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An Email I Recieved Recently


mako
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I recieved this email from a Christian friend recently. It upset me a little - see what you think:

 

In light of the many jokes we send to one another for a laugh, this is a little different: This is not intended to be a joke, it's not funny, it's intended to get you thinking.

Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson asked her "How God could let something like this Happen?" (regarding Katrina)

 

Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said, "I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives.

 

And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"

 

In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK.

 

Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school . the Bible says thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said OK.

 

Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.

 

Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves

 

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great

deal to do with "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."

 

Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says

 

I answered in this manner:

In the mid to late 1800's and early to mid 1900's, America was a nation that claimed to be a "God-fearing" Christian country. Prayer in the schools was common as was bible recitations and bible reading. The Churches were packed to capacity and Revivals, Camp Meetings and Brush Arbor Meetings were common place. Yet during this time, we had brother killing brother for and against slavery (an institute supported by the Bible), we had the Spanish American War between two Christian nations, we had the eruption of Krakatoa, killing hundreds of thousands with tsunami, hperclaustic winds, etc, shortening the summer of that year to the point that many Christians in America and world-wide starved, we had the Great Earthquake of San Franciso that killed hundreds, the Galveston Hurricane that wiped out Galveston Texas and over 1/2 of its population and the 1928 Hurricane that devastated most of Florida. What is the difference here? Seems that whether or not your blood-thirsty god is allowed in public life or not, he is going to kill, kill, kill and kill some more! It is past the point of us reaping what we sow, no one can do that much wrong...Seems your god just likes to kill and hurt! - Mako :bounce:

p.s. I doubt if he is my friend anymore! :scratch:

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You forgot the Great Blizzar that devastated New York City, killing hundreds (some within sight of churches and cathedrals), World War I and World War II that killed millions of Christians and non-Christians nearly world-wide. Nothing recently can even start to compete with what happened to this nation and Christians back when this was a "god-fearing Christian nation"! - Heimdall :yellow:

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The definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.

 

The definition of what this message espouses is doing the same thing and expecting radically different results.

 

And furthermore, nobody has EVER, EVER, EVEREVEREVEREVEREVER, banned reading the Bible in public schools. Nobody, ever, EVER. I want to fucking punch the people who espouse that bullshit idea.

 

And another thing, Billy Graham and all his hatemonger ilk can disappear from the face of the earth for all I care. They hold no credibility.

 

(By the way, you talk about people "killing for and against slavery", but that, technically, wasn't the reason most people fought in the Civil War. Confederates fought mostly because they believed that states' rights trump the federal government in all cases, while Union men fought to keep the Union from splitting. Few actually fought because of slavery itself.

 

Yeah, I been reading books.)

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What is the difference here? Seems that whether or not your blood-thirsty god is allowed in public life or not, he is going to kill, kill, kill and kill some more! It is past the point of us reaping what we sow, no one can do that much wrong...Seems your god just likes to kill and hurt! - Mako :bounce:

p.s. I doubt if he is my friend anymore! :scratch:

I think maybe calling his diety blood-thirsty may have had a negative reaction. But what the hell, isn't that his idea of the sacrifice of Jesus was all about, appeasing a god with blood?

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p.s. I doubt if he is my friend anymore! :scratch:

 

:) Mako, it's a shame that he probably won't be your friend any more. If there is anything that could really start to make a difference in fundamentalist mentalities, is their beliefs in what an afterlife is holding for them and us, IMO. People who believe in a literal eternal hell are prisoners of this rigid mentality for fear of the repercussion of leaving it! Your ideas may frighten your friend, however, justly stated. Of course your friend and others don't realize they are in an eternal hell right now, to be living their lives in such intense and constant fear! *sigh*

 

Now, perhaps we could consider if there is a baby in the incredibly dirty bathwater? Change is usually done one step at a time. I think it would be good to start schools with a positive saying every day... that is what prayer was suppose to do. If it came from ALL sources, including Madeline O'Hare, Buddha, Confuscious, Suffis, Plato, Forbes, Chopra, Dyer, whatever, it could have a positive effect. I think if we can foster understanding between all beliefs and perspectives, in a respectful manner, then maybe people will see that there are meaningful ideas in other forms than just one book... and maybe these insights of these other philosophies could be even more helpful in changing people's rational thinking. :shrug:

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And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"

 

Yeah, I read this and thought, "So bad things never happened before?"

