Help! What to say to kids against a fundamentalist

[Mothernature]

Help I don't know what to say to my kids. They are asking about death and heaven and my husband is telling them nonsense from the Bible. They are all excited b/c heaven is made of gold. And b/c they go to heaven and then come back to earth again in human form just like they are today. He makes it sound so exciting to them that they are happy to think about dying. They are too little to really understand so I can't explain about the history of the Bible and they don't have the patience to listen to an explanation. And my little one is so excited to tell me what he knows. How do I handle this? I need to engage them but think this is all nonsense. They want me to be proud when they show me pictures they've made or tell me that they prayed for me or that Jesus died for us and rose again. I want to dismiss it but that would be like dismissing them and I can't do that. How do you handle this??? The whole situation makes me cry and makes me angry and anxious. I just hate it. If I tell them these are just stories made up they either don't believe me or my husband will get angry and I don't want to have a shouting match in front of the kids. Suggestions on how I can cope with this please as I feel like I'm losing it and I can't keep crying every night. My husband is so sure of everything and so has that confidence which gives him credibility. If I say things like no one knows what happens when we die and I don't have concrete answers, then I lose credibility and they just go to him for answers. This really sucks. Any ideas?

[Insightful]

I'm sorry!  That's a tough one for sure.  We're the reverse - I, the dad, am the agnostic.  My wife is the evangelical.  Thankfully, she's not super big into indoctrinating our 2 girls, but she does give Christian answers... And Christian school is definitely shaping their worldview.

 

I would focus less on the details of what they believe right now- even though it is frustrating to not correct it at this point...  Instead,I would do 2 things:

1)  teach them critical thinking skills.  Encourage questions.  Make sure they grow up with a great sense of logic and a good understanding of science and reason.  At least this way they have tools to help them evaluate truth claims down the road.  Of course it stinks that they are already being indoctrinated so young...

2) show yourself to be calm rational humble and trustworthy.  When you show charity toward the views of others and display open-mindedness and acceptance you lay a great foundation for them.

 

If they grow up with both of these: a heart that views all people with compassion and acceptance along with solid logic and critical thinking they will have a very difficult time sustaining belief in hell...  I don't know about you but I worry more about the doctrine of hell for my children than I do heaven. I'd be more than happy if they grew up universalists...

 

All the best.

[midniterider]

3 hours ago, Mothernature said:

Help I don't know what to say to my kids. They are asking about death and heaven and my husband is telling them nonsense from the Bible. They are all excited b/c heaven is made of gold. And b/c they go to heaven and then come back to earth again in human form just like they are today. He makes it sound so exciting to them that they are happy to think about dying. They are too little to really understand so I can't explain about the history of the Bible and they don't have the patience to listen to an explanation. And my little one is so excited to tell me what he knows. How do I handle this? I need to engage them but think this is all nonsense. They want me to be proud when they show me pictures they've made or tell me that they prayed for me or that Jesus died for us and rose again. I want to dismiss it but that would be like dismissing them and I can't do that. How do you handle this??? The whole situation makes me cry and makes me angry and anxious. I just hate it. If I tell them these are just stories made up they either don't believe me or my husband will get angry and I don't want to have a shouting match in front of the kids. Suggestions on how I can cope with this please as I feel like I'm losing it and I can't keep crying every night. My husband is so sure of everything and so has that confidence which gives him credibility. If I say things like no one knows what happens when we die and I don't have concrete answers, then I lose credibility and they just go to him for answers. This really sucks. Any ideas?

 

"That's nice that you know what happens when people die...but that's so far off in the future. Lets talk about what's going on now. Here's a cool puzzle to figure out. Here's a chemistry set. Here's a cool [something your child likes that will require the use of their brain].

 

"Always think about what you're told and ask questions if it doesnt make sense."

 

...

 

The kids will emulate Mom and Dad. If Mom is an advocate for thinking, reason, and questioning everything ... God gave us all a brain to think with,  right? .... then their religious upbringing will suffer. If your kids are at the age of magical thinking ,  just keep being Mom and see what happens when they hit puberty and start questioning all of Mom and Dad's ideas as teenagers. 

 

 

[mymistake]

Hello and welcome!

 

Have your kids figured out that Santa Claus isn't real?  You said they are young so I'm thinking they haven't yet.  Kids go through stages.  Early on they believe in magic.  Then somewhere around 8 to 12 they figure out that magic stuff they use to believe in is all wishful thinking.  That is when things will change.  How often do your kids go to church?  That is a big factor.

 

 

Let me tell you about my situation.  I was crazy for Jesus.  I married a Christian.  We had two children.  I woke up around the time my second child was born but it took me a while to realize I had to get out of church.  We stopped going to church when my daughter was 2 and my son was 8.  He was a Christian at age 8 and knew all the Bible stories.  I worked with both my kids.  By age 10 my son told me he still believes in God but he thinks God is a wizard.  By 12 my son was an atheist.  By 7 my daughter was an atheist.  I've taught them both to keep their views on religion to themselves as a form of self-defense.  At age 8 my daughter is a critical thinker who can spot nonsense a mile away.  Time is on your side.

