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Is 14 Obviously the intent in these verses is to display the attitude of men with that of Satan in their view and disregard of God's rightful ownership of the world and subsequently their kingdom as well. Isaiah views the kings as attempting to ascend into heaven by the divine claims that they would make for themselves and their kingdom; the picture is that of them falling from heaven just as certainly Lucifer did through his bold claims of proclaiming kingship in the Kings presence. Therefore, it is not inappropiate to understand the words of verses 13 and 14 as the attitude of Satan himself. Sub_zero, why are you lying? I think most of us has demonstrated beyond doubt that the above verse is NOT talking about Satan/Devil You taking the verse OUT OF CONTEXT(u understand that don't you) and are including your theological bias into it. The person is clearly identified in the this verse. Isa 14:3-4 And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve, That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased! Are you gonna assert that the King of Babylon(Nebuchadrezzar), was the devil? SATAN IS NOT EVEN MENTIONED IN THE ABOVE VERSES. I even showed a christian site which debunks your claim?Atleast have the intellectual honesty to admit that the above verse is not talking about the Devil. Show some other verse FROM THE OT which talks about the devil. Please read my former carefully and try to rebutt that, instead of repeating it. I take out the time to research and answer, please don't insult me by ignoring my post. Post 109 although Satan may appear as an "angel of light Even Jesus appeared in as angel of light, what makes you think that was not the devil? The pronoun "I" is used at least 5 times to denote the selfishness of Satan and Satan-empowered men to replace God with themselves at rightful ruler of the world. That is has to be to the most dumb explanation I have ever seen. Paul used the pronoun "I" more than 10 times in all of letters, does that mean he is usurping God? Gee grow up. CAN WE NOW GO ONTO THE NEXT VERSE IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING NEW TO ADD OR IS IT THAT YOU ARE INTERESTED IN ONLY PREACHING AND NOT DISCUSSION Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ nivek ♦ Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Ummm.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Arguing mythology is fun, but what purpose does it serve other than to quench the thirst of those who enjoy studying the intricacies of any book? People argue about Star Trek, Star Wars, Greek Mythology, the Quran, The Wheel of Time, Middle Earth etc. but does finding answers to the questions one asks really conveying any truth other than your ability to explain away these things? What does it matter to me if Lucifer is Satan is the Devil is the serpent in the Garden? It's just a story and I can state with authority that you would be unable to provide adequate evidence to support that it is more than that. You say it the Bible is authored by God, but why should I accept what you say? Truths are not always self-evident, and claiming it is doesn't make it so. You can still provide evidence that 1+1=2. Are you willing to defend your belief that God exists? Are you able to? Can you provide argumentation and specific evidence or are you just a parrot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white_raven23 Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 *Taking DEEEEP breath.* Trying-to-keep-a-cool-head-in-colosseum-trying-to-keep-a-cool-head-in-colosseum-trying-to..... IT'S NOT WORKING!!! I nominate this thread, and any OTHER thread Sub Zero starts without addressing issues that HE REQUESTED within the original Verses Thread.......... TO THE LION'S DEN!! This preacher thinks that he can negate the existence of the original thread as though this is HIS forum. It is not. It is OURS. And anyone who thinks they can dictate, or pick and choose who they are going to DEIGN to respond to by pulling a "oh this thread is cluttered, I'm starting a new one on the EXACT same thing, only NOW I'll just act like all the verses posed in the original thread are magically gone, and won't show up in this one".... is NOT suited for the Colusseum. LION'S DEN!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderbolt Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 sub_zer0 has a history Banned here for the same behavior. And Google his name, same thing pops up all over the place. Sorry zero, you have not given me a reason to consider any further dialogue with you. Not interested in your god or you dogma, and you clearly have a single agenda - I am NOT playing. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy-tiger Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Sub_zer0... You have been shown that Isaiah 14 refers to the King of Babylon. You have been shown EXACTLY what Lucifer means. You have been shown that the intent of Isaiah 14 is to be a taunt to a human king. ISAIAH 14 HAS GOT FUCK-ALL TO DO WITH SATAN! EVERY TIME YOU TRY TO SHOW THAT IT DOES, YOU ARE RE-WRITING THE BIBLE AND ADDING TO GOD'S "PERFECT" WORD! If you wish to propogate the existence of a known falsehood, then remove yourself from this forum and find somewhere that would be happy to accomodate your predelictions. Can I suggest that you try TribulationForces.com? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 I'm going to close this topic, since it has no value and doesn't encourage the ex-Christians on this site. Sorry Sub_Zero, but the subject it sub_standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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