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Speaking of which. I read a quick quote today that millions of native Americans were killed at the hands of CHRISTIAN missionaries because they were pagan in the first century after they “found” America. Don’t know the history of America in that sense, but I don’t have a hard time believing it, since it’s exactly what happened to black Africans when the white Europeans “found” South Africa. Any truth to this, and is the figure a little inflated? I am sure some died at the hand of the “loving” Christians who came to bring the “good” news and to rid America of the heathens, but more than that I would like to hear your thoughts.

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oh yeah, I've read about this Kony guy from my (ultra-religious) nephew. Kony's a real whackjob allright, but the fact that he claims to be a medium is all they need to distance themselves. My nephew claimed the guy was demon possessed and all kinds of "satanic" nonsense like that. I guess anytime someone claims to be a "medium," the religious cases can pull the "witch" card.

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Speaking of which. I read a quick quote today that millions of native Americans were killed at the hands of CHRISTIAN missionaries because they were pagan in the first century after they “found” America. Don’t know the history of America in that sense, but I don’t have a hard time believing it, since it’s exactly what happened to black Africans when the white Europeans “found” South Africa. Any truth to this, and is the figure a little inflated? I am sure some died at the hand of the “loving” Christians who came to bring the “good” news and to rid America of the heathens, but more than that I would like to hear your thoughts.

 

I'm sure the numbers are grossly inflated in this case. Millions of native Americans couldn't have been killed or else there'd have been not enough left to keep their race going.

 

I am all for pointing out the failures of Xianity but I have learned to be a little skeptical when it comes to hearing about how eeevil white Xians are responsible for every bad thing to have ever happened on the face of the earth. I didn't leave Xian fear-mongering and hatred to latch onto another ideology of fear and hatred. One can be sure Xian missionaries did their fair share of religious persecution, but history can be told by - and exaggerated by - anyone.

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I am all for pointing out the failures of Xianity but I have learned to be a little skeptical when it comes to hearing about how eeevil white Xians are responsible for every bad thing to have ever happened on the face of the earth. I didn't leave Xian fear-mongering and hatred to latch onto another ideology of fear and hatred. One can be sure Xian missionaries did their fair share of religious persecution, but history can be told by - and exaggerated by - anyone.

 

VERY true! Smallpox killed a lot more indians than the x-ian missionaries ever did (even though Pat Robertson told them it was God wreaking vengeance because of thier rejecting intelligent design); the Aztecs were killed more for thier gold than any religious reasons (although they may have made up a few to justify it).

 

Both sides inflate or deflate facts (which tend to bevery scant on these matters) according to the cause at hand.

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Speaking of which. I read a quick quote today that millions of native Americans were killed at the hands of CHRISTIAN missionaries because they were pagan in the first century after they “found” America. Don’t know the history of America in that sense, but I don’t have a hard time believing it, since it’s exactly what happened to black Africans when the white Europeans “found” South Africa. Any truth to this, and is the figure a little inflated? I am sure some died at the hand of the “loving” Christians who came to bring the “good” news and to rid America of the heathens, but more than that I would like to hear your thoughts.

 

According to Wikipedia, most of the deaths occured because of disease and relocations/war with the government. But they did offer this little tidbit:

 

American policy toward Native Americans has been an evolving process. In the late nineteenth century, reformers, in efforts to "civilize" Indians, adapted the practice of educating native children in Indian Boarding Schools. These schools, which were primarily run by Christians [1], proved traumatic to Indian children, who were forbidden to speak their native languages, taught Christianity instead of their native religions and in numerous other ways forced to abandon their Indian identity[2] and adopt European-American culture. There are also many documented cases of sexual, physical and mental abuses occurring at these schools

 

So I think the number of "millions" of deaths at the hands of missionaries is grossly exaggerated.

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I am all for pointing out the failures of Xianity but I have learned to be a little skeptical when it comes to hearing about how eeevil white Xians are responsible for every bad thing to have ever happened on the face of the earth. I didn't leave Xian fear-mongering and hatred to latch onto another ideology of fear and hatred. One can be sure Xian missionaries did their fair share of religious persecution, but history can be told by - and exaggerated by - anyone.

 

VERY true! Smallpox killed a lot more indians than the x-ian missionaries ever did (even though Pat Robertson told them it was God wreaking vengeance because of thier rejecting intelligent design); the Aztecs were killed more for thier gold than any religious reasons (although they may have made up a few to justify it).