 

Undermining religious indoctrination is both fun and easy.  The more difficult task is convincing your spouse to stop taking the family to church without getting them angry.

 

 

 

[florduh]

Many of us grew up in religious wacko families and survived childhood indoctrination. Along with maturity will come questions and eventually people make up their own minds.

 

In the mean time, I would remind the other co-parent that there are many options and not everyone shares his particular beliefs and he needs to lighten up on the indoctrination of little people who trust him. Tell the kids the truth, that people have different ideas about things like death, Heaven and so forth, and nobody really knows the answers but we must respect daddy's beliefs.

 

 

[mymistake]

Games for deprograming kids:

 

Phase 1

If your kids watch Sesame Street during the Elmo era you might notice a segment called "Mr. Noodle" where an adult tries to carry out simple task but kids have to tell him how to do it right.  I try to implement something similar when my daughter was young.  Call it phase 1.  A simple game.  Have a silly expression on your face and interact with your child by doing things wrong or saying things very wrong and let your kids tell you how to do or say it right.  This sets the kids up thinking at an early age.  And it also sets up a family game you can play for years.

 

Phase 2

When your kids know the game well, that it they understand that they have to tell you the right way and figure out what you are doing wrong, then it is time to add more.  I wouldn't try Phase 2 out on kids younger than kindergarten age.  Slowly add to the game a silly claim that you have magic powers.  Do it only occasionally at first until they catch on.  Ideally they should realize it's just you being wrong again and they need to tell you what you got wrong.  For example when my daughter couldn't find her toy but then later found it I would tell her that "I found it for you by using my magic powers".  Or I might say "If I want to I can fly around the room using magic . . . but I just don't want to do it".  It should just fit right in there with the rest of your game time.  You want the transition to be nice and smooth.

 

Phase 3

After a few months or years,  add more advanced concepts involving claims of your magic.  "Did you know that I created the whole world using magic?"  By now the kids should know it's a joke and a fun game.  At this stage you will need to start teaching your kids to respect the religious beliefs of other people because you don't want others figuring out what is going on.

 

Phase 4

After a few months or years start slipping "miracle powers" in place of "magic powers".   Also teach your kids to keep religious beliefs to themselves.  That will protect them from backlash.

 

Phase 5

You can only go here when your kids are old enough to have non-magical thinking.  It should be the age when most kids figure out Santa isn't real.  Go back to talking about magic powers instead of miracles but start introducing real apologetics into your game.  "You can't know what happened because you were not there."  "You can't prove I don't have magic powers."  Keep it part of the game and the kids will instinctively know you are wrong and the object of the game is they are suppose to figure out how and why you are wrong.  "I must have magic powers because believing in my own powers makes me happy".  Start with simple apologetics and work your way slowly into the complex stuff.  "I created the Earth last Thursday and you can tell by just looking at it that I created it."

 

 

[Lucy]

Don't act like you aren't confident. Just ask them questions to make them think. If he acts confident and you act uncertain, they will see that as evidence that he is right. Most children and even adults prefer to go with whoever seems more confident regardless of who is actually correct. Maybe tell them about other afterlife beliefs from other cultures. They might be just as excited hearing about Valhalla. Make them aware that there have been many beliefs with many believers all absolutely certain that their version of heaven is real. If your husband is so sure his religion is true, he shouldn't be bothered that his children are thinking about it. Surely his god would prefer the children to choose after thinking it over rather than blindly believing whoever acts the most confident.

 

Really and truly it probably won't matter much what they believe at this age. If they are just now learning about heaven it sounds like they are very young. They should eventually start questioning it on their own.

[Mothernature]

Thanks everyone for your comments and reassurance. I feel somewhat better about it now. I really do appreciate hearing your experiences and there are some great ideas here that I will put to use in this battle.The kids do still believe in Santa and magic so I shouldn't be too concerned yet. Although my husband himself has turned into a fundamentalist we go to a Catholic church as that is his background so regularly we just go on Sundays. He wants the kids to be more involved as they get older. I'm hoping to stop going altogether but feel like I can't yet. I would rather them go to the Catholic church which so far is not pushing the doctrine of hell rather than the crazy fundamentalist churches and if I stop going then he could take them anywhere!  I often wonder if it's better for them to go to church as kids, as they might rebel as teenagers like midniterider said and turn away from religion at that time. I guess part of it is the stage I am in too, still full of anger so I hate hearing people talk about Christianity. And my husband will not respect other beliefs so that is tough. He is more than 100% convinced of his beliefs and feels he has to teach them to his kids. It's like he feels it's his duty. I've been starting to point out that different people have different beliefs but in their eyes their Dad is right about everything. It drives me crazy. Anyway thanks for the feedback and help in bringing me back from my panicked state.