garrisonjj Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibby Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Abslutely. Thats the problem with a personal god. Ultimately the responsibility is his. Christians say he is sovereign (which basically means, he can do what the hell he likes). This puts us in a position of fear. We either aquiesce to his whims or we don,t and are punished. Such a being would be un worthy of any respect. And those that do come under his reign become self righteous. Thankfully no such god exists, it is a fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Garrison, the thing is you don't have to be punished or redeem for anything anymore. I sense you are struggling on that line between xian and ex-xian. Be patient with yourself but honestly, you are not being punished or having to redeem yourself for anything. Yes, it is ironic that most xians don't realize the fact that if God was all powerful, all inclusive, that he could have wiped away all sin with a blink. Someone told me of the bible verse, Isaiah 45/7 Where it says, "I created evil." Supposedly this is a direct quote from God. Therefore, God - even in the bible - fesses up to creating evil in the world. As for Hell. Hell is right here. Hell is a preception not a place. You can chose to be in Hell or Heaven by merely changing your mindset. Personally, I see where most non-xians I know have more heavenly (aka happy) existences - but most of the xians I know constantly live in Hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Precisely - this is one of my biggest problems with Xianity, as well as any religion that posits an all-knowing, all-powerful god, all-good god. Now, common sense tells you that if you were a being like that, you'd know what would cause the ruin of all your hard work ahead of time. You certainly would choose to remove that which would ruin everything rather than let it go its merry way and have a mess to clean up afterwards, right? Right! The god posited by Xianity, et al, cannot possibly exist. The creator of this universe cannot be those things, since to be all-knowing and all-good and all-powerful means a god who would have made a utopia for us. Yet they'd have us believe that their god made everything, knows all and is infinitely good, yet just let the devil do what he wanted, lifts not one holy finger to stop it, and furthermore gets mad at us for being led astray by the being Yahweh knew would lead us astray! That's a moron, not a god, and certainly not a god I will give credence to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Evil isn't a thing, der! Evil is the absence of Good. Of course the Garden was a set up, he was testing Adam. My observation is that you are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Evil isn't a thing, der! Evil is the absence of Good. Of course the Garden was a set up, he was testing Adam. My observation is that you are wrong. Asimov, if he was setting up Adam, then how come he didn't serverely punish Adam when he lied and blamed everything on Eve? Eve bore the brunt of that nastiness in the garden, so why didn't Adam get punished just as serverely? So the snake was a plant to bring about evil? So if the bible is true, then God set the two of them up for his own sick, saddistic and twisted sense of humor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted March 13, 2006 Share Posted March 13, 2006 Asimov, if he was setting up Adam, then how come he didn't serverely punish Adam when he lied and blamed everything on Eve? Eve bore the brunt of that nastiness in the garden, so why didn't Adam get punished just as serverely? He did severely punish Adam. 1) He has to work the soil all day. 2) He has to put up with his bitch. 3) He's banished from the garden. So the snake was a plant to bring about evil? So if the bible is true, then God set the two of them up for his own sick, saddistic and twisted sense of humor? So? He's god, he can do whatever the fuck he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 13, 2006 Share Posted March 13, 2006 Asimov, if he was setting up Adam, then how come he didn't serverely punish Adam when he lied and blamed everything on Eve? Eve bore the brunt of that nastiness in the garden, so why didn't Adam get punished just as serverely? He did severely punish Adam. 1) He has to work the soil all day. 2) He has to put up with his bitch. 3) He's banished from the garden. So the snake was a plant to bring about evil? So if the bible is true, then God set the two of them up for his own sick, saddistic and twisted sense of humor? So? He's god, he can do whatever the fuck he wants. He was one sick fuck, wasn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHEMtron Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks funny things: -the king james bible says [in isaiah 45:7] that god created evil. of course the new translations replace evil with calamity so apologists say that god did not create evil and that the source of evil is satan. but satan is a fallen angel who was created by god, god created the angels, so god still created evil. you cant create something unless it's in you. -how retarded is it to make man when you KNOW he's gonna disobey you, so you punish all his offspring for disobeying. but because you know you made a mistake and feel bad later on, you decide to make yourself human so you could sacrifice your human self to your heavenly self. you didnt feel that bad for making the mistake, so the offspring are still doomed for eternal punishment unless they worship the fact that you sacrificed your human self to heavenly self. the whole thing with adam and eve was like the ultimate entrapment right there. -doctrine of original sin is retarded. we all know Ezek. 18:20 states that the son will not bear the sins of the father. -hell doesnt exist. satan isnt in there either. from a business standpoint, if i were to get people to not follow walt disney, or to try to lure them from going to any disney theme park, i would make a bigger, better, and a more enticing theme park... one where you can actually drink alcohol on the rides =D. if satan and lucifer wanted people to not follow god, they wouldve promised a better place than heaven... not a fiery pit of eternal torment. what is heaven anyway? if in heaven i have to act like how fundies act here.... where there's no sex, free thought, drinking, censorship, prejudices against other races, thoughts, sexual preference, etc. etc. etc. than daaaamn.... that's actually HELL for me!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted March 15, 2006 Share Posted March 15, 2006 If God created everything,,,,,,he certainly created evil. The garden was a set up since he knew what Adam would do ahead of time. Therefore, original sin is a farce and we are all being punished and redeemed for nothing? With a blink he could have done away with evil,,,,,therefore no hell can exist. Observations? Thanks Maltheism (Wikipedia definition) 'nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spamandham Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 The next time someone talks about the sin of adam and eve, remind them that tempting someone is also a sin, and so adam and eve were not the source of the fall of creation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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