Jeydid Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 I read an article this morning that stated that all atheists believe that humans are the product of random chance, and that humans are therefore not special in any way. This article went on to state that all atheists feel that the ultimate end of things will be when the sun burns out and dies, that all life will end and there is no point to any of it. It also said that atheists felt they knew absolutely everything there was to know about the universe. The full article can be found here: http://www.annistonstar.com/opinion/2006/a...t-6c10r4137.htm The conclusions the author of the article reached about what constitutes an atheist worldview border on absurd. First, there very well may be atheists that feel his nihilistic view is the correct one, but there are many who would not agree at all. This is because there is no such thing as an “atheistic worldview”. To start with atheism in and of itself can be defined several ways. It can mean someone who feels that there is no evidence to support the idea of a deity and withholds their belief until such evidence is presented. This simple lack of belief is often referred to as weak atheism. It can also mean someone who positively claims there are no gods. This positive claim that no god whatsoever exists is generally called strong atheism. There are many shades of gray in-between. For instance, a person could be considered a weak atheist in a general sense as to the larger question of if any sort of higher power at all might exist somewhere in the universe, and yet be considered a strong atheist about specific god-claims they have encountered. A Christian in this case would be a strong atheist in reference to Zeus for example. Lumping everyone who labels themselves an atheist into the strong atheist category on every possible god claim is a bit of a leap, as most atheists understand that positive claims require proof, and proving that absolutely no higher power that could be reasonably called god exists anywhere at anytime is currently impossible. Therefore you do not need to know “absolutely everything about the universe” to be an atheist despite theists frequent claims to the contrary. Also, you do not need “faith” to be an atheist in the sense theists often claim that one does. Faith might be reasonably defined as believing in something without evidence or in the face of contrary evidence. I don’t believe that invisible elves live under my bed. I do not need “faith” to hold that belief. Since there is not one sort of atheist, and the word atheism applies only to lack of belief in a god, one could not say there is anything approaching a single atheist worldview. That being said, and with the understanding that I cannot personally speak for every atheist, I will address the question of if I as an atheist can live a happy, purposeful, meaningful life. I accept that humans evolved into what they currently are and that we as a race are a product of random chance and evolutionary pressures. Does that mean I don’t think the human race is special? Not really no. I think that it is utterly amazing that we have come as far as we have. I don’t think something has to be specifically created to be special. The world and the universe as a whole is full of amazing, beautiful things and creatures. The fact that these things were not designed just for me doesn’t make my appreciation of them any less. I look at nature and I am in awe. So much of that awe comes from knowing how these things function, and understanding the just how fragile and precariously balanced it all is. There are so many times in the history of mankind where we came very close to not being here at all. How could I knowing that not feel that humans are special? We had the intelligence and stamina to remain alive and flourish despite so many obstacles. We humans are amazing, however, we aren’t any more important to the universe than anything else. The universe isn’t here because of us, we are here because of the universe. I also think that eventually the universe may collapse back on itself, ending all life in the universe. It very well may not do that, I can’t be certain. Either way that doesn’t render my existence meaningless. Saying that the future negative outcome renders the present meaningless is like saying you won’t enjoy your day off simply because you know you have to go back to work eventually. I won’t be here for whatever happens down the road in a few million years. I won’t be here for what happens down the road in a few hundred years either. Does this mean I shouldn’t care what happens? No. Just because theists know that people will die eventually they don’t go around not caring about them, or killing them to get them off to heaven sooner. (Well they don’t do so generally speaking at this point in time.) People care about other people. It is our nature to feel things. Just as knowing people will die doesn’t stop others from caring about them, knowing the earth will die eventually doesn’t stop me from caring about it. Between now and the end of the human race there will likely be billions and billions of people who will be born, live and die. Just because I personally won’t witness their existence, or because eventually the human line will end doesn’t relieve me of my ethical obligations, or of my feelings. I also think that our personalities cease to exist when we die. That does not make me more inclined to think that there is no purpose in my life. It seems to me that believing that this life is some sort of way-station between before you are born and this perfect existence you look forward to after death would truly rob life of it’s joy and meaning. I feel that my purpose in life is to leave the world a better place than it was when I came into it. Each of us only has one life, one brief eye blink of existence, so I think I am obligated to do what I can to make that existence as pleasant as possible for everyone. To do my part to ensure the human race continues to exist after I cease to. The fact that eventually life might end doesn’t negate any of that, because I don’t consider human suffering to be unimportant or impossible to reduce. My caring about those around me gives me meaning and purpose in my life. The fact that it is a meaning an purpose that I chose instead of one I was assigned by an imaginary friend does not make it less fulfilling to me in anyway. Imagine if throughout history all the time humans have spent in worship had been instead dedicated to improving the lot of all mankind. Imagine if every dollar that had gone to a church had gone instead to scientific research, or to feeding the hungry, or housing the homeless. Imagine if every war that was fought with a god’s name as a rallying cry, had never happened. Imagine if all the knowledge religions have destroyed or suppressed were freely available. Imagine if all the effort spent in “proving” a god’s existence had instead been put forth to improve the lot of mankind. What sort of world would we live in now? As an atheist I live a meaningful, happy life. I