 

Both sides inflate or deflate facts (which tend to bevery scant on these matters) according to the cause at hand.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox

 

"After first contacts with Europeans and Africans, the death of a large part of the native population of the New World was caused by Old World diseases. Smallpox was the chief culprit. On at least one occasion, germ warfare was attempted by the British Army under Jeffrey Amherst when two smallpox-infected blankets were deliberately given to representatives of the besieging Delaware Indians during Pontiac's Rebellion in 1763. That Amherst intended to spread the disease to the natives is not doubted by historians; whether or not the attempt succeeded is a matter of debate"

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Wolfheart Posted Today, 09:15 AM

 

I am all for pointing out the failures of Xianity but I have learned to be a little skeptical when it comes to hearing about how eeevil white Xians are responsible for every bad thing to have ever happened on the face of the earth. I didn't leave Xian fear-mongering and hatred to latch onto another ideology of fear and hatred. One can be sure Xian missionaries did their fair share of religious persecution, but history can be told by - and exaggerated by - anyone.

 

Hmmm...I find this rather interesting. You sure have been quick to jump on the blame-Muslims-for-everything-train in your other posts. Fear and hatred? HEL-LOO!!

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Here are some good links:

 

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Fascism/Fascism.html

 

and from the same site: http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Fascism/...merFascism.html

 

Dr. James Luther Adams, my ethics professor at Harvard Divinity School , told us that when we were his age, he was then close to 80, we would all be fighting the "Christian fascists."

 

The warning, given to me 25 years ago, came at the moment Pat Robertson and other radio and televangelists began speaking about a new political religion that would direct its efforts at taking control of all institutions, including mainstream denominations and the government. Its stated goal was to use the United States to create a global, Christian empire. It was hard, at the time, to take such fantastic rhetoric seriously, especially given the buffoonish quality of those who expounded it. But Adams warned us against the blindness caused by intellectual snobbery. The Nazis, he said, were not going to return with swastikas and brown shirts. Their ideological inheritors had found a mask for fascism in the pages of the Bible.

 

He was not a man to use the word fascist lightly. He was in Germany in 1935 and 1936 and worked with the underground anti-Nazi church, known as The Confessing Church, led by Dietrich Bonhoeffer. Adams was eventually detained and interrogated by the Gestapo, who suggested he might want to consider returning to the United States . It was a suggestion he followed. He left on a night train with framed portraits of Adolph Hitler placed over the contents inside his suitcase to hide the rolls of home movie film he took of the so-called German Christian Church, which was pro-Nazi, and the few individuals who defied them, including the theologians Karl Barth and Albert Schweitzer. The ruse worked when the border police lifted the top of the suitcases, saw the portraits of the Fuhrer and closed them up again. I watched hours of the grainy black and white films as he narrated in his apartment in Cambridge..........

 

...............All debates with the Christian Right are useless. We cannot reach this movement. It does not want a dialogue. It cares nothing for rational thought and discussion. It is not mollified because John Kerry prays or Jimmy Carter teaches Sunday School. These naive attempts to reach out to a movement bent on our destruction, to prove to them that we too have "values," would be humorous if the stakes were not so deadly. They hate us. They hate the liberal, enlightened world formed by the Constitution. Our opinions do not count.

 

This movement will not stop until we are ruled by Biblical Law, an authoritarian church intrudes in every aspect of our life, women stay at home and rear children, gays agree to be cured, abortion is considered murder, the press and the schools promote "positive" Christian values, the federal government is gutted, war becomes our primary form of communication with the rest of the world and recalcitrant non-believers see their flesh eviscerated at the sound of the Messiah's voice.

 

The spark that could set it ablaze may be lying in the hands of an Islamic terrorist cell, in the hands of the ideological twins of the Christian Right. Another catastrophic terrorist attack could be our Reichstag fire, the excuse used to begin the accelerated dismantling of our open society. The ideology of the Christian Right is not one of love and compassion, the central theme of Christ's message, but of violence and hatred. It has a strong appeal to many in our society, but it is also aided by our complacency. Let us not stand at the open city gates waiting passively and meekly for the barbarians. They are coming. They are slouching rudely towards Bethlehem . Let us, if nothing else, begin to call them by their name.

 

Other pertinent sites:

 

http://www.theocracywatch.org/

 

http://www.jihadwatch.org/

 

"Be sober, be vigilant; for your adversary the" {insane rabid fascist fundie}, "as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour"..... (portion in red cited from 1 Peter 5:8 ~ KJV)

 

K

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