 

It's not even consistent. These folks act like if the country "goes back to God," then we'll be protected -- but bad things like September 11 happen when we're ungodly!! :nono: BUT Christians also say that being a Christian doesn't mean bad things won't happen to you. Like... "God will protect you if you turn to him! But he'll still let bad stuff happen to you!"

 

In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK.

 

omg...

 

Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves

 

IT'S BECAUSE WE DIDN'T SPANK THEM!! USING THE FAMILY BIBLE!!!1

 

Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell.

 

I'm not sure what their point is here either. They seem to be implying that God's wrath is the reason for disasters in the world.

 

...

 

:shrug: Forget it, I'm getting mixed up...

 

Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says

 

(or just believe everything)

 

I answered in this manner:

 

That was a good response.

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Just to let you know, this IS a chain letter, and an old oft-debunked one at that. You might just have been bcc'd it unthinkingly.

 

Hope that either the friendship mends or it shows itself not worth mending.

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Just to let you know, this IS a chain letter, and an old oft-debunked one at that. You might just have been bcc'd it unthinkingly.

 

Hope that either the friendship mends or it shows itself not worth mending.

 

Yeah, I've seen examples of this chain letter before the Katrina disaster. I can't remember what event it was originally claimed to be in response to; maybe the 9/11 attack? In any case, this just shows once again how many Christians spread info around that they haven't even checked for veracity. Check and see if it's on snopes.com.

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Guest Pontius Pilate

I agree wth what Mako did. When confronted by unknowing or intentional propaganda, it is your responsibility to set the true facts on the matter. If this destroys a friendship, well, the sender didn't consider that when they sent the missive. I always send the "correction" to the sender, anyone he addressed and the entire group of senders that relayed it to him. I am not a very popular person among the religious, but who really cares.

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  • 2 weeks later...

p.s. I doubt if he is my friend anymore! :scratch:

 

If he is no longer your friend, then he was never your true friend to begin with... so don't sweat it. It is better to have no friends than to have false ones. You don't need him. I am sure you have other friends who wouldn't just walk after you voiced your opinion. :vent:

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``Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says ``

 

Funny how a president and his army general get electedo n the backs of god-entrenched people and their leaders decide to funnel money out of the project for averting such a crisis into their holy war. Funny how she`s never been black, poor, and possibly not ev en set foot in New Orleans. Funny how she`s never had to stay behind in an evacution because she lacks the funds to leave town. Funny how she`s never been in a disaster zone and surrounded by dirty people wading in chemical -shit water waiting in line for a bus and some food and had to stand back by well fed, dressed people of another color from a nearby hotel get to step onto a bus before she does.

 

Funny. Yes, we are pretty funny.

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Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.

 

Oh, Heaven FORBID we don't smack our children around!! I know I'm a better person because my dad let me have it. Why, just three stays in a mental hospital since I was twelve, and I think there might be a fairly good chance I could be happy one day! Assholes.

 

And it wasn't Dr. Spock's son, it was his grandson as a young man, and nobody knows why. Oh, and (courtesy of snopes.com):

 

An ironic twist to this legend is that it is true about a psychologist who advocated a child-rearing approach diametrically opposed to the one Dr. Spock would later champion:

 

By the late 1920s, John B. Watson, the notably harsh but popular behavioral psychologist, combined rigorous views on child care with a dire estimation of the dangers of maternal affection. "Mother love is a dangerous instrument. An instrument which may inflict a never healing wound . . . which may make infancy unhappy, adolescence a nightmare, an instrument which may wreck your adult son or daughter's vocational future and their chances for marital happiness." Parents were advised to "never hug or kiss [their children]. Never let them sit on your lap. If you must, kiss them once on the forehead when you say goodnight."

Watson's son, William, committed suicide at age 40. (A similar but apocryphal tale is attached to the child of another behavioralist, B. F. Skinner.)

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