get out of bed everyday feeling lucky and grateful that I am alive. Just like anyone else I have good days and bad days, but that doesn’t change my love of life. It is all the more valuable because I know it is not something I will have forever. I try everyday to make someone else’s life a bit better and brighter, and I do it without telling them that it will all be better after they are dead. The future is uncertain, but not trying to make it the future as good as it can be only ensures that it will be worse. The here and now is not made meaningless by what might be. The future points that will become the present are not made meaningless by the future that might happen after they do. I can only express my sincere wish that theists realize that as well and start as individuals to make a real, material, meaningful improvement in the human condition. --Jeydid "The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion." -Thomas Paine (1737 - 1809) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 I hate this idea that the lack of an afterlife suddenly invalidates any meaning in the present. Why not appreciate things in life for their own merit in the present rather than for their supposed eternal significance? I bet that guy who wrote that article has never even talked to an atheist in his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 "Can Atheists Have Happy, Meaningful Lives?" My answer is yes, because I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeydid Posted March 26, 2006 Author Share Posted March 26, 2006 "Can Atheists Have Happy, Meaningful Lives?" My answer is yes, because I do. Well, that was alot less wordy than my answer, but I am glad I am not the only one to find being an atheist in no way interferes with my happiness. If anything being an atheist has made me a happier, kinder, more considerate person. --Jeydid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 Amen to that! I do want to think too that I'm a more considerate and empathetic person now than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyby Stardancer Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 Heh. I'm agnostic, not atheist, but... On the flight back to school at the end of spring break, I got talking to the two girls in my row (both were Christian), and when I revealed that I was agnostic, she asked me what I lived for. My reply was that I lived for my family, my friends, and the things I enjoy doing. I sure hope I gave her something to think about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Carrion Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 Nah, we're all nihilistic, directionless no-hopers crawling on our bellies in the dirt of our own ignorance of THE ONE TRUE GAAAAAAWWWWD! (smell the sarcasm, traditional English blend) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 some people are just simple period. its one psuedo-philosopher trying to prove how smart he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 I'm not an Atheist, but I don't see why they'd have to be miserable just because they don't believe in Jesus. Hell, Atheism is more happy-making than Xianity for that one simple reason. I'd much rather believe I had no soul than believe Jesus was going to burn me forever for the slightest slip-up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waynus Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 I don't see a difference. The Christian believes in a God of human invention, and draws meaning from a fictional story they tell themselves. The athiest tells themselves a story about life and draws meaning from that. I guess the big difference is that the Christian doesn't know it's a story. Sad really because how can you rewrite the story if you don't like how it's going, if you don't know it's a story? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrayman7040 Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 I just get so fucking pissed when Christian Neysayers pop in and say without Jesus and the hope of an afterlife our lives are meaningless. Let me make a quick list of things that give this 43 year old's life meaning: The satifaction of a hard days work A vacation after many weeks of hard work Making love to the wife Seeing your very unatheletic 11 year old daughter score a basket on her youth basketball team Having your 16 year old son bring his C- in Geometry up to an A Appreciating my parents for allowing me to think for myself Curling up on the couch and watching a movie with just my wife or the whole family Getting together with good friends Spening time on my compter enlighting myself. Coming up with a great new sexual manouver after being with the same woman for almost 25 years Yea I think my life has plenty of meaning without religion. When I die, it will be a badly needed rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 This thread really got me thinking about this -- "It takes a lot of guts to live a happy life -- just as many as to be an atheist..." So why wouldn't atheists have a wonderful and rich life? I would question it more when they didn't... wouldn't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeydid Posted March 29, 2006 Author Share Posted March 29, 2006 This thread really got me thinking about this -- "It takes a lot of guts to live a happy life -- just as many as to be an atheist..." So why wouldn't atheists have a wonderful and rich life? I would question it more when they didn't... wouldn't you? Now that you mention it, I don't think I know any bitterly miserable atheists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrmarlin Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 This thread really got me thinking about this -- "It takes a lot of guts to live a happy life -- just as many as to be an atheist..." So why wouldn't atheists have a wonderful and rich life? I would question it more when they didn't... wouldn't you? Now that you mention it, I don't think I know any bitterly miserable atheists. That's because they're not carrying around all the guilt and the excess baggage that comes with it. Also, they don't have to live up to some idea or appearance. They are just free to be whatever they want to be. They don't have cannonballs weighing them down. Having a happy life -- or chosing to being happy is a choice, and its a choice that takes a lot of guts. Usually when someone is involved in Xianity, they look to others to make their choices for them. Thus creating the self fulfilling prophecy of "perseuction." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asimov Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I can't live a happy meaningful lives until agnostics all become atheists....oh yea, and I hate myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted April 2, 2006 Share Posted April 2, 2006 I can't live a happy meaningful lives until agnostics all become atheists....oh yea, and I hate myself. JESUS CHRIST, don't you have a cross to go hang yourself on er somethin